Disbudding Questions

Beckygoats · #1 02/16/12, 09:37 PM

I need some disbudding advice for my goats if anyone can help. We now have 4 kids. 3 girls that are 7 days old (dairy Nubians) and one boy 6 days old (boer). We were going to use disbudding cream for all of them due to the cost difference between the cream and the iron. When we got the cream though, it was a bit more intense than we thought it would be and now worry it will be more dangerous than using the iron. We bought Dr. Naylor Dehorning Paste. Calcium hydroxide 37.8%, and sodium hydroxide 24.9% are the active ingredients. Does any one feel comfortable with the paste? I'm in a hurry to get them disbudded before it is too late.

Kits&Kids · #2 02/16/12, 09:46 PM

i do my kids between 7-14 days,depending on size.i want them big enougt so i dont crush them while holding,but not to big so that i cant hold them with one arm.i use an iorn.if you are going to do many of them in the future an iron is the way to go.its quick,easy and less risky.

Natural Beauty Farm · #3 02/16/12, 10:52 PM

The paste gets all over, drips and it highly toxic, it can blind if gotten in another kids eye or kill if licked, besides it also burns for days. Return it and buy a good iron or find someone who will do it for you. Check the different goat forums and let people know what area of the state you are in. I know most of us are more than willing to help others out. I actually have two irons now so that when someone brings over 10+ kids we can switch irons after every kid and get them done faster.

CaliannG · #4 02/16/12, 10:53 PM

Okay, I will not preach about how unnecessary disbudding is, how it is fashion, yadda, yadda, yadda...most folks know my feelings on that.

I will say that the absolute WORST way to disbud is to use creams or pastes.

You WILL get get scurs.... and not a little, miniature horn-looking scur, but a mass of tiny scurs that form a nice haven for every mite, louse, and/or bug on the planet. Of course, making the poor goat miserable.

Not to mention the creams and pastes HURT. They are caustic....what does caustic stuff feel like when it lands on YOUR skin? Imagine having that for DAYS. AND it gets all over stuff, sometimes their dam's udder, burning holes in skin everywhere.

If you MUST disbud, get an iron, and do it correctly, PLEASE! If you cannot afford an iron, find a mentor nearby who has one and will help you.

The caustic pastes and creams are nothing but trouble.

Creamers · #5 02/16/12, 11:24 PM

I recommend having someone with experience use the iron to disbud - for sure - the paste is awful stuff.

PossumRidgeFarm · #6 02/17/12, 12:17 AM

I haven't used the cream for just the reasons mentioned here, I worry that it could cause serious damage. We use a box to hold the kids when disbudding at it certainly makes the proces easier. I do feel bsd for the kids but have found it much better to have hornless goats here.

Kits&Kids · #7 02/17/12, 12:21 AM

I dont disbud for looks i think they look more natural with horns.i disbud so they wont tear up the fence or barn.and so they dont hurt each other when one gets a little nasty attitude.

Ranger · #8 02/17/12, 06:52 AM

The paste is awful stuff, and, as has already been said, can blind or kill goats. It should have been outlawed long ago. Goat people are always willing to help each other, so you should be able to find someone to disbud for you. Good luck.

Chaty · #9 02/17/12, 07:23 AM

I agree with the above as I got the pste and tried it...Take about hurt it got on me and now I have the scars to prove it...I use the iron and a disbudding box.

"SPIKE" · #10 02/17/12, 09:08 AM

ADD ME TO THE DO NOT TRY THE PASTE LIST!

When I saw it at the local Co-op, I started inquiring about it. I only spoke to 3 people, but no one had any thing good to say about it.
I'm cheap! Hate to buy an iron with only two does. Do not want to expose my animals to unknowns, by taking them to someone else's place. But, some things you just need to do. So I'm looking for an disbudding iron.

SPIKE

Alice In TX/MO · #11 02/17/12, 09:08 AM

Before I learned to use the iron, I took a doeling to the vet and he used the cream. Didn't work AT ALL.

Get the iron TODAY. You've almost waited too long!

Model 17067. Pay for quick shipment

http://www.valleyvet.biz/ct_detail.h...2-00b0d0204ae5

How to with pictures:

http://www.dummies.com/how-to/conten...baby-goat.html

**mygoat** · #12 02/17/12, 09:14 AM

If you were closer I'd let you bring them over to get them done before it's too late. If you wait to get the iron you might be going too long. I usually do them at 4 days old. A week is about as old as I want to do them. I've done 2 week olds but it's a very intense process - burn, pop horn buds, reburn.

Anybody close to you that would be willing to burn them so they don't go too long?

LoneStrChic23 · #13 02/17/12, 10:09 AM

If you place your order at Jeffers before 5pm, it will ship that day... I've never had a Jeffers ordee take longer than 2 days.

I wanted a Rhineheart X50, but they were sold out, so I got the X30. I've done Alpines, boers & minis, love this iron. Don't buy the cheapy irons, waste of $$.

Not a fan of paste, if I have to do something painful, I want it over quickly..... Not a drawn out, prolonged pain like the paste.

