help with weaning

moday · #1 04/15/10, 11:18 AM

Our boer kids are 6 wks old next Wed. We would like to begin weening them soon, as they lost their mother after the birth. They have little to no interest in grain or hay. I think that browse a bit in the pasture.

Any suggestions how to speed it along?

It's been a long road feeding them by bottle and would like to get them going on other foods.

Isn't 6 wks plenty of formula ? Any suggestions on how to get them interested in more "adult like" food.

Thanks, MO

thaiblue12 · #2 04/15/10, 11:41 AM

Six weeks is far too young. Boers usually wean their kids at 5 months old. Not saing you have to bottle that long. I bottle feed 3 to 4 months old depending on size and breed.

You can cut down and bottle them 3 times day now or two larger bottles.
I currently have five 3 month old bottle kids and they are down to 1 bottle a day getting ready to be weaned and they are unhappy and of course starving!!

My kids eat with the adults and they decide when they are going to start nibbling on hay and the feed, usually about 2 to 3 weeks old and they also start showing an interest in dirnking water around then as well. My kids eat grass hay, alfalfa pellets and a small bit of 3 way grain, how many bottles depend on age. They do go out into the field and browse and graze.

I do understand the bottle kid frustration, after the first month it looses it's cuteness and they become pests. I have 7 bottle kids right now and 4 are so annoying I have threatened to duct tape them to the wall

Maybe you can use a lambar and not hand feed them, might make it easier on you.

garyh141 · #3 04/15/10, 10:46 PM

I thought the rumen wasn't fully operational until 12 weeks? Sandra

April · #4 04/16/10, 08:57 AM

The best thing I ever did was switch from bottles to a lambar setup. The bottle-time stress decreased to almost zero.

QoTL · #5 04/16/10, 10:08 AM

I won't pretend to be an expert here, so take whatever I say with a grain of salt.

But there was a sentence by someone (can't remember who) that said if your bottle babies are always full on milk, they won't bother to try eating any 'real' food. It makes perfect sense to me. Last year, my doe raised her own kid, and she barely let her nurse by this age. Baby was still nursing for several months, but it was sip, sip, and mom walked off. So.. baby tried hay, grain, etc. Still sip, sip, but other stuff too.

My 7wk bottle babies are growing like bad weeds. I give them two bottles a day, plus hay free choice and grain (which they suck up so fast I'm starting to keep an eye on how much they are eating :P ). They get separated from everyone else at night still, so that gives them a go at the hay without the competition from the big guys. Mine aren't starving, in fact a few times I've wondered if I should skip a bottle because tummies are already round and 'full' looking.

ozark_jewels · #6 04/16/10, 03:17 PM

Ruminant babies need milk for at least three months for optimal health in my experience. Goes for kids, lambs and calves. 6 weeks is way too young to wean. Maybe cut back some, but they still need that milk. Especially if it is formula, which doesn't give them as good a start as real milk.
How often each day are you bottling them??

I lambar raise my kids and they pretty much have milk in front of them 24/7. They are always eating hay/grain and browsing by 4 weeks of age, starting nibbling long before that. So keeping your kids well milk-fed will not discourage them to start eating solids.

Pony · #7 04/16/10, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozark_jewels

Ruminant babies need milk for at least three months for optimal health in my experience. Goes for kids, lambs and calves. 6 weeks is way too young to wean. Maybe cut back some, but they still need that milk. Especially if it is formula, which doesn't give them as good a start as real milk.
How often each day are you bottling them??

I lambar raise my kids and they pretty much have milk in front of them 24/7. They are always eating hay/grain and browsing by 4 weeks of age, starting nibbling long before that. So keeping your kids well milk-fed will not discourage them to start eating solids.

Does the lambar have some sort of temp controller on it, or do they just suck it all down so fast that you don't have to worry about heating and/or spoilage? (Does that question make sense?)

Maybe I should be looking into a lambar...

ozark_jewels · #8 04/21/10, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pony

Does the lambar have some sort of temp controller on it, or do they just suck it all down so fast that you don't have to worry about heating and/or spoilage? (Does that question make sense?)

Maybe I should be looking into a lambar...

