Confused about registering/naming buck

mammabooh · #1 09/15/12, 04:04 PM

I am trying to get the transfer/registration paper filled out for my little buck, Artie. On page 34 of this year's guidebook (ADGA), #2 says that the herd name of the breeder needs to be the first part of the name. Then, #4 says that care must be taken to avoid using another person's herd name as part of the chosen name. So, which is it?

The herd name that I bought the buckling from (they owned the dam) is Ivy Eaters. The sire (South Fork TS Colorado) is owned by someone else (I don't know their herd name, but I would imagine that I can find out). I have the service memo.

My herd name is Pear Creek Acres. I want his name to be Artemus, but I have no idea what needs to preface that part. Any help for me?

Alice In TX/MO · #2 09/15/12, 04:26 PM

Ivy Eaters Artemus. I think.

CaliannG · #3 09/15/12, 04:28 PM

If he was born on their property, out of a doe owned by them, then you use their herd name as the preface.

If you own the dam at the time of kidding, then you use your herd name.

A good rule of thumb is that whomever owns the doe at the time she drops the kids, that is whose herd name goes on the kid's registration papers.

rootsandwings · #4 09/15/12, 04:40 PM

it's my understanding that the owner of the dam at the time of the breeding provides the herd name, as they have selected the genetics.

which would make alice correct.

the "care should be taken" means you should not name his son "Pear Creek Acres Ivy Eaters jr"

mammabooh · #5 09/15/12, 04:49 PM

Does he HAVE to have the other herd name included...can I put the South Fork in there too? How about Ivy Eaters SFTS Col. Artemus? (the "SFTS Col." stands for "South Fork Toi Soldier Colorado"). Would that be a no-no...or just dumb and weird?

coso · #6 09/15/12, 05:09 PM

That name should work fine. It is the herd name where the doe was bred, that you have to use. If he was born on your farm you have to use your tattoo. If not they should have tattoed him. I use bucks initials in all my names.

CaliannG · #7 09/15/12, 05:13 PM

The way it generally works is you can do the bucks full initials.

I own IDGRC Yaiza. I breed her A.I. to Pearl Valley Yreka's Legacy. My herd name is Arbre Sage. I get a buckling out of the breeding. So I decide to name the buckling "Arbre Sage PVYL Stinky".

But say I buy him from IDGRC instead, and it is the same breeding, and Scott doesn't want to fiddle with names so he just gives me the transfer paper. In that case, if I want to go with the same name, it would be "IDGRC PVYL Stinky".

Now, say I want to put the doe's lines in there too, if I own the doe and planned the breeding. Then it might be "Arbre Sage IDGRCY PVYL Stinky".

What I CANNOT do, in any of those cases, is name him "Arbre Sage Pearl Valley Stinky".

Is it making more sense? Or did I just confuse you more?

JBarGFarmKeeper · #8 09/15/12, 05:53 PM

To add to the confusion, Chris is correct, in that, if you buy a bred doe and she kids on your farm. The kids will have the owner of the doe (at the time of breeding)'s herd name and YOUR tattoo. The tattoo ALWAYS goes with the farm where the kids are born.

yet?

mammabooh · #9 09/15/12, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coso

That name should work fine. It is the herd name where the doe was bred, that you have to use. If he was born on your farm you have to use your tattoo. If not they should have tattoed him. I use bucks initials in all my names.

They didn't tattoo him, so what do I do about that?

JBarGFarmKeeper · #10 09/15/12, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mammabooh

They didn't tattoo him, so what do I do about that?

Do they know how to tattoo? If so, and it's not far, make them do it. If you know how, have the stuff, and are willing, ask them if you can do it.

mammabooh · #11 09/15/12, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBarGFarmKeeper

Do they know how to tattoo? If so, and it's not far, make them do it. If you know how, have the stuff, and are willing, ask them if you can do it.

It's a 3 1/2-hour trip back to their place. I bought a tattoo kit, but I haven't used it yet...I've never witnessed one being done either. The breeder I got my girls from will probably be here within the next few weeks, so maybe I can have her train me.

It needs to be with their herd tattoo letters, right?

JBarGFarmKeeper · #12 09/15/12, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mammabooh

It's a 3 1/2-hour trip back to their place. I bought a tattoo kit, but I haven't used it yet...I've never witnessed one being done either. The breeder I got my girls from will probably be here within the next few weeks, so maybe I can have her train me.

It needs to be with their herd tattoo letters, right?

Yes, didn't they fill out the application? and sign it? I can't tell you how many signatures I have chased through the years due to my own negligence in NOT checking.

coso · #13 09/15/12, 07:27 PM

If they gave you application papers, they should have put his tattoo info on there. If they gave you registration papers the tattoo info will be on there. Ideally they should have tattooed him before he left their farm. But you can do it, if you have the correct letters for their tattoo.

mammabooh · #14 09/15/12, 07:36 PM

They filled out the registration and signed it, but they didn't fill out the tattoo part.

So, I just need to find out what their tattoo info is, correct?

coso · #15 09/15/12, 09:20 PM

Yep

luvzmybabz · #16 09/15/12, 10:57 PM

The only time this would be different would be in case of lease, where you leased the doe and bred it on your property.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliannG

If he was born on their property, out of a doe owned by them, then you use their herd name as the preface.

If you own the dam at the time of kidding, then you use your herd name.

A good rule of thumb is that whomever owns the doe at the time she drops the kids, that is whose herd name goes on the kid's registration papers.

chamoisee · #17 09/15/12, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rootsandwings

it's my understanding that the owner of the dam at the time of the breeding provides the herd name, as they have selected the genetics.

^this^ These are the ADGA rules. The kid carries the herd name of the doe's owner at the time of the breeding. This is actually better IMHO because it takes awhile for one's herd name to develop a good reputation, so if you buy a pregnant doe from a good herd, her kids will have more value than if they are bred on your place and it also looks better on the pedigree....assuming she came from a well known, reputable breeder.

Quote:

the "care should be taken" means you should not name his son "Pear Creek Acres Ivy Eaters jr"

My understanding is that you don't want to use an unrelated herd name as part of your goat's name, or even something that sounds a lot like someone else's herdname. For example, I cannot name a goat "Wisdom's Way Hilly Redwood"...this is way too close to the Redwood Hills herd name.

mammabooh · #18 09/16/12, 10:33 AM

I haven't contacted them about this yet, but what happens if they don't have a reserved tattoo ID? These people just have goats for their girls to show in 4H...one girl has my boys' dam, and one girl has a Nigerian Dwarf doe.

JBarGFarmKeeper · #19 09/16/12, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mammabooh

I haven't contacted them about this yet, but what happens if they don't have a reserved tattoo ID? These people just have goats for their girls to show in 4H...one girl has my boys' dam, and one girl has a Nigerian Dwarf doe.

If not, contact ADGA and they will tell you what to put there.

mammabooh · #20 09/16/12, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBarGFarmKeeper

If not, contact ADGA and they will tell you what to put there.

That's what I figure I'll have to do. I just send an e-mail to the lady I got the boys from, but I would imagine they don't have an ID since they didn't put it on the paperwork.