Serious Question: Coyotes

beccachow · #1 06/30/11, 10:06 PM

We heard them tonight baying. First time in a long time we have heard them. It was funny because my DH was in back of the house, while I was in front of the house talking to a neighbor. I shushed the neighbor and said, "Did you hear that?" and we listened to him/her/them howl several more times. I came in the house and sat down, pretty sure DH would say I was nuts, when HE came in and asked me if I had heard that. We debated (dog vs coyote) and are pretty sure the coyotes have moved back to town (something about a coyote howl that makes your skin crawl). They are several miles away, judging from the calls. I said we needed to put the goats IN, he said our barn isn't coyote proof and that would be a death sentence for all of them. The barn is set up so they COULD climb under it, but the goat's stall has plywood all the way to the ground, so THEIR part is relatively safe. In other words, they could find a way into the barn any number of ways, but to GET to them in the stall would be nearly impossible.

Guard dog not really an option.

What do you guys think? I know you have dealt with this before. A few years back we heard howling for a few weeks, then no more until tonight.

Goatress · #2 06/30/11, 10:26 PM

Have your gun loaded and handy and coyote proof your barn, if you can't get an LGD then you'll have to figure out a way to bring them in every night so they are safe, just my opinion....

beccachow · #3 06/30/11, 10:37 PM

I thought so, too. DH seems to think they'd have a better shot in the field, like a coyote would only nab one but if it gets into the barn it would massacre all of them. I think it would be a massacre in the field as well, and would rather try to keep them out of sight. The commotion of the blasted things trying to get to them would wake us, the dogs would be going nuts, and they might have a shot.

So far they sounded pretty distant. I am hoping they move along like they did last time with no victims but the numerous deer we have out in the woods.

Those things howling give me a serious case of the heebie jeebies.

CaliannG · #4 06/30/11, 10:48 PM

Becca, can you BORROW a large LGD to go for a walk around your property once a month or so? It doesn't even have to be a trained one, just one that you can take for a stroll around your place every few weeks.

It isn't the actual LGD that deters coyotes. It is their urine. Their urine says "There is a big, bad-butted dog around here that will kick your @$$ if you so much as wiff NEAR this territory."

We have a LOT of coyotes around here. To the point of hearing them every other week or so, and the ranchers are setting out poison again. But they make a wide detour around my place. They also make a wide detour of the gentleman that lives about a mile down the road...because said gentleman borrows my LGD about once every 4-5 weeks and has him run all over his property for about 10-15 minutes.

It works.

BethW · #5 06/30/11, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goatress

...if you can't get an LGD then you'll have to figure out a way to bring them in every night so they are safe

Ditto. No matter where I am, I make sure I'm home in time to put the goats in the barn. And if I'm not here, I make sure I have someone else to do it.

oregon woodsmok · #6 06/30/11, 11:16 PM

If the barn isn't coyote proof, make it coyote proof.

Lock the goats up tight before sundown. The coyotes don't wait until dark. Keep your cats and small dogs inside.

noeskimo · #7 06/30/11, 11:54 PM

When camping, we often use DH's urine to "mark" the area around the campsite.That keeps the coyotes away-makes the bears laugh.Or you can buy wolf urine scent in a bottle at hunting supply stores. Both are temporary fixes that will buy you some time as you fix up the barn. A low, high powered electric fence is our final deterrent, after the LGDs. We've only lost one kid to the evil beasts in 2 years and he was the one that kept crawling through the fence openings and running off through the brush.

Minelson · #8 07/01/11, 12:06 AM

I hear coyotes almost every night. When windows are open. Now it's too hot. anyhoo...they are yapping and running either in the fields or up the gravel road. It is a pack. But they seem to pass on through. I have 2 inside/outside dogs. The goats, chickens, ducks are put inside for the night. I have it secured so that I can leave a couple windows open through the night. It is scary..and I hate them even though thye are not bothering us. They scare me cuz they are so wild. knock on wood...no coons, pssums, fox, owl , hawk attacks ever. I think it helps to have the dogs and activity all the time.

Donna1982 · #9 07/01/11, 12:11 AM

You can use male human pee too. We've been lucky here but getting an alpaca soon

LoneStrChic23 · #10 07/01/11, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliannG

Becca, can you BORROW a large LGD to go for a walk around your property once a month or so? It doesn't even have to be a trained one, just one that you can take for a stroll around your place every few weeks.

It isn't the actual LGD that deters coyotes. It is their urine. Their urine says "There is a big, bad-butted dog around here that will kick your @$$ if you so much as wiff NEAR this territory."

We have a LOT of coyotes around here. To the point of hearing them every other week or so, and the ranchers are setting out poison again. But they make a wide detour around my place. They also make a wide detour of the gentleman that lives about a mile down the road...because said gentleman borrows my LGD about once every 4-5 weeks and has him run all over his property for about 10-15 minutes.

It works.

Agree! Before my Dane passed he caught coyotes frequently & would happily present with his catches (not fun to have a dead coyote tossed at you when you least expect it)Despite him catching 4, I'd still see signs of them of the very back of the property that wasn't fenced & my Dane didn't have access to. Started walking him out there every day & I swear he peed every 5 steps! Coyotes didn't come back, even on the back of the property.

After we lost him to cancer critters started coming back. Mostly coyotes & the occasional bobcat. Shot a few, didn't deter them much.....lost my barn cats to them

Folks up the road offered to walk the peremeter with their Anatolian...he marked everything in sight & after a few days coyotes started keeping their distance. Can't bother them all the time for their dog, but my mom brings her GSD/lab/Anatolian mix about twice a week to roam my property & we haven't had a problem.

