Discipline for bottle babies?

QoTL · #1 04/03/10, 09:49 PM

My babies were jumping all over me tonight, and are getting pretty pushy about their bottles.

I'd really like to nip THAT in the bud. What is the best method to teach them to back off? How do I sound like a mama goat saying "Lay off kids!"?

Helena · #2 04/03/10, 10:15 PM

How old are they and how often are you feeding them and how much at each feeding ?? Are they eating a little hay or a little grain ?? You have to figure all that into it. They are your little babies and they love to see you..their Momma when they are hungry. Even my older does are real "animals" when they see the grain bucket coming I think someday they will stomp me into the ground to get a mouthful of grain. When you figure it out..let us all know.. Good Luck and enjoy them..they will grow up fast enough....

sammyd · #3 04/03/10, 10:27 PM

When I see a kid not battling to get at a nipple I see a sick kid.

topside1 · #4 04/04/10, 07:41 AM

There is a classic herd queen grunt that is often mimicked...That may work, maybe increasing the amount of milk they get may help. Feeding them separately is another option; weaning young may also relieve some stress. Truthfully all kidding aside it's the way baby goats are and no form of discipline will correct their instincts. We all know how tasty milk can be…..Topside

Alice In TX/MO · #5 04/04/10, 08:49 AM

Feed them through the fence.

Ken in Maine · #6 04/04/10, 09:08 AM

Why would you want to nip THAT in the bud... that's typical baby goat behavior! Right now we are bottle feeding 11 ranging in age from 2 days to 8 weeks with individual bottles. We also have 7 more does to kid over the next 3 weeks. We would not trade that experience for the world. That is the fun of having those little ones. We can and probably never will be able to teach goats to act like well behaved children THEY'RE GOATS FOR god's SAKE! We/you need to learn and be comfortable with normal goat behavior or find some other type of livestock that would be better suited.

Maybe the subtitle explains it " blissfully unaware"

Of course some may find this reply offensive but reality often is.

topside1 · #7 04/04/10, 09:18 AM

Love reality...thanks Ken.

cowbelle · #8 04/04/10, 10:37 AM

Yes, as the others have said, it's goat behavior - in trying to change it, you'll make them afraid of you. Set up a lamb-bar or hang bottle holders on the fence. When you set up all your feeding systems so that you can feed from outside the fence, - hay, water, whatever grain supplement, you will be able to go on with your day, dressed but without muddy footprints as your "accessories". When I had my goat dairy, I had hay racks that you could drive by and put the hay into, automatic waterers, and they got their grain in the milking stanchion. Others don't need grain. It helped soooo much to be practical in the planning stage.

Ken in Maine · #9 04/04/10, 12:29 PM

Domesticating animals does not mean making them act like we want them to. It does mean that we watch animal behavior and adjust our lives to fit their circumstances. If you watch an animals behavior and little by little reward that animal everytime you see it do that then eventually the animal will do the action everytime it sees the opportunity for reward.

Pavlov's dog type stuff.

QoTL · #10 04/04/10, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken in Maine

Why would you want to nip THAT in the bud... that's typical baby goat behavior! Right now we are bottle feeding 11 ranging in age from 2 days to 8 weeks with individual bottles. We also have 7 more does to kid over the next 3 weeks. We would not trade that experience for the world. That is the fun of having those little ones. We can and probably never will be able to teach goats to act like well behaved children THEY'RE GOATS FOR god's SAKE! We/you need to learn and be comfortable with normal goat behavior or find some other type of livestock that would be better suited.

Maybe the subtitle explains it " blissfully unaware"

Of course some may find this reply offensive but reality often is.

Ken- that's totally uncalled for. You do not know me, nor know my situation. Personal attacks are childish. I am grateful most goat owners are not like this.

To everyone who offered HELPFUL and/or insights into goats, thank you for your input. I will no longer be checking this thread, because frankly I don't need people attacking me due to whatever preconceived notion they may have.

Animals are not people. Nor do I expect my goats (of ANY age) to patiently wait in line. However, that cute 20lb bottle baby jumping on my legs will one day be a 200lb goat jumping on me and knocking me over.

We CAN train dogs not to jump, and I assumed it must be possible TO ALSO train goats not to.

topside1 · #11 04/04/10, 01:46 PM

Huge difference between training a doeling/buckling vice adult goats. My adults are better trained then most dogs....The whole point is that it's difficult to control young kids, let the kids be kids. Use Alice's recommendation and you'll never be jump on again....Topside

Ken in Maine · #12 04/04/10, 03:13 PM

Where do you see this as a personal attack.. You asked a question and you were given an answer... just because you read something into this that does not make it personal...
You should note that words I used came from you OP.

