How Would I Mix This Feed Ration

[uncleotis]

I've read where goats can be fed a diary cow supplement but I don't know how to figure the amounts of the commercial protein oats and small amount of corn rations. I'm hoping some of you will be able to help me out.

Here is what I have, Kent Pro Vider 38 (38% protein) which is for lactating dairy cows. I would like to mix oats and a small amount of cracked corn with the Pro Vider 38. I have no idea how to calculate things so my feed guy whom really knows next to nothing about goats came up with this for me. I told him I wanted it to be around 18% protein total. 75 pounds oats, 30 pounds corn and 50 pounds Kent Pro Vider 38 with would give me a 18 1/2 protein. Does that sound like something I could feed my goats without any problems? If so how much would I feed my milking Nubian a day? I also want to feed this same ration to my Boar goats, and how much would I give them daily?

Maybe I'm wrong about the protein level at 18%, I have no idea. I have been reading what a lot of you feed but some of the things you use isn't' available here.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Pam

I hope I've explained what I'm wanting, some times I'm not very good at it.

[Alice In TX/MO]

Good grief. Why? It's so easy to do things easy. Of course, I'm not a math person, so I get overwhelmed by all this.

Feed them hay and alfalfa pellets free choice. Feed them oats and BOSS on the milk stand. Are your does dry lotted?

That all sounds like HUGE overkill. Especially the corn and a 38 percent protein ration.

Edited to add:
It also sounds hugely expensive.

Edited again:
I will also state that our veterinarian is a dairy cow lactation specialist, semi-retired. He is INCREDIBLY opposed to feeding high corn/high protein rations to dairy cattle because, although it increases production in the short team, it shortens the life of the animal and negatively impacts her health.

I'm beginning to suspect (thanks to input from another member of this board) that the very high alfalfa/protein component in some dairy goat feeding plans is the source of edema and founder and milk fever problems.

[LoneStrChic23]

Alice, I read the protein bit on the other board too and have since changed my feed mix.... I mix 1 part 16% Dairy Parlor, 2 parts whole oats, 1/2 part BOSS. (It was 3 parts Dairy Parlor, 1 part oats, 1/2 part BOSS)

Both of my milking girls have cut themselves back on grain......Tootsie (mini) is barely eating 1 1/2 lbs per day & is milking at least 6lbs per day....she's been doing this for three weeks now and always leaves grain in her feeder on the stand. Sabrina (alpine) is milking a consistent gallon per day, plus nursing a kid 24/7 & has also cut back on grain..... She eats a lil less than 3lbs milk stand grain per day, isn't loosing body condition and her production is steady so I don't think gobs of high protein mikk stand grain is nessesary. Of course they get unlimited amounts of coastal hay & Standlee Alfalfa pellets in addition to their grain.

I personally would not feed the Pro Vider 38. Way too much protein....too costly and I don't see how your goats would benefit from it.

[Alice In TX/MO]

Glad you mentioned that, Crystal. Mine are leaving grain, also. They started doing that in Texas, but now that they have access to browse here in Missouri, they have really cut back!

[uncleotis]

Originally Posted by Alice In TX/MO

Feed them hay and alfalfa pellets free choice. Feed them oats and BOSS on the milk stand. Are your does dry lotted?

That all sounds like HUGE overkill. Especially the corn and a 38 percent protein ration.



Edited again:
I will also state that our veterinarian is a dairy cow lactation specialist, semi-retired. He is INCREDIBLY opposed to feeding high corn/high protein rations to dairy cattle because, although it increases production in the short team, it shortens the life of the animal and negatively impacts her health.

I'm beginning to suspect (thanks to input from another member of this board) that the very high alfalfa/protein component in some dairy goat feeding plans is the source of edema and founder and milk fever problems.

Alice I forgot to mention they are all on pasture, my milk goat runs right with the boar goats. The milk goats also gets alfalfa both morning and night. None are bred nor nursing.

This is why I'm asking these questions as I DON'T want to give the goats to much of something they don't need. I was told this winter by my vet that they could each have up to 1 pound corn each a day. I found out that was way to much from reading this group. I thought he was a vet ... he'd know. Wrong. Again that's why I'm turning to this group of people that do raise goats for help.

[suzyhomemaker09]

I'm under the impression that corn is not really a good goat feed at all....
Only thing around there that gets corn is ducks that are getting fattened.
It's straight carb..little protein and doesn't add to milk production....

