Son in Laws's Goats die

PotBellyPigs · #1 08/29/10, 02:35 PM

My son in law's Alpine herd has been QUICKLY reduced to just 2 goats, an old buck and doe.

The symptoms are rough coat, thinning of body, and lastly loose stool, then died.
They were first treated with Heart Guard goat dewormer(about 2 months ago), and later Ivomectin(about 3 days ago).

There has been word, that whole herds have been lost in Ohio, due to this parasite.

How does one get rid of it?

Any ideas out there?

QoTL · #2 08/29/10, 02:54 PM

I'm a newbie myself, so probably not a lot of help.

But I would ask what the goats are eating, what they are getting for a mineral, what age(s) were the ones that died?

Has he had the stools sampled to find out if it is, in fact, a parasite? Worming is great, but if that isn't the actual problem it isn't going to correct it.

Generally, I worm then worm again 10 days later.

Haven · #3 08/29/10, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PotBellyPigs

There has been word, that whole herds have been lost in Ohio, due to this parasite.

How does one get rid of it?

Any ideas out there?

What parasite? Did he know for sure they had a parasite/?

HappyFarmer · #4 08/29/10, 03:26 PM

What parasite? Has a fecal been done to determine which one?? Barber pole worm (HC) maybe?? Were they anemic?

I would get a fecal sample to the vet for identification.

I would get the body of one of the dead animals to the state lab to determine cause of death (this may be free through your state ag).

I would worm the last buck & doe immediately with Cydectin, penning them in a small pen for 24-48 hours so they shed the potential resistant worms in that area.

Then I would take the remaining 2 goats off any pasture or browse & dry lot them (dried hay, dried grains, dried alfalfa) for a minimum of 30 days, or until you can be sure the parasite has been dealt with. Dry lotting them will stop the cycle (if indeed it is a worm).

You need to identify the parasite before you can effectively treat for it.
What strength & dosage were you giving for Ivermec?

Please let us know what you find out.

HF

Alice In TX/MO · #5 08/29/10, 03:57 PM

If you mean Safe Guard goat dewormer, it's ineffective for HC worms in most areas of the country.

susanne · #6 08/29/10, 04:02 PM

a goat herd only dies if the parasite (if it is one to begin with) is not correctly identified in a timely manner.
did he go to the vet when the first goats died???

Alice In TX/MO · #7 08/29/10, 04:06 PM

Also, these goats had to have appeared to be in bad condition for a while.

I'm thinking he may not want to continue with goats until he has studied their care more in depth.

Slugmar · #8 08/29/10, 04:34 PM

we can only speculate on what could have been the problem we need more info in my opion to be any help.

But if it was me I would put the last two in a dry paddock and feed them nothing but dry material and put electrolites in the water for dehydration from the loose stool. I would also have the vet do a fecal sample and if it came back with something treet from there if there was nothing wrong then I would do a blood sample and have a complete work up done and go from there.

I would take one of the dead goats in and have a cause of death determind also. If you don't have the cash for one I would then cut it open myself and check out the organs to see if you could see any problems. (make sure to do this in an area that you can sanatize and disinfect when done)

HappyFarmer · #9 08/29/10, 06:00 PM

I've been thinking on these deaths....

Wondering if the last of the herd died because they were de-wormed, as in they were so wormy with blood sucking worms they either bled to death or they got all stopped up due to the sheer volume of worms (toxicitity). This coincides with being wormed, sudden loose stools, then death within 3 days or less.

How big was the herd, and when did the deaths start?

Any who I agree more information is needed, especially a fecal.

HF

betsy h. · #10 08/29/10, 07:02 PM

this may not be parasites at all- it could be a couple of other things:

summer pneumonia
or
an enterotoxemia problem.

Never waste a body- get a necropsy done as soon as you can after the death of an animal that seems strange to you. Good luck.

PotBellyPigs · #11 08/29/10, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by QoTL

I'm a newbie myself, so probably not a lot of help.

But I would ask what the goats are eating, what they are getting for a mineral, what age(s) were the ones that died?

Has he had the stools sampled to find out if it is, in fact, a parasite? Worming is great, but if that isn't the actual problem it isn't going to correct it.

Generally, I worm then worm again 10 days later.

The goats have been eating weeds/hay, and some goat feed.
He took some stool samples, but I have not heard back yet.