Oooops... I forgot you're not reading this thread anymore....

deineria · #13 04/04/10, 07:15 PM

I do understand not wanting a 100-200lb goat jumping ALL over you and such, and some bottle babies carry that behavior over to adulthood. We have one unruly doe that - at 100lbs - is SO friendly, but she still jumps all over us like a bottle baby. I wish I'd figured out something to break her of that long before now because my young children and sister can't be around her. All of the other goats opted to leave that behavior behind once they ceased being bottle-fed.
I think goats can learn as kid just as well as puppies. It is no different than not wanting or allowing a 12 week old puppy to poop and pee all over your house and say, "Well, dogs will be dogs."
I push them off and down, and some learn, some do not. Now, this applies when they have been fed. Goats get so wild over bottles, it is hard to prevent any behavior, but once they have had a bottle, I do try to push them down over and over and teach that isn't a good behavior.

topside1 · #14 04/04/10, 07:57 PM

An adult goat that jumps on anyone needs a human knee to the brisket, they usually get the idea rather quickly. I've raised countless numbers of dairy goat kids, the adults turned out fine. Once again let the kids be kids, they grow up so quickly...Topside

freedomfrom4 · #15 04/04/10, 08:26 PM

My big goats get at eye level with me much to often. I wish It were not so

My nubians jump up to give kisses for treats resulting in our injury at times. I can't seem to fix the problem. Add grain to the mix and it is down right scary at times.

topside1 · #16 04/04/10, 08:32 PM

Sounds nearly out of control...good luck.

jil101ca · #17 04/04/10, 08:59 PM

I disagree, I have started to tach all my kids not to jump on me, I do not want a 150 lb jumping on me. Goats are trained to pull, backpack and behave in the show ring. Like any "kid" training should start young.I use my angry voice and push them down, telling them "down" they are also learning "back" so I don't get swarmed going in and out of their pen. Buddie is also in training on how to walk and stand, we may be entering a show in June with him depending on how he is behaving.

LomahAcres · #18 04/04/10, 09:44 PM

Push them down. As soon as they jump up or you see them start to. With your hand, or knee, leg, foot. Again and again and again - it will take a while, so get used to it. Hard, if you need to. You don't want to hurt them, but just enough to get your point across. Training a large group of bottle babies will be undoubtedly the most difficult. But smaller groups of 2 or 3 are much more manageable and they catch on quicker. Think of them like puppies. When it's feeding time, I don't normally bother, they are too hyped up to really notice anything but milk. But at play time with full bellies, this is when to get your training in. The last thing you want is 130-200#'s of goat suddenly forced against your back/front as many babies will carry this into adulthood if unchecked. Normally it wears off by 2-3 years of age, if you can live with it that long, but why risk the injury?

shiandpete.1 · #19 04/04/10, 09:56 PM

"Let babies be babies" well when those babies are jumping on your back, onto your son who is little no matter what time it is, feed time play time whatever, it is annoying and eventually becomes habit. I see what QOTL is talking about and manners can be taught eventually. I agree with pushing them down and correcting the behavior. And yes we have 8 bottle babies and manners get worked on daily. I hope QOTL that you have read this thread again and ignored the rude comments.

motdaugrnds · #20 04/04/10, 10:18 PM

I agree with jil101ca. Goats are easy to train if you have the patience. I have taught my kids not to jump on me and even my huge 250 lb bucks to walk beside me, stopping when I do, so I can lean on them if I am tired. It just takes consistent patience. Yes, I did get a few bruises; but not from any attempts to hurt me. Accidents simply happen.

I do not hesitate to give my does a hard slap on the rump if they don't behave on the milking stand. It doesn't take too many slaps for them to stand still while up there.

It is important to remember goats have memories like elephants. I do believe goats can understand what discipline is. They use it to teach their own kids. However, never mistreat a goat or one day you may be mistreated by that goat.

One of my first purchases was a Togg who was frightened by most everything that got near her. She was constantly trying to bite me when I tried to milk or even just pet her. I would kiss her on the nose. It wasn't long before she was getting between me and a large dog running toward me as she was not trusting the dog and was protecting me.

As for kids, I often sit in the barn with new borns and their mothers. It is easy to gently stop a kid from getting rough with you. Just don't let that kid get the idea you are "playing" with it or you will be setting up the very situation you want to curb.