[uncleotis]

Originally Posted by LoneStrChic23

Alice, I read the protein bit on the other board too and have since changed my feed mix.... I mix 1 part 16% Dairy Parlor, 2 parts whole oats, 1/2 part BOSS. (It was 3 parts Dairy Parlor, 1 part oats, 1/2 part BOSS)

Both of my milking girls have cut themselves back on grain......Tootsie (mini) is barely eating 1 1/2 lbs per day & is milking at least 6lbs per day....she's been doing this for three weeks now and always leaves grain in her feeder on the stand. Sabrina (alpine) is milking a consistent gallon per day, plus nursing a kid 24/7 & has also cut back on grain..... She eats a lil less than 3lbs milk stand grain per day, isn't loosing body condition and her production is steady so I don't think gobs of high protein mikk stand grain is nessesary. Of course they get unlimited amounts of coastal hay & Standlee Alfalfa pellets in addition to their grain.

I personally would not feed the Pro Vider 38. Way too much protein....too costly and I don't see how your goats would benefit from it.

Thank you Crystal. I won't even start giving them the dairy ration and will see if I can't get the Dairy Parlor 16 and start mixing my grain the same as you.

I know I don't start my milking doe on this ration all at once but slowly, but how much do you give yours when they are on the milk stand?



Thank you also Suzyhomemaker.

[LoneStrChic23]

I only fed corn in the winter for creating heat. Even then it was just a sprinkle of cracked corn....no more than a handful.

Alice the girls freaked me out with the drastic cut back....lol I sent fecals in, checked temps, eyeluds ect. ect and nothing.....Production is great though so I quit freaking out....lol

To the OP. For dairy goats the main part of their diet NEEDS to be alfalfa. It provides the calcium needed for production. Hence the reason I feed it free choice, as much as they want. I use Standlee Alfalfa pellets from TSC because are good quality, the goats dont waste any of it (like they do alfalfa hay) & because I can't find nice quality alfalfa hay here for an affordable price. My big girl who milks a gallon per day while nursing a kid eats about 3lbs of alfalfa pellets per day.

Alfalfa & grass hay/browse need to be the bulk of your dairy goat's diet along with a good quality loose mineral. Grain should not make up a huge portion of the diet.

For feed.....ask 10 people what to feed and get 10 different answers.

I started out feeding a mix that was 3 parts whole oats to 1 part BOSS & just mixed it by hand into storage bins. When it got cold and I had a new goat that was pregnant & thin, I added the Purina Dairy Parlor 16% & have tweaked it around a few times to find what works best for my girls. I'm liking my current mix and probably will keep their feed at mostly whole grains with minimal dairy parlor pellets added to the mix.

Dry does only get alfalfa pellets & hay....no grain or they get too fat. My milking girls & babies get the most grain and during the last two months of pregnancy I give grain in small, but gradually increasing amounts.

My buck kids are still young & growing, so they get minerals with ammonium chloride added in, meat goat pellets (medicated) and grass hay.

I would not trust the vet in matters of nutrition.....Not trying to be offensive, but I've yet to meet a vet with nutrition advice I would follow (that's goats or dogs!) My vet raises boers, sells them well and keeps a decent sized herd, comparing his to mine....You couldn't pay me to take one of his goats!

He yelled and fussed that I feed alfalfa free choice to all the girls. Said I'd give them all milk fever. Guess what? I free fed alfalfa, no milk fever at all, but he had 7 out of 13 does with milk fever and he wont feed alfalfa... My does kidded easier, no problems and all my kids have been super growthy....My Alpine bottle buck out weighs his boer kids that are 1-2 weeks older!

[Alice In TX/MO]

Unfortunately, very few vets get goat training AT ALL. Then, their nutritional training is even less.

Like Crystal, I feed corn ONLY in the winter for heat.

[LoneStrChic23]

UncleOtis- Is your doe currently milking?

I started Sabrina (standard alpine) on 1/2lb grain a day when she had almost 3 months left in her pregnacy.... I bought her pregnant and she was thin so I was trying to get weight on her too..

I bumped her amount each week until I had her up to 1 1/2lbs a day by kidding time....If she wasn't so thin I would have gradually worked up to sligthly less. After I started putting her on the stand twice a day I'd just gradually add a bit more every few days. During the cold time she was eating about 4lbs a day, nursing twins and milking for me.....now that it's warmer she's cut back and is still able to maintain good condition on less grain.

