Urgent-Doe in labor question

medic · #1 05/10/11, 10:40 PM

So once again we come home to a doe that has given birth. The issue is the last one was completely done upon our dicovery. This has only had one & she was quite large. We fed the 1st doeling 4 oz of colostrum from our other doe we had frozen.

Whew, here's the question....
We do we bring her to the stand to milk her out for colostrum.

Do we milk her out while she still has babies yet to deliver?

I'm sure we dontwait for the placenta to deliver, I just hate to stress her more while she's in active labor. But as a medic I realize milking stimulates the uteras to contract as well to help dispell the placenta. (I think?)

Pony · #2 05/10/11, 10:54 PM

Have you bumped her to find if there are there more kids in there? Why do you want to milk her out? How long ago do you figure she kidded the first one? Why the rush to get colostrum into the kid?

All things being equal, if the doe is still in labor, I agree with you that it might be stressful to try milking her out. When you do milk her, I'd just do it where she stands. No need fussing and stressing her to get her into the stanchion and all.

yarrow · #3 05/10/11, 10:58 PM

I usually just milk out half a bottle or so of colostrum.. right there in the kidding stall (you have about 12 hours to get colostrum into the kids.. BUT.. I want it in their little bellies within the first 30 minutes..even if I have to tube 4ounces or so)... But I want my does to have time to finish up before I get them up on the stand/or seriously milk them.. If one kids early evening.. I'll milk out the half bottle or so.. then go back out before bed.. if the doe has had her afterbirth.. then I'll get her up on the stand and milk out another bottle worth (so I have enough to feed the baby that night).. next morning (or evening if it was an early morning birth).. then I we start to milk.. I don't milk *out* for 24 to 36 hours.. it works well for us.. and we never have does coming down with milk fever & don't want to risk it.. so I build them up to a milk out, rather slowly... I missed a kidding last sunday.. just went out to find one huge doeling.. she had not nursed yet.. but was up and going.. I milked her a bottle brought her in.. just for my own peace of mind (mom's cervix was already closed).. I gave her 2cc's of lute IM.. by bedtime she had passed afterbirth.. when she had no more signs of labor or babies by the next night.. I finally believed there was just the one kid (had a doe do the same thing last year.. one kid.. passed her afterbirth.. acted normal.. 3 days later had a raging infection from a very dead kid.. that we could not get out.. sadly we had to put her down.. I was out of town and still kick myself for not having them lute her, just to be sure...

susie, mo ozarks

medic · #4 05/10/11, 11:21 PM

What is "lute"? Is that like oxytocin like they give humans.
Also they one doeling so far has already had the 4oz, I like they idea of what Yarrow said to not milk her out completely for first few days. we are gonna do that only milk enough to feed the babies & keep the swelling udders a little comfort.
All I got to say is kidding is stressful!!!

yarrow · #5 05/10/11, 11:28 PM

lutalyse (sorry about that, I get use to just calling it *lute* and get lazy when I'm typing.. it's a prostaglandin -used to bring a goat/cow into heat or to induce an abortion or to induce labor.. I use it when I **WANT** that cervix opened back up).. you do NOT want to give her oxytocin!!! I don't think this situation calls for it... MY bet is.. if she isn't actively straining.. she is more then likely done .. if her cervix were open, I'd suggest you wash up and have a little feel around.. but I'm guessing she's done and will pass her afterbirth in the next few hours- maybe as long as 12 or so.. I've heard of longer, but that's as long as we've ever had a doe hold onto one.... I just feel more comfortable slowly building up how much milk I take.. if it were the kids just nursing.. those newborns would be sipping & sipping & sipping some more.. not suddenly totally emptying that udder!!!! Kidding season can be stressful and it can be heartbreaking.. but most times.. it's just like Christmas morning LOL.. I'm tired by the time we are finished with the last doe.. but alway excited by the time the first doe is due the next spring..
congrats on the baby
susie

opossumholler · #6 05/10/11, 11:46 PM

This is medic's wife, he had to get to bed as he has to be up early in the AM. I'm not sure if she's done kidding or not. Shes laying down, still grunting and still very large in the belly. We are still fairly new and our one goat that kidded looked like an ethopian after giving birth so it was easy to tell she was done. This doe looks like shes still got one or two kids in there. We are trying to give her as much privacy as we can but its just like come on already.....here are a couple pictures I took earlier

Checkin things out by possomholler, on Flickr

Big mamma by possomholler, on Flickr

yarrow · #7 05/11/11, 12:08 AM

without an internal exam (I have NEVER had much luck with *bouncing* ... I suck at it.. my vet sucks at it.. NONE of us find it reliable enough to believe.. what we *THINK* we are feeling.. She may still have kids in there.. BUT>> the doe that kidded with the big single, last week was HUGE too.. looked like triplets.. she is now 10day from kidding and just a big ol' butterball of a doe.. never got that just kidded/gutted/sunken look.. in the pictures, yes, the doe does look large.. but she also has fat behind her elbows in the last picture and she may just be *well fleshed* LOL... is she staring off.. grinding teeth? .. grunting like pain? or just a fat doe laying down on a hot/sticky night? .. is she pushing at all? is there ANYthing hanging out of her, at all?

susie

opossumholler · #8 05/11/11, 12:31 AM

Went out again to check her, I *think* she's laying on the placenta, didn't want to move her to check, she's showing no signs of pain or anything just resting on a warm night.

yarrow · #9 05/11/11, 01:03 AM

good luck.. I'm off to bed.. sounds like she will is probably done and will be just fine.. I'll check this thread in the morning.

susie

madness · #10 05/11/11, 10:59 AM

I LOVE the peanut gallery in that picture!

How are things this morning? We had a doe kid last night that we thought would have twins but it was just a single. She still looked a bit big. Sometimes they just look different from one another after kidding.

opossumholler · #11 05/11/11, 04:59 PM

Momma and baby are doing great today, she did only have the one, we seperated them last night and baby is visible through the cattle panel, momma has been laying next to her all day. Im just thinking that she is a big doe, also I talked to the guy we bought her from and he said her first kidding she only had one, last year she had twins, and this year just one.

nigeriandwarfs · #12 05/11/11, 05:48 PM

Congrats she is sooo pretty. Out of curiosity why did you separate mom and baby already? Are you doing a prevention or bottle feeding? Just wondering

yarrow · #13 05/11/11, 06:03 PM

Congrats.... happy everything ended well!

susie, mo ozarks

opossumholler · #14 05/11/11, 06:19 PM

We seperated because we are bottle feeding. It was a tough decision but we decided that we can closely moniter if any problems arise,and take action sooner rather than rushing to catch up, we are feeding her momma milk though

nigeriandwarfs · #15 05/11/11, 09:56 PM

Very cool. I was just wondering because my girls are getting close to kidding and I like to hear what works best for everyone else. Cant wait to see more picts of her bouncing around