I want goats!!

[Laura Zone 5]

This is the year of the chicken and goat at my house!! I hope.

I have some questions.

1. Is there a good book, that walks a total city slicker through the process of keeping a couple of goats?

2. If I wanted to keep a couple of goats, how much living space will they need?

3. I want goats for milk, cheese, and soap. What is the best breed of goat for this purpose, in Zone 5 (gets pretty cold here in the winter), and I would LOVE a goat, whose milk has a high fat content.

Thank you for your time and help!!

[julieq]

I suggest "Goat Keeping 101" for reading material. I don't agree with everything in the book, but that only comes from experience. Nigerian dwarfs are great starter goats, normally have a high butterfat content (although butterfat varies in individual goats) and are very hardy. They don't need much living space at all. Ours are currently in pens in our big barn, but we've had them out in dog size kennels with calf hutches (or large dog houses) before. We're in the high desert in Southern Idaho, also zone 5 I think. They do fine in the freezing cold winter temps. Best of luck!

[Minelson]

I found that www.fiascofarms.com was great for a reading/learning foundation. I got all my info there and here when I got my first goat How much space do you have? I would set up for more space than you think you need. It is very cold here too and my minis do good in the cold. I feed free choice grass hay, 1/2 flake alfalfa, 1/2 cup BOSS and that is it. Not much browse this time of years..it's under the snow. But they still find stuff to browse on but spend most of the day laying in the sun.

[julieq]

We feed free choice alfalfa full time as we live in 'cow dairy country' where it's cheap. I wish we could find a nice, reliable grass mixture though especially for the horses. Most of what we've purchased in the past was just baled weeds. I was going to suggest also checking for goat breeders in your area Laura, visiting farms and talking to people. We love having new goat owners visit for 'goat talk'!

[Laura Zone 5]

We have 5 acres and 10 trees.....so lots and lots of 'field greens' (because it's not really grass! crab, and other weeds....my property used to be a cornfield).

I am looking into getting a tiller for my tractor, so I can grow my own alfalfa and hay, and that will cut down on the cost to feed them.

I have not built my building yet, but want to build it large enough to hold 4 goats (won't start with four, but if I want to 'add to the family' later).

Amazing great idea going to a goat farm / goat breeder. I have one just north of me!! I will email her right away. I will also look for the book you suggested!! Thank you so much!!

[julieq]

Building for more goats is a great idea Laura. You can't just own one goat! At first you tell yourself that you'll keep the herd small, then the kids are born and they're too cute to sell, and you have to buy out cross bucks for the next generation, and of course you need to keep daughters from your original buck to see how their udders look... Then a few years down the road you'll be mumbling to yourself, wondering how you ended up with so many goats!

[Jyllie63]

Originally Posted by julieq

Building for more goats is a great idea Laura. You can't just own one goat! At first you tell yourself that you'll keep the herd small, then the kids are born and they're too cute to sell, and you have to buy out cross bucks for the next generation, and of course you need to keep daughters from your original buck to see how their udders look... Then a few years down the road you'll be mumbling to yourself, wondering how you ended up with so many goats!

Okay...this made me LOL. I guess because it is so true .

[julieq]

It is true Jill! Fortunately our horses take up barn space during the winter and also the hot summer months, otherwise I'd just fill up the entire barn with goats. It's really sad that I don't have better impulse control...

[Jyllie63]

Originally Posted by julieq

It is true Jill! Fortunately our horses take up barn space during the winter and also the hot summer months, otherwise I'd just fill up the entire barn with goats. It's really sad that I don't have better impulse control...

We sound alot alike

[natty threads]

Originally Posted by julieq

Building for more goats is a great idea Laura. You can't just own one goat! At first you tell yourself that you'll keep the herd small, then the kids are born and they're too cute to sell, and you have to buy out cross bucks for the next generation, and of course you need to keep daughters from your original buck to see how their udders look... Then a few years down the road you'll be mumbling to yourself, wondering how you ended up with so many goats!