The Purina Dairy Parlor 16% is the unmedicated version of the Noble Goat Food, so most Purina dealers should be able to order it for you... I have to order it as its not a stocked item, but they lery me order as much as I want...be it 1 bag or 10.

Where are you located? There are other dairy pellets out there depending on location... I think there is one called Kent that several people like.

[Alice In TX/MO]

I use the Kent 16% when in Missouri.

[LoneStrChic23]

Isn't there another brand called Blue Seal?? I think I've seen that one mentioned too..... I know Purina Dairy Parlor isn't the only goat lactation pellet out there..

[uncleotis]

Crystal, yes my doe is currently milking, over half a gallon a day and she freshened a year ago this month.

I was able to find a Purina dealer near enough to me that would order in a bag of the Dairy Parlor 16%. Maggie is a very picky eater, if she won't eat the Purina I will try the Kent 16%. Thank you for that suggestion Alice.

I will take the corn away from them all until this winter and then only for heat.

I am beginning to understand about the "Unfortunately, very few vets get goat training AT ALL. Then, their nutritional training is even less." Alice. Of course the vet we did have that I'm beginning to see had any knowledge about goats moved.

Thank you again all for the help.

[Cannon_Farms]

if you write into the goat ranchers nutritionist with the info and cost, he will break it all down into simple terms. This is not a diet I would put that much stress into. I can tell you over 18% protein is a waste of money with goats, it goes right out the backside and creates ammonia.
Make sure crude fiber isnt in the lable too high either as thats a word for undigestable material

[uncleotis]

Originally Posted by Cannon_Farms

if you write into the goat ranchers nutritionist with the info and cost, he will break it all down into simple terms. This is not a diet I would put that much stress into. I can tell you over 18% protein is a waste of money with goats, it goes right out the backside and creates ammonia.
Make sure crude fiber isnt in the lable too high either as thats a word for undigestable material

Thank you for this information Cannon Farms

[Heritagefarm]

Originally Posted by LoneStrChic23

For feed.....ask 10 people what to feed and get 10 different answers.

Oh yes, but at least every answer is completely right and all other feeds are bogus! LOL...
We feed a 2/3 oat and 1/3 corn mix... I'm not sure if I like it, they don't seem to be producing as much as they usually do...

[uncleotis]

We feed a 2/3 oat and 1/3 corn mix... I'm not sure if I like it, they don't seem to be producing as much as they usually do...[/QUOTE]


From all I've read I'm my girl/girls off corn completely except for when it gets cold here.

I tried cutting Maggie down on her corn and down went the production also so I know what you mean. Hopefully she will like the 16% Dairy Parlor (she's picky) and it won't affect her production.

[Alice In TX/MO]

Too much corn. Yup.

Allow time for her digestion to adjust to the Dairy Parlor. ANY change is going to cause some production change due to the bacteria adjusting.

[sammyd]

We use a 38% pellet in our ration.
Anyone who tells you corn is bad is a fool.

we use a mix the a local mill figured out for another goat dairy.
215 pounds of corn
110 pounds of whole oats
125 38% pellet
40 molasses
1 vitADE
12 2-1 mineral
40 BOSS
just a touch over 16% protein and the girls love it.
We feed some in the pen and also let them eat as much as they can on the milk stand.
Feed good quality hay as well.

[LoneStrChic23]

Originally Posted by sammyd

We use a 38% pellet in our ration.
Anyone who tells you corn is bad is a fool.

Wow....... I had no idea that someone who is of the opinion that corn is bad should be considered a fool.....Quite harsh and very unessary as no one in this thread said it was bad....Mentioned too much is bad, yes, but I don't recall anyone here stating corn is bad.

If I were to feed your high corn mix in my summers, my girls would kill over! We've already had several days here over 100°.

I feed corn, in very SMALL amounts during the winter for heat. I do not include it in my mix at any other time of the year.

Most everyone feeds slightly different to suit their animal's needs and diets often vary by location as well....Sharing what works for YOU is great, its what makes these boards awesome as your able to get lots of opinions and advice.....But starting off your post calling people fools is uncalled for.

I wouldn't touch your feed mix with a ten foot pole.....but do I think your a fool? No, if it works for you, great. For me, corn is those amounts is a VERY bad thing.