Off topic, but anyone else see larger than average coyotes lately? Cattleman up the road was talking to us about some losses he had....more than a calf stolen, one of his nice yearlings was torn up so bad they put her down...Described the attack & said it was 4 coyotes "this big" raising his hand to show average GSD size or bigger....Thought it was an exageration due to him being so upset over that yearling.

Nope, since then hubby & I have seen packs of VERY large coyotes in our county & 2 neighboring counties.......They aren't dog packs, I've seen two that were shot & they were definately coyotes...few pack members we saw were closer to typical size, as were a few of the loners we've seen..

I'm assuming they must be crossing with larger dogs, just curious if anyone else had seen any bigger than average coyotes?

195Pilot · #11 07/01/11, 02:05 AM

Right now the coyote pups are large enough to be outside of the den and you are hearing a group or family howl. Soon the pups will be large enough to go on hunts with the older members of the family.Then they will have no use for the den. Each pack has a territory,The coyotes territory can be quite large, consisting of many square miles and may take days for them to cover the territory.
At this time momma coyote will keep the young away from any know dangers as she and the male are still bringing back food for the young.
The young will be kicked out of the family group to fiend for themselves in late summer and early fall. This is the time to worry about the pack of adolescent coyotes doing damage. These will be young and dumb and can be easily called into gun range and or trapped.
If your not up to the job you can contact the state fish and game, some states have state trappers that can come out and give you so relief. You can also contact the state trapper assoc. they may have a member in that area.
Coyotes are very resilient, they have been trapped, poisoned, shot on sight,etc for hundred plus years and there numbers and there range has expanded 10 fold.
Goats have very little defense against even the smallest adult coyote. The noise of a kid goat will bring them in like being pulled on a rope.
Hope this helps,
Good Luck

Kazahleenah · #12 07/01/11, 06:47 AM

Take a dog for walks around the perimater of the fence.... (males prefered) let them pee all over.

(But.... coyotes, yip, not howl) just sayin

zant · #13 07/01/11, 06:55 AM

Get a big mule(s),I have 2 in cow field,when cows are birthing,coyotes try for a free meal,in 5yrs,have lost no calves,but found stomped to death bundles of fur 6 times...We have 6 dogs so coyotes don't come near house.

bcadybug · #14 07/01/11, 07:06 AM

I've heard rumors that we've got coyotes in our area.... but I wasn't buying it...

Okay.... so now I'm freaking out!

Val (in Southern MD)

beccachow · #15 07/01/11, 07:57 AM

It was kind of a yip yip built INTO a howl, definitely not fox, I know we don't have wolves around here. If it was a dog, it was a strange sounding dog!

Val, they kept telling us that until one day someone hit a dog crossing the street over by the quarry...got out to check it, wasn't a dog. Then the state parks had to admit, oh,ok, there might be some. Then they had open season (this was 2007) on the coyotes and we hadn't heard or seen them since.

Thank you all for the tips, I actually have a two year old chow who is intact, I can take him along the perimeter, with the GSD in tow while I coyote proof the barn.

julieq · #16 07/01/11, 08:19 AM

The fastest way to coyote (or dog) proof a structure is to put up hot wire around it. That'll give you time to secure the barn structurally. You can use the light weight fiberglass rods that you push into the ground with your foot, so installation goes really quickly.

pookshollow · #17 07/01/11, 08:23 AM

Coyotes DO howl.

We hear them every now and then, and every now and then we shoot one if it's getting too close to our barn.

Something else you could try if you're worried is put a radio out in the barn, tuned to an all-night talk-show station. The voices coming out of the barn should worry the coyotes enough that they wouldn't come too close. Worth a try while you're working on your barn!

Kshobbit · #18 07/01/11, 08:37 AM

Coyotes are common in Kansas. I have had my Anatolian for 10 years now and he has kept them off the property. Step outside on any evening and you can hear the coyotes howling, lots of them. The sound does not bother me but I did hear a big cat scream one night. One of my does had kidded out in the pasture and I debated on putting them up. Then I heard this awful scream and my LGD's were going off, running to the fence line, and having a fit. I moved the doe and kids into the barn. The State of Kansas claims we do not have any Mountain Lions in Kansas but I saw one myself and many many local folks have seen them. The area is hilly, wooded, and full of white tailed deer, tell me that it isn't big cat heaven!

wendle · #19 07/01/11, 08:43 AM

Don't count on just borrowing a lgd once a month working. If the coyotes are serious they will know when the lgd isn't there. I've had losses and personally known others to have losses within two days of the lgd not being with his sheep/goats. You might consider getting a roll of electronet and setting it up as a deterrent for coyotes. I doubt one would get past that net unless they figure out how to jump it, more likely they will hit it once or twice and leave it alone. The same company also sells poultry electronet which is much taller. It will keep smaller predators away from birds, and yes it works. I know somebody who kept their chickens in it with no trouble.
Fix barn where coyotes might get through.

Otter · #20 07/01/11, 09:12 AM

Northern coyotes can be pretty big. A coyote pack howling is distinct. Once you hear it, you will never mistake it.
Definitely patrol with the chow. A dog needn't be huge so much as decent size and vigilant. Coyotes will keep checking, the scent needs to be fresh. Right now I've got 2 dogs at just under 30# each and they'd be coyote bait. But my 50# GSD/BC mix could keep them away. He was fixed but his scent marks were still high/strong enough

Funny thing; I never heard Thunder howl until we moved to upstate NY and the coyotes started. We were listening to a pair sing and suddenly this low, deep wolf howl started up and the coyotes cut out like someone flipped a switch. We launched up in a panic to find it was Thunder! A few minutes later the coyotes tried again, Thunder repeated his wolfish howl and the coyotes silenced again and stayed quiet.
Most dogs howling sound like dogs howling and coyotes don't care. But if you happen across a rare dog that howls like a wolf (coyote's natural enemy) that seems to help back them off too.