LOL- pretty much!

[julieq]

Originally Posted by Jyllie63

We sound alot alike

We should start a twelve step program...

[shanzone2001]

Goats are wonderful. I have found that Saanens are excellent for milking. I house my 3 goats in a very large doghouse and also have a couple of extra large igloos for them. They are living in a pasture that is about 1/3 acre. Because the pasture is small, I supplement with alfalfa and grain, which you may not have to do as much if you have a larger pasture or can rotate pastures and grow your own feed.
How exciting for you! We just had our doe bred so we are excited about having kids and lots of fresh goat milk. Beware....goats are extremely addicting!!! haha

[Manchamom]

Okay, here's how you start. You want to build for 4 so you build a 8x16 foot shed. On the front you have poles 5ft higher than the building, holding the roof. If someone asks tell them it's for the hawks to sit on. They control mice...When you need a milking room you build another 8x8 room on the shed still leaving the front pole 5 ft higher than the building.
Then you get tired of taking your does to the buck and decide to buy your own. Well it costs just as much to feed a wether as a buck so, you decide to buy 2 bucks to keep each other company, You want them close but seperated from the does and while you're building a new shed you might as well include a feed room because you're sick of hauling feed to the goat building. You know they get bigger than does and need more room so you measure out 8 feet from the doe shed and build exactly the same way leaving more posts for hawks to sit on. The bucks get an 8x12 foot pen and you get an 8x12 foot feet room.
Suddenly you just get sick of caring for goats in the rain or wind, snow whatever and you need a kid pen anyway. So you build across the back, put a roof and sides over the hawk poles and create a kid pen in the back of the new aisle.
The wind is still blowing in the front though and you need storage for seldom used equipment, So, you put a door on the front and put a loft off the hawk poles.
Its working pretty good now but, you are tired of fighting dry does to get to the milkers. So you put a 8 x24 foot loafing shed off of the doe pen, enclosed on 3 sides for protection from weather and get a livestock guardian if needed.
By now your goats have increased and your patting yourself on the back for building for 20.

[shanzone2001]

Originally Posted by Manchamom

Okay, here's how you start. You want to build for 4 so you build a 8x16 foot shed. On the front you have poles 5ft higher than the building, holding the roof. If someone asks tell them it's for the hawks to sit on. They control mice...When you need a milking room you build another 8x8 room on the shed still leaving the front pole 5 ft higher than the building.
Then you get tired of taking your does to the buck and decide to buy your own. Well it costs just as much to feed a wether as a buck so, you decide to buy 2 bucks to keep each other company, You want them close but seperated from the does and while you're building a new shed you might as well include a feed room because you're sick of hauling feed to the goat building. You know they get bigger than does and need more room so you measure out 8 feet from the doe shed and build exactly the same way leaving more posts for hawks to sit on. The bucks get an 8x12 foot pen and you get an 8x12 foot feet room.
Suddenly you just get sick of caring for goats in the rain or wind, snow whatever and you need a kid pen anyway. So you build across the back, put a roof and sides over the hawk poles and create a kid pen in the back of the new aisle.
The wind is still blowing in the front though and you need storage for seldom used equipment, So, you put a door on the front and put a loft off the hawk poles.
By now your goats have increased and your patting yourself on the back for building for 20.

Sounds great!!! Want to come build me one???
I have put an offer on a house with a nice sized barn/shed so I am looking forward to having a nice place to put my goats and their feed!

[Manchamom]

Ahh, you replied before I edited to add the loafing shed. Build one, sure, I love working with other people, it's my own fustrations I can't seem to get past sometimes. Maybe I just need an outsiders veiw on my little place.

[petaddict]

It IS crazy how we think (well, I mean crazy to other people, not us). This is the year I say I can't keep any of my babies. I already have enough, right? But then, every breeding I want to know what that breeding produced (milkers I mean) and you can't really know that for a few years, right? So how do you stop the vicious cycle?