"SPIKE" · #14 02/17/12, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alice In TX/MO

Before I learned to use the iron, I took a doeling to the vet and he used the cream. Didn't work AT ALL.

Get the iron TODAY. You've almost waited too long!

Model 17067. Pay for quick shipment

http://www.valleyvet.biz/ct_detail.h...2-00b0d0204ae5

How to with pictures:

http://www.dummies.com/how-to/conten...baby-goat.html

See, there you go again Alice.

Providing good links. I did not know there was so much literature "for Dummies" LOL

SPIKE

"SPIKE" · #15 02/17/12, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoneStrChic23

If you place your order at Jeffers before 5pm, it will ship that day... I've never had a Jeffers ordee take longer than 2 days.

I wanted a Rhineheart X50, but they were sold out, so I got the X30. I've done Alpines, boers & minis, love this iron. Don't buy the cheapy irons, waste of $$.

Not a fan of paste, if I have to do something painful, I want it over quickly..... Not a drawn out, prolonged pain like the paste.

Don't mean to hijack, but .......
Hey Crystal, will the X30 work well on Nubian, or would I be better off with a X50?

SPIKE

Alice In TX/MO · #16 02/17/12, 10:32 AM

It might. I have one of each, and the MOST important thing is getting it HOT before you start.

Beckygoats · #17 02/18/12, 10:10 PM

Thank you everyone for your quick and helpful responses!!! We looked on the internet at the sites recommended plus a few more, but most were sold out of the irons. We finally found one in a town called Belen (about 2 1/2 hours each way from us) but were able to go buy it today. Kids were already bedded down for the night when we got home so first thing tomorrow morning here we go! I'm going to return the paste; it just sounded too scary to put them through. We have decided to disbud as we have young children running around, and one time we had a goat with horns that rammed into one of our others and flat out killed her. These goats are such an investment we can't just have them killing each other off! Thank you again everyone

LoneStrChic23 · #18 02/19/12, 12:01 AM

Yep, the X30 will work on a Nubian.... Did Nubian/Boer crosses & pure Boers with mine.... As well as Alpine bucks who have very broad bases. The trick is letting the iron fully heat between burns. I'm told I baby mine too much, but I shave heads before burning, burn a nice solid ring for 6 seconds. Ice pack head, let the iron sit for a minute or two & do the other side. Repeat (I do two 6 sec burns per side). I pop off caps between burns, and roll the iron over the centers. I've seen folks just burn both with no breaks, ice packs between burns ect. ect with no problems, but I feel better icing them down & giving the iron a minute to heat.... Plus that down time is when I gather the courage to do the next burn because I'm still kind of a wimp about it all

I taught myself to disbud last year thanks to youtube & the picture instructions that came with the iron. I was so nervous about it that when the iron came, I read the instructions, plugged it in right out of the box & had mom help me do kids right then.... I was worried if I looked at the iron too long, I'd chicken out....

Did all my kids, kids for my mom & two friends.... None that we did have scurs, and I redid a few others who were forming scurs (originally disbudded by someone else). If I can figure it out with no one physically showing me, anyone can do it.... So definately spring for the Rhineheart iron & ditch the paste

LoneStrChic23 · #19 02/19/12, 12:10 AM

Oh, SPIKE, I wanted an X50 because the tips do wear out eventually. Granted it takes A LOT of use to wear it thin (I have a friend who does 30+- kids a year for 5 years with her current X30 & it's still good).

The tip on the X30 is not removalble or changeable so when it's worn, you need to replace the iron, the X50 you can change the tip out though.

Another reason I wanted an X50 was due to an improperly disbudded buck kid I bought.... Found instructions for retrofitting the X50 with a bigger tip than what is sold for it (parts bought at Home Depot) on another forum, and having a much bigger tip than the X30 would have been helpful in fixing the VERY wide scur on thar buck...... So while I like my X30 & it works great, I'd love an X50 as well because it would give me more options if needed.

Laura Workman · #20 02/19/12, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoneStrChic23

Oh, SPIKE, I wanted an X50 because the tips do wear out eventually. Granted it takes A LOT of use to wear it thin (I have a friend who does 30+- kids a year for 5 years with her current X30 & it's still good).

The tip on the X30 is not removalble or changeable so when it's worn, you need to replace the iron, the X50 you can change the tip out though.

Another reason I wanted an X50 was due to an improperly disbudded buck kid I bought.... Found instructions for retrofitting the X50 with a bigger tip than what is sold for it (parts bought at Home Depot) on another forum, and having a much bigger tip than the X30 would have been helpful in fixing the VERY wide scur on thar buck...... So while I like my X30 & it works great, I'd love an X50 as well because it would give me more options if needed.

I have an X50, and used it for a few years. The thing is that the "tip" for an X50 isn't originally part of the iron. It's an add-on. The original iron is very large and made for calves. I find my X30 gets a LOT hotter. I never saw the X50 glow. Itakes about ten minutes before the X30 is glowing darkly. With the X50, I used to use two eight-second burns, and then another few secons to pop the horn bud off on each side. Now, with the X30, it's two burns on each side, about 5 seconds each, and pop the bud off at the end of the second burn. The X30 is a really, really nice iron and does a better job, IMHO, than the X50.