injection wormer?

[Reed77]

I've only known the wormer that is given orally, but is there one that you inject into the skin? I've been told it works better

[Creamers]

Depends on who you ask - most still say give the injectables orally - be is Ivomec, Ivomec plus or Cydectin

[Cannon_Farms]

Cydectin does in my opinion and a great deal of other goat herders work better as an injection especially if you are targeting Barber pole worms. Its been 5 months and all my girls are still bright pink and we used copper and cydectin, they never lasted this long with oral cydectin or any other worms even with the copper, however we have been extreamly dry so there is room for error in my theory but I wont go back to using it any other way.

Ivomect should be given orally to goats, course fecals should be done as neither wormer covers everything.

[Reed77]

So Ivomec can be given orally or injected? would the dosage still be the same? (1.0 - 1.1cc?)

[mygoat]

No, doseages are much different. Given injectible, doseages are smaller.

I'm thinking of using cydectin injectible in my goats that are breeding stock ONLY. I have a few that I don't plan on butchering or milking. Cydectin injectible (or orally) has a pretty long withdrawal if I remember correctly.

But for my 'pet' minis, my cart wether, and my breeding stock, I don't see why I can't use injectible. There are claims that it doesn't work as well as orally. For most wormers you could probably be fairly safe in increasing the doseage a bit and do just fine to compensate, and it would still likely be a smaller doseage (and POSSIBLY cheaper) to give injectible. Some wormers there is NOT a wide range of safety (Levamisole comes to mind), but most like ivermectin and cydectin are fairly safe to overdose a little bit, at least orally.

[Cannon_Farms]

No milk withdrawl has been established but it has a short meat withdrawal (cydectin)

[Bearfootfarm]

I've been told it works better

All the actual studies I've ever seen say ruminant wormers work best orally because they go directly to where the worms are rather than being filtered through the body

[Fowler]

I use cydectin sheep drench, I do not worm on a schedule only when they need it. maybe once a year. Unless it's an unusally hot year. Which this year was.

And Bearfoot is correct.

[Alice In TX/MO]

The veterinary college textbook, Sheep and Goat Medicien, says to give ALL goat dewormers orally.

[Cannon_Farms]

I wont argue with what works better for us here, Little tots is the one that started me with it and I cant argue with his results either. My vet has even noticed better results doing cydectin as an injection so maybe its a GA thing ??? I would defiantly like to see some research done on it maybe next time I see my extension agent I can see if he will mention it to one of the folks at UGA and see if they are interested.

Why would it work better as an injection for a cow but not for a goat when the metabolism is the only big difference? The theory that is being passed along in the local goat community is that it stays in the muscle longer and has more time to work, I dont know I just know its worked better than anything else used here and I had a problem as well as Gagirl with bpw

[Alice In TX/MO]

The problem with injection (that I've heard) is that it is excreted more slowly, so more resistant worms do not get an adequate killing dose, and the longer presence in the body also enables resistant worms to reproduce in that low dose environment.

The metabolism IS the big difference. You want a *large* dose to impact the worms as soon as possible and then be gone.

I am not a goat health research scientist.

[Cannon_Farms]

Anyone got any goats that need to be wormed that would be willing to do a before and after fecal? Mine are good right now, and to be honest I have not done an after fecal just noticed the eye and b/c improvements but maybe would could do some HT research, I think it would be most interesting since we are all from different areas.

[Bearfootfarm]

The theory that is being passed along in the local goat community is that it stays in the muscle longer

The problem worms aren't in the muscle

[Cannon_Farms]

Originally Posted by Bearfootfarm

The problem worms aren't in the muscle

but the blood stream carries it where it needs to be. Pneumonia isnt in the muscle, pain isnt in the muscle that we inject banamine into.

[Bearfootfarm]

but the blood stream carries it where it needs to be. Pneumonia isnt in the muscle, pain isnt in the muscle that we inject banamine

It also carries it where it doesn't need to be, therefore diluting it, rather than delivering the full dose directly to the rumen and intestines where most of the problem worms reside

Antibiotics and painkillers need to reach areas that are normally only accessable by going through the bloodstream, although many antibiotics can also be given orally

They also need to stay in the body longer to be most effective

http://www.cals.ncsu.edu/an_sci/exte...t/MGWormer.htm

Levamisole is another widely used deworming product for ruminants. In goats, it is usually used at the sheep dose (8 mg/kg or 3.6 mg/lb). Again, goats need a higher dose than the sheep dose and 11 mg/kg (5 mg/lb) has been recommended. The safety margin for this product is lower than for the other anthelmintics and side effects, especially salivation, may be seen after treatment especially if the injectable form is used. The oral form is safer and will be eliminated from the animal faster. Barber pole worms resistant to levamisole have been documented, although resistance to this product does not appear to be as widespread as benzimidazole resistance.

Ivermectin is available as an injectable product for cattle and a drench for sheep (0.2 mg/kg or .09 mg/lb). Experimentally, . The withdrawal time is also shorter when the product is given orally.the oral form appears to be more effective than the injectable, especially in goats

[Fowler]

When I orally drenched my sheep this year it was the first time they had a heavy worm load. And within less then 24 hrs. All were back to normal and eyelids were bright pink. Personally I want them back in good health ASAP. The injections IMO take longer and sometimes you dont have longer, these creatures can go down quick

[Cannon_Farms]

I cant find the link where it makes logic out of using injectable as one and by far am I trying to say Im right and everyone else is wrong, its goat medicine and if you dont keep and open mind you can miss out on a great deal. I can speak volumes of what it is proving on its own but cant say that its the best thing. I did think my vet and Little Tots estates owner had flipped their lid but when all else was failing that brought things under control for me again.
When I deworm again I will bring more of a scientific approach to it to see the actual results of using the injectable, cant say by visual results I will be using anything else in any other way.

[Bearfootfarm]

When I deworm again I will bring more of a scientific approach to it to see the actual results of using the injectable

That's the only way to tell what works for your herd.

Any other way just isn't accurate