PotBellyPigs · #12 08/29/10, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haven

What parasite? Did he know for sure they had a parasite/?

I believe it to be ring worm, which from my understanding, eats into the stomach lining, drinking the goat's blood causing anemia and death.

PotBellyPigs · #13 08/29/10, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alice In TX/MO

If you mean Safe Guard goat dewormer, it's ineffective for HC worms in most areas of the country.

Yes, this is what I meant.
I read on the net, that Ivermectin was more effective.

PotBellyPigs · #14 08/29/10, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alice In TX/MO

Also, these goats had to have appeared to be in bad condition for a while.

I'm thinking he may not want to continue with goats until he has studied their care more in depth.

Actually, other than being thin(a condition that is normal for dairy goats, I'm told) they looked fine, up until about 3 days before death.
In fact, they "acted" fine, running to the fence for "treats"(hay, apples, carrots).

PotBellyPigs · #15 08/29/10, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by susanne

a goat herd only dies if the parasite (if it is one to begin with) is not correctly identified in a timely manner.
did he go to the vet when the first goats died???

No, sad to say, the boy simply doesn't have that much money.....
Also, sad to say, he is STILL making payments to his dad&mom for these goats.

PotBellyPigs · #16 08/29/10, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by betsy h.

this may not be parasites at all- it could be a couple of other things:

summer pneumonia
or
an enterotoxemia problem.

Never waste a body- get a necropsy done as soon as you can after the death of an animal that seems strange to you. Good luck.

I don't think so, since they never appeared "bloated" to me and they had access to lush grass pasture.
They're noses were not running.

PotBellyPigs · #17 08/29/10, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyFarmer

What parasite? Has a fecal been done to determine which one?? Barber pole worm (HC) maybe?? Were they anemic?

I would get a fecal sample to the vet for identification.

I would get the body of one of the dead animals to the state lab to determine cause of death (this may be free through your state ag).

I would worm the last buck & doe immediately with Cydectin, penning them in a small pen for 24-48 hours so they shed the potential resistant worms in that area.

Then I would take the remaining 2 goats off any pasture or browse & dry lot them (dried hay, dried grains, dried alfalfa) for a minimum of 30 days, or until you can be sure the parasite has been dealt with. Dry lotting them will stop the cycle (if indeed it is a worm).

You need to identify the parasite before you can effectively treat for it.
What strength & dosage were you giving for Ivermec?

Please let us know what you find out.

HF

I gave the dosage recommended on the packaging of Ivermectin(which is oral), estimating their body weights to be 170# and 225#.
I am most concerned about this out break because I own dairy goats myself(none of them being Alpines, though).

PotBellyPigs · #18 08/29/10, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyFarmer

I've been thinking on these deaths....

Wondering if the last of the herd died because they were de-wormed, as in they were so wormy with blood sucking worms they either bled to death or they got all stopped up due to the sheer volume of worms (toxicitity). This coincides with being wormed, sudden loose stools, then death within 3 days or less.

How big was the herd, and when did the deaths start?

Any who I agree more information is needed, especially a fecal.

HF

His herd was not super large, only 6 Alpines.
Their stool was pellets, almost up until they died.
When the loose stool arrived, they were very near death.
It appeared to me, that blood was in the mouth of one........

goatkid · #19 08/29/10, 10:53 PM

Ringworm is a fungus, not a worm. It's the blood sucking worms like barberpole worms that cause the problems. Since several goats died quite suddenly, they may have eaten something toxic in their pasture. Goats with pneumonia don't necessarily have runny noses. I had one last year with no runny nose and a subnormal temp rather than a fever. The vet diagnosed her after listening to her lungs. He treated her with Draxxin, Banamine and B complex and she recovered.

PotBellyPigs · #20 08/29/10, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goatkid

Ringworm is a fungus, not a worm. It's the blood sucking worms like barberpole worms that cause the problems. Since several goats died quite suddenly, they may have eaten something toxic in their pasture. Goats with pneumonia don't necessarily have runny noses. I had one last year with no runny nose and a subnormal temp rather than a fever. The vet diagnosed her after listening to her lungs. He treated her with Draxxin, Banamine and B complex and she recovered.

Orchard grass and normal weeds, toxic?
These goats were also NOT "coughing", except of course, when they happened to get choked on food.......
Perhaps it would be beneficial to drop some electrolytes with vitamins in their drinking water?