You're getting good advice about building bigger than you think you'll need. I started by building a 16X16 foot barn, then extended it another 16X16. Now I need way more space.

[motdaugrnds]

Manchamom, that was so funny!

Laura, what you're reading in your thread is absolutely true! Goats are addictive! This means if you truly want to keep a "small" herd, you need to develop (and maintain) that mindset! (Those 2 goats will breed and produce more; so you will need to decide on what to do with the new additions to your herd on a yearly basis. Also, eventually you will more than likely want your own buck!)

As for "living space" they will need: It is actually more of a question as to how much working space you will need. You stated you wanted milk, cheese and soap from those goats. This, of course, means milking enough goats to get the amount of milk you want to create all that. (I doubt 2 does will do it!)

Since you're wanting milk with a high fat content, there are several breeds that provide this (some mini-size; some full-size). I wanted that as well and chose "Nubians". (The Toggenburgs are great too; and the best milk I ever drank was from a Togg.)

Housing: Since you are in a cold zone, I suspect there will be many times your goats will "not" want to venture out of your barn. Thus, they need a housing space that will give them room to bounce around and play in (and pot/pee in) that will keep the soiled bedding to a minimum so as to give them "clean" areas in which to sleep and/or give birth. The "size" of this will depend on the size of goat you choose. (This may sound silly, but if you picture yourself as one of those goats, how much space would you like?)

Other housing needs: A place to milk, to store feed, & to store baled hay. (These can either be one room partitioned or separate areas altogether.) You, also, need a place to put any goat needing extra care...a place keeping that goat separate from the others but where it can still "see" the others.

Then we get to their dietary needs. I am guessing you've already done some research on this; and you already know they are "not" grazers but enjoy browsing instead. This means, of course, that any area(s) you provide for them to browse in needs to contain plant life that will keep them healthy.

Good luck with your goats and do give us some pictures when you get them.

[Oat Bucket Farm]

Originally Posted by julieq

We should start a twelve step program...

But we already have one.

step 1. see goats on TV/in a magazine/on the internet

step 2. think they are neat and read a little about them

step 3. start thinking you might want some someday

step 4. see a goat in person and fall completely in love

step 5. decide that you definitely want goats after you have everything ready

step 6. (this is an important one) join forum full of goat addiction enablers or GAE's

step 7. talk to GAE's and start feeling that you really can't wait as long as you thought you could

step 8. read every link they give you

step 9. read posts on the forum made by the GAE's about pregnant goat bellies and look at pictures of baby goats and talk of wonderful milk and soap.

step 10. put deposits on a couple of disease free doelings (you learned about diseases from all of those GAE's) to be born in a couple of months because you can't stand waiting a moment longer

step 11. drag significant other out into the cold to help you build shelters and fencing as you scramble to be ready for the new arrivals.

step 12. bring home baby goats, fall completely and totally in love, start making breeding plans within a couple of weeks and purchase a buckling and friend for him two weeks later and the cute little doeling you saw for sale on the forum a couple of weeks later. Then put up another shelter and pen for buckling, realize that maybe you do have room for that other cute little doeling you saw on that website and that maybe that handsome buckling you saw on the forum would be a good idea too because you will need someone to breed next year's babies too because you have to keep some of them to see how they turn out...

[RedSonja]

Originally Posted by Manchamom

Okay, here's how you start. You want to build for 4 so you build a 8x16 foot shed...

...By now your goats have increased and your patting yourself on the back for building for 20.

[olivehill]

This is precisely why I don't have goats yet. I want them, I desperately want my own dairy, I just know one sweet little milk doe will turn into five, though, and I do NOT need five goats. I just want one (actually found the most BEAUTIFUL doeling last spring, wonder if her owner still has her... hmmm) doe for milk, want to take her to a buck and sell the babies. That's IT.

But then.... babies are so cute.