Sorry I missed this!
During the cold months I leave the lambar out after they get full and just bring it in to thaw/warm in a sink of hot water for the next feeding. I make sure it is thawed three times a day.
When it starts getting warmer, the milk does start to thicken/clabber between fill-ups. I have found that older kids do very well on this, but I don't allow younger kids(a month or younger) to eat on the soured milk as I have had problems with that. Not usually a problem since my young kids don't usually run with my older kids.
If I had running water, I would wash the buckets out every day(just run hot soapy water through the lines, then follow it with cold bleach water), but since I don't have running water, I just wash them out every other day.

dosthouhavemilk · #9 04/21/10, 12:15 PM

Something important to keep in mind is that Emily is using *raw* milk.
I would also ask those that use Pastuerized milk how they do things with the lambar. Pastuerized milk and raw milk act differently. The raw milk will keep the baddies under control, whereas the pastuerized milk is a breeding ground.
We use raw milk as well in our lambars and just leave them out. Dad rinses with very hot water (hot enough to burn after only a second) between refills with fresh milk from the cows.
He'll do a complete break down every once in awhile. If we were using pastuerized milk, we would likely do it differently. We would need to be far more sanitary for sure.

ozark_jewels · #10 04/21/10, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dosthouhavemilk

Something important to keep in mind is that Emily is using *raw* milk.
I would also ask those that use Pastuerized milk how they do things with the lambar. Pastuerized milk and raw milk act differently. The raw milk will keep the baddies under control, whereas the pastuerized milk is a breeding ground.

ABSOLUTELY!!! I should have specified that. Thank you!

While raw milk will sour and clabber, pasturized milk will literally rot.

LomahAcres · #11 04/21/10, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozark_jewels

ABSOLUTELY!!! I should have specified that. Thank you!

While raw milk will sour and clabber, pasturized milk will literally rot.

How long does it take for pasteurized milk to rot in the lambar? We've just started feeding it free choice, but I bring it in at night because of the temperature change from 70' milk in day to 50' milk in the night, didn't think that would be good for them? We always start with fresh and it's used up or dumped within 24 hours so never more then a day old. I give the group 12 quarts at about 10am. I keep checking it but let them drink it dry and then replenish - about 5pm. Bring it in in the evening about 10pm, and offer it back for an hour at about 2-3am. I have them from 3-5 weeks of age in the group. The young ones though aren't yet eating by themselves so I just get them on 3x's a day when the milk is put out fresh.

ozark_jewels · #12 04/21/10, 10:31 PM

Kristen, I really have no idea as I have always fed raw Jersey milk. I would think as long as you clean it out well and make sure it never smells funky, that it would be ok.

lonelyfarmgirl · #13 04/22/10, 10:27 AM

My rule for weaning doesn't go by a time table. Every baby is different. When I see them chewing cud, its time to wean. thats when you know the rumen is ready for full time hay. Feel free to cut down, but dont stop until they are chewing cud. Usually 8-10 weeks.
I am bottlefeeding 6, with one goat yet to freshen. I understand your frustration.

What is lambar feeding?

shiandpete.1 · #14 04/22/10, 10:56 AM

Lambar is a bucket with nipples around it, the lambar has nice thick grey nipples on it.

lonelyfarmgirl · #15 04/22/10, 08:08 PM

well I have abucket with nipples all around, but someone here said, I thought, they leave it out with milk all the time?

dosthouhavemilk · #16 04/22/10, 08:27 PM

Emily and I both leave lambars out with raw milk in them most of the time.

Ours are emptied and refilled three times a day. Two of those feedings are with milk straight from the cows at milking time. Any left over milk is fed to kitties and piggies.

ozark_jewels · #17 04/23/10, 09:25 AM

The lambar bucket has nipples at the top and hoses running down to the bottom of the bucket. This allows kids to feed at their own rate rather than the gravity-type feeders with nipples at the bottom. The bucket sits in a metal rim that is welded to an old tire rim so it can be set in the feeder and stay there all day. This also allows the lambar bucket and holder to easily be moved from pen to pen if needed.

Lambar bucket in use:

help with weaning - Goats

Birch Hill Farm · #18 04/23/10, 10:10 AM

Where can you purchase a lambar from? Our bottle kids are starting to scare my real kids with their frantic bumping, jumping and dying from starvation crying.

ozark_jewels · #19 04/23/10, 10:38 AM

Jeffers carries the kit in its entirety. You can also just order the nipples from Jeffers and get the tubing and bucket from a local hardware then drill the holes in the bucket yourself. Anyone who can weld, can weld you a holder.
After trying to figure it out for meself years ago before actually "seeing" a lambar system, I'd reccomend ordering the kit and then modeling the subsequent buckets on the one you bought. Unless your a real handy person.

April · #20 04/23/10, 10:52 AM

Because I use grocery store milk, I don't leave the lambars out and refill. I just put the milk for one feeding in at a time then take it out to the babies. When they're done I bring it back in and wash it.

Sometimes if I have a slow drinker I may put that baby's milk in a quart jar and put the tube for her nipple in the jar inside the lambar, then fight off the greedy goats when they try to bump her off the nipple. Those babies usually catch up eventually.

Just wanted to give you another perspective on lambar feeding.