Prolapse

Ranger · #1 04/11/12, 08:54 PM

My neighbor has a ND doe who is due to kid at any second. She prolapsed very badly this time, and the vet had to put everything back in place and stich her up. He told her to clip the stiches when the doe was a day or so away from kidding.

Since it's time, and she has NO ligs at all!!!!, my friend clipped the stiches. The doe is prolapsing again, but not as badly, and it does retract on it's own most of the time.

My question is: should we expect any problems with the birthing due to the prolapse?

chamoisee · #2 04/12/12, 02:18 AM

Um. I don't think she should have clipped the stitches until the doe was actually in labor. If that were my doe, I would sleep in the barn until she kids.

I've never had a doe prolapse before....and I don't mean to sound heartless, but IMHO this doe should be culled...unless she is ancient and all worn out or something and kidded OK in her younger years? :-(

Ranger · #3 04/12/12, 05:27 AM

She isn't going to be bred again. She's a sweet little girl, so she'll just stay around as a pet. Unfortunarely my friend hadn't been told that she was prone to this when she bought her.

Minelson · #4 04/12/12, 08:59 AM

I would think a vet should be called in.

dosthouhavemilk · #5 04/12/12, 10:23 AM

Is this a vaginal prolapse?
We have an older doe who starting having slight vaginal prolapsing at 7 years old (she is nine now). That first year she prolapsed a little more than normal. With the loose skin it did require some assistance from us. I had to pull the loose skin over the bubble so the kid could come out.
It is best that she be there for the delivery if at all possible due to all of the loose skin.
We had another doe who was prolapsing badly both rectally and vaginally. She kidded two very large bucklings on her own with no one there.

mabeane · #6 04/12/12, 11:01 AM

I had a doe with a huge prolapse. Didn't bother the birth and went back inside afterwards.
You should be fine. Mine was also an ND.

Backfourty,MI. · #7 04/12/12, 09:56 PM

How's your friends doe? Any babies yet? Hope momma is doing well.

Ranger · #8 04/14/12, 02:12 PM

Update on the prolapsed doe. Since my friend could not get out of work, I stayed with the doe for the last two nights. On Thursday afternoon she started VERY slightly pushing, but only seemed to moving them down into position. After a couple hours of this she stopped went back to her normal eating, drinking, sleeping, etc. self. She never seemed to be in labor at all after this.

Last night I went back over to check on her for the third time of the evening, and she seemed the same, but I decided to stay. At about midnight she made a little squeeking noise, and her water broke. She still hadn't pushed at all or seemed uncomfortable.

At 12:30 I saw four tiny toes just starting to peek out. Still no pushing. I gave her a few minutes more to see what she was going to do, then reached in to grab the feet and help things along. That's when I saw that they were back feet. I had to reach in and shift the baby, a doeling, around, and finally pulled her out. Unfortunately I never could get any response out of her. The only time that the doe pushed was when I had my hand in her.

There were obviously more kids, so I waited for her to start pushing them, thinking that the first one was just a fluke. My friend got home, and called the vet. Not much help there. During this whole time the doe was eating hay, drinking water, wandering around.

Finally I decided that something had to give, so I went in, thinking that the rest of the kids were probably dead too. I found another baby and managed to work the sac into the birth canal. As long as I kept my hand in she would push, so she finally pushed out another doeling. Alive!!!!!!!!

I went back and found another one, and she managed to push it out without any more help. This one was a buckling. Alive!!!!

They were the only ones in there, thank goodness. The doe is a bit droopy, but we gave her a shot of antibiotics, and calcium, so I hope she gets better. Still eating and drinking.

I've never had a doe act like this before. I've seen them have a hard delivery and get too tired to push any more, but I've never seen one just not push at all or act like she was in labor at any point. Any thoughts from anyone? The prolapse had gone back in long before she ever had the first one.

chamoisee · #9 04/14/12, 03:16 PM

I had a doe do that to me once too. Someone told me that it was a sign of milk fever, but the doe really was not very productive, so I don't know.

Ranger · #10 04/14/12, 04:32 PM

We're going to treat it as milk fever, but at least if I ever see it again I'll have a small clue of what to do!! I'm guessing that I should have gone in sooner, but it's still only a guess.

FrogTacos · #11 04/14/12, 06:06 PM

My last doe that kidded didn't push a bit either - even when I went in to pull. When she laid down the bubble presented - never saw kid bits in the bubble. Let her get up and walk around etc. After almost an hour I had had enough and went in. First baby was backwards - pulled her, second was presented normally. Both were the smallest babies born on my farm to date, and both were certainly the hardest pull Ive dealt with also. I honestly thought I was going to kill them all.

We just so happened to be having a huge BBQ that day. Not sure if it was all the people (I suspect so) or not but after pulling the kids she straight up just walked away. Never looked, never tried to clean them, had nothing to do with them, until they were about an hour old. Not counting that first hour (of course, the most important one) she is an excellent mother. Ifn she hadnt given me dappled babies she would be going to the barn at weaning. Will give her another try, hopefully she will do better next year.

Minelson · #12 04/14/12, 08:47 PM

Wow! What a tense time I'm sure! Good job!

Backfourty,MI. · #13 04/14/12, 08:57 PM

Good job Ranger! Your friend is so lucky you live close & could help out with the doe & new babies! Thank goodness she has 2 healthy babies although it's still tough when one doesn't make it.

I would be giving that doe CMPK. I would have started that when she started labor but no pushing. If your friend has CMPK I would have her give her that for a couple days & make sure she has plenty of alfafa pellets free choice too.

dosthouhavemilk · #14 04/15/12, 12:42 AM

Sluggish labor is definitely a sign of Milk Fever.
On that first kid, you could have helped her come out hind feet first. That is considered "normal" presentation. When you are assisting that, however, you want to get the kid out quickly once the umbilical cord is crushed when the belly passes through the pelvic bone. Once the supply to the umbilical is cut off, the kid starts breathing. In the case of a backwards presentation this happens inside the doe in the amniotic fluid. You can hang the kid and gently swing it to get the gunk out after a backwards delivery.
Also, when assisting a delivery, you will find it far easier to fix a malpresentation if you go ahead and break the amniotic sack surrounding the kid you are working on.

Ranger · #15 04/15/12, 12:37 PM

Thanks for all the input, everyone. The next time I'll be more aware of the condition, and, hopefully, get things going faster. I had just never seen this before. She's treating the doe with calcium suppliments and antibiotics, plus some B complex. Can anyone think of anything else to do?

Backfourty,MI. · #16 04/15/12, 08:01 PM

Make sure she wormed the doe. I do mine the day they kid & then again 10days later. With such a wet spring & everyone having so many problems early with worms & cocci she might even consider worming 3 times at 10 day intervals this year.

Ranger · #17 04/15/12, 11:13 PM

Katie, our Spring has been so dry that I think all the cocci critters have run for the hills!! We're under a total fire ban right now. Please send us some of that rain.