What makes a show goat???

GottaloveOregon · #1 02/28/11, 05:35 PM

I was thinking of showing one of my goats, and was just wondering what makes a good show goat. I need any adivse.

CaliannG · #2 02/28/11, 05:54 PM

A good show goat: Has excellent dairy conformation.

To win in shows: Have a great handler, be a good groomer and be known in the showing world.

Winning shows is 10% having a good goat and 90% everything else.

You probably need to make a decision on that, because breeding for shows and breeding for production are two different things. For myself, I'd rather have stars than awards.

LoneStrChic23 · #3 02/28/11, 06:00 PM

An animal that conforms to the breed standard. If showing dairy goats, look up the ADGA for breed standards. The breed standard outlines what the ideal animal of that breed should look like and each part of the body will be judged against the I ideal as depicted by the standard...

Never shown goats other than meat goats for FFA, but I've done the dog show thing and the basics are the same.

To me, if you don't have an animal that can be competitive against the competition, then no point stepping in the ring....... So, if I were to show dairy goats, I'd buy stock from someone with a clean herd, great milk test and stock with consistent wins in the ring. I'd buy from someone who has a long track record of producing a consistent type so I know I have the best chance of the goat maturing to resemble the goats it came from...

But, I don't show goats

Mine are just home milkers.......my mini alpine was shown by the breeder in the MDGA V-Show and did well, but that's a virtual show for miniature breeds....

If you want to show your goats, find a breeder close to you with the same breed who is active in the sure ring and see if thet might be willing to evaluate your goats for you.

Oh and prepare for politics..... I've found that in almost any show world many see their wins as a great excuse to prance around with an over inflated ego.... Not all are like this, but many are.

Lots of folks use pro handlers and such to have that much more of a competitive edge as well...

GottaloveOregon · #4 02/28/11, 06:34 PM

Intresting, I will haft to check out the standards. Thanks.

copperpennykids · #5 02/28/11, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Winning shows is 10% having a good goat and 90% everything else.

Do you show goats? Because if you don't you may be applying what you have heard/learned about dogs/horses. Goat world is different.

Not saying that in some cases there might be politics (ABGA and Boer goats springs to mind!), but for the most part dairy goat shows are pretty fair. The judges of course may have different opinions, slightly different scoring, but they really try to be fair.

Case in point: Our very first show was a 2 ring show. No one knew us AT ALL. No one knew our goats. We had apparently lucked into a very nice doe from a small breeder (that no one else knew). She had WSU/VMP bloodlines, but her dam was 10 years old when she was born, so the genetics/herd name were long forgotten almost.

Anyway, we showed Dinah - as a 4 year old. We won GCH in the first ring and RGCH in the 2nd ring, under some very well-known judges, including Sam Whiteside (he is going to be a judge at ADGA Nationals this year). We did call someone before the show (who we had purchased a different goat from the prior year and who used to show) and asked about uddering up the goat and what to trim.

We also showed one Jr. doe who was GCH in one ring. The judges weren't looking to see who we were - one of the judges actually set the legs on our Jr. doe and then made her first in her class (although she ultimately did not go GCH in that ring). We did try to imitate other exhibitors in the way the led the goats, with heads held high and tweaking the back (and I can tell you we really didn't have a clue!). There were some excellent and long-time, well-known breeders there - and we were not discriminated against.

I am sure there are some judges who lack the confidence or play the "game" and tend to put up goats belonging to better known names. Funny thing is, even the well-known better breeders prefer not to show under them.

ADVICE: Look at the standard. Go to some websites and see which goats are winning and see how closely your goat matches up to the winning goats. If you can, attend a show without your goat and try to pick which goat you think will win. Look at the scorecard - 35 points to the udder, 35 points to general appearance. So not all about the udder, nor all about a pretty body.

And have fun - goat folks are generally just really nice people.

copperpennykids · #6 02/28/11, 07:35 PM

And sorry I just have to add:

We breed for production and show. With correct conformation and excellent udder structure, that goat will be able to support that incredible amount of milk she is giving for many years. And goats that go to live at non show homes, still are looking good, getting around on excellent feet and legs, kidding with ease (gotta love those nice wide backs and hips for kidding ease).

Soldier Mountain Alpines also breeds for show and production. Don't let anyone fool you into thinking a show goat is less productive.

Have to add: Have not seen any dairy goat folks walking around all puffed up with over inflated egos. Some aren't real talkative at shows as they are focused on their goats. Just like anything else, it takes time to get to know folks. Maybe goats are too loving and you have gone through too much at times to not stay a wee bit humble with the goats.

PS Have yet to see professional handlers in the goat world.

Good showman - yes. Usually the owner/breeder and sometimes a friend to help. And of course you want a good showman to help you show. Always put your best foot forward.

CaliannG · #7 02/28/11, 07:47 PM

Yes, I've shown goats. I have even ~gasp~ shown chickens. If you want a REALLY non-political, more-about-the-animal show, go with poultry or rabbits.

**mygoat** · #8 02/28/11, 08:12 PM

I showed in 4-H once - when I was young and thought 4-H would actually teach me something. Turned out, I knew more about goats than did my supervisor, who never once helped me learn to show, how to fit a goat, or ANYTHING else really. The main thing that terrified me, however, was the lack of knowledge about diseases and their transmission. One thing about shows - you are NOT required to have healthy goats at a show. Goats at a show may appear healthy but could be positive for communicable diseases.

If I could have my goats on my horse trailer and show right out of my trailer - I'd consider it. Otherwise, NO WAY. I'd probably be spraying alcohol on hooves before putting them back in the trailer, too.

Alternately, I am participating in LA and DHIR this year. LA - linear appraisal - is a scoring system used by ADGA to essentially evaluate animals for their production conformation. A well conformed goat does equate to structurally sound, productive animals. DHIR is the Dairy Herd Improvement Registry, which allows you to keep accurate milk quality records on your does. Your does milk is tested for protein, butterfat, somatic cells (mastitis), and of course - weight. Neither of these REQUIRE that you leave your farm with your animals. Though, I am traveling to a friend's disease free farm with my goats to get them LA'ed.

coso · #9 02/28/11, 08:20 PM

Haven't seen professional handlers in the dairy goat show world even at Nationals, and a lot of your top show herds are also on DHIR with top does.

Go to the ADGA website and look at the scorecard. That is what the judge uses. Is there politics involved ? Yes sometimes, but that is life !!!

jd4020 · #10 03/01/11, 12:40 AM

When I bought my first goat some 25 years ago, the young man I bought her from showed his girls in 4-H. So I tried showing. I like to watch them, and even helped my young friend show his. I realized I didn't want goats for the reason of showing them, I just wanted to enjoy them and feed my family. No commercialization of any of their products, just for us. The sharing of diseases is a strong factor but the final thing was listening to a judge talk on & on about her Jr. Class placings. She placed the first place animal because she liked the way the light shone through her hocks.
Those first few years I had a herd of 36. It took me a few more years to learn that all I needed were a buck and 2-3 does to meet our needs. One of my favorite memories is watching my children and their cousins romping and playing with about 12 little kids in our yard one afternoon. I don't know which ones were having a better time of it.

My friend still shows his Alpines and Lamanchas. He has done well at the international shows. I think he even is a judge now. I have gotten several of my girls from his herd that he couldn't show. But people have also given me their unwanted animals at times and I have done well with them too. If they end up becoming a problem they most likely go to freezer camp. Registered goats taste just as good as non-registered.
Right now I have two lovely Lamancha does. Nubby is black & white and her daughter Susie is brown with the black stripe down her back. I would like to find a Lamancha buck for them and then my group would be closed. I usually have raised Alpines, French Alpines and Saanans but since acquiring Nubby, I really like her, such a sweet personality and wonderful manners. She has a nice high and well attached udder so I'm hoping her daughter will have the same.
Well, sorry for rambling. Enjoy the shows, they are a good places for visiting with others and learning what is winning in the showring.
jd

Creamers · #11 03/01/11, 01:57 AM

I always refer to this - lol

You're wanting the mid photos -

LFRJ · #12 03/01/11, 02:39 AM

Cool graphic, Creamers. Thanks!

billooo2 · #13 03/01/11, 04:41 AM

The closest thing to a professional handler is a few of the VERY large herds have full time staff who are very good at showing the animals.
I have found that most judges seem to try to be objective. I also beat out a couple of well established breeders at one of my first shows......and I have no great showmanship skills!!!!!!!......but those skills can make the difference in a "close call" for first or second!!

pookshollow · #14 03/01/11, 10:35 AM

Quote:

I am sure there are some judges who lack the confidence or play the "game" and tend to put up goats belonging to better known names. Funny thing is, even the well-known better breeders prefer not to show under them.

Yep, we have one of those. He's friends with a rather large breeder, so if that breeder is showing, no one else has a hope. I have a very nice Saanen who was placed third behind two of this breeder's goats, that weren't even half-full in their udders. Another long-time breeder, who is also a well-respected judge, has stated that he won't bother going if that breeder is showing under that judge, because of this incident. Now, the first breeder has never been anything but nice to me, so I can't complain about him - he even offered his buck to me to use last year and delivered him to me!

Other than that, I've found goat show people to be a lot of fun. It's like old-home week when the shows start up again - and we even have parties together in the winter.

No professional handlers, either. If you've got two goats going in the ring, you grab someone who isn't showing in that class, and hand them a goat - and you do the same for them.