HELP! Goat Emergency

[beccachow]

Temperature? Need to drag up a thermometer
Symptoms? Diarrhea, liquid, copious
When was the last time you wormed? Fall
Wormed with what and how much? Feed through, and Ivermectin
What age? About 2, give or take a few months
Breed? Nuby/Boer
Do you vaccinate? Yes
What do her lungs sound like when she is breathing? Normal
If a buck is he peeing normally or straining? No, no straining
Have they had a change of grain? Yes, owner recently decided goat was too thin, I suspect has been feeding too much
How long have you owned this goat? 2 years

My wether, ------, is at my barn, owned by a teenage boy. Recently, we noticed that he had dropped a lot of weight, he had been getting quality hay only. The boy started giving him grain twice a day-I have tried to give him smaller amounts, I suspect the boy is going a bit overboard (I am terrified of UC). We had a plan to worm, but needed to do all of the goats, together, and needed two of us, was going to worm in the next few days.

Appetite: still good, but will withdraw food from him immediately
Activity level, still normal (no star gazing, no corner standing, no lethargy noted)
Scouring noted today only, it looks as though it only began a few hours ago by the wetness of the messes. No blood noted.

Please, I need immediate advice on drying him up, and treatment plus thoughts. I will call a vet if I need to, do I need to?

[mpete]

Okay.... take a deep breathe...
Does he have free choice grain? if so, take it away. How much grain has he been given? Is he bloated? He needs to be given probiotics to help with digestion. Scours is not anything to get upset over. You just need to watch him.
As for the weight loss, I give black oil sunflower seeds, beet pulp and a hand full of calf mana.

[cmharris6002]

Symptoms? Diarrhea, liquid, copious
When was the last time you wormed? Fall
Wormed with what and how much? Feed through, and Ivermectin

Barring a normal temp I suspect a heavy worm load or cocci. See if you can find anything on a fecal.

I doubt the feed through Iver did much good as most goats simply can not consume enough to make it work. I'd use Cydectin Pour on for cattle ORALLY at 1cc/22# or Ivermectin Plus injectable ORALLY at 1cc/30# every ten days for 30 days then get a fecal and see if you got everything.

If it turns out to be cocci I like DiMethox 40% injectable given ORALLY at 1cc per 10 pounds for 5 days. Do it every 20 days.

[betsy h.]

OK> there is a form of clostridium that has shown these symptoms- not sure how it would have gotten to you, but the immediate treatment when you first see the copious poo is to give a skookum dose of Pen per the size of goat, then dose w/ C&D antitoxin. Neither of these will hurt him, even if it is not the actual cause. Be sure to steal cud from another goat and save till he's ready to restart. Pepto is OK, but the Pen is the thing. Keep the Pen up for a few days.

The key RIGHT NOW is to keep him hydrated, so keep offering electrolytes, not milk or molasses, etc. If he will not drink get your dose syringe and keep dosing him every 15-20 mins, or so. No feed whatsoever. Get some poop and get a fecal, then worm as you need to. All this wet weather has brought out this clostridium and we won;t see the end of it- when you vaccinate, personally, I suggest using a multi-valent vaccine like Covexin8. Keep hay and water in front of him and keep him warm.

Andrea Forrest of Forrest Pride LM's has been tracking herds that suddenly have these symptoms and has more info than I do, but do not hesitate to give him meds- time is of the essence with this stuff. Get in touch w/ her if you need more info.

[beccachow]

OK, gave him high dose thiamine, high dose penicillin. Forgot about C&D antitoxin, off to do it now. If he lets me anywhere near him, after the first two shots!! I will go to the store for some gatorade as soon as I can. Off to see if I have DiMethox, that sounds really familiar as something I have here.

[Bearfootfarm]

Give him some Pepto Bismol and stop the grain and I bet he will clear right up

[beccachow]

He is still maintaining, hasn't started with any of the big Badies (stargazing, hunched up and so forth). A girl who has goats stopped by fro an evaluation and suggested yogurt, gatorade, hay and Pepto. She suggested that continuing meds was "up to me" but that she felt ok with a wait and see. My problem, if you guys recall, I have lost 3 goats to entero/polio coccidia or some such related thing. And what I most recall...I didn't have TIME to wait and see, they were gone within a day. The teenager is all about waiting to see, his mom agrees that she isn't sure what to do since the loss of the others. I did get a second dose of fortified B vitamin, and pennicillin in him, plus a dose of CD antitoxin. He IS still eating, in fact he ate some yummy yogurt and drank an entire small bottle of Pedialyte. He looks a little droopy, very poopy, and of food, he desires a scoopy. (which he is NOT getting). His gums look a tad pale, but I am not the best judge of gums since to me, all goats and sheep have pale gums!!

Should I keep going with meds, or wait and see? ------ is an awesome goat, and I have been through enough heartache to worry about just letting him go without intervention...on the other hand, maybe I have "too much" knowledge and am making this harder than it needs to be. I have it on very very good suspicion that the teen was feeding this fellow a LOT more than needed...I was worried for UC and Polio. We will be worming, and I will scoop some poop for the vet to do a fecal...can any vet do the fecal or must it be a large animal vet?

Thank you all for your words and advice.

[HappyFarmer]

Yes I agree with this treatment.

[QUOTE=betsy h.;4308197]OK> there is a form of clostridium that has shown these symptoms- not sure how it would have gotten to you, but the immediate treatment when you first see the copious poo is to give a skookum dose of Pen per the size of goat, then dose w/ C&D antitoxin. Neither of these will hurt him, even if it is not the actual cause. Be sure to steal cud from another goat and save till he's ready to restart. Pepto is OK, but the Pen is the thing. Keep the Pen up for a few days.

The key RIGHT NOW is to keep him hydrated, so keep offering electrolytes, not milk or molasses, etc. If he will not drink get your dose syringe and keep dosing him every 15-20 mins, or so. No feed whatsoever. Get some poop and get a fecal, then worm as you need to. All this wet weather has brought out this clostridium and we won;t see the end of it- when you vaccinate, personally, I suggest using a multi-valent vaccine like Covexin8. Keep hay and water in front of him and keep him warm.

[betsy h.]

If you've had this on your farm before, this could be a replay of same.

Keep up the Pen for a few days, and the rest of the treatment. Andrea says if you get the meds into them when you 1st see it, they have a very good chance of recovery. The more time in between, the chance goes down greatly.

[Natural Beauty Farm]

Any vet can do fecal, tell them its a goat and if they don't know what to look for ask who to go to.

Pale gums.... get fecal very soon.

FYI. State labs do necropsy for very cheap, well worth the knowledge you gain from their reports and most are staffed by very experienced vets that teach or taught large animal practice at ag colleges. That is who I call when I have a problem I can't figure out.

[cmharris6002]

Pale gums.... get fecal very soon.

I agree with NBF. Please get a fecal on this goat. With your past experience you are doing what you know to do. But it could also be a heavy worm load. You need to know or at least be able to rule it out...

[beccachow]

Update: he made it through the night, and looks like he *might* be drying out a little. I had given him a oh-so-yummy Gatorade/yogurt/pepto smoothie last night. He had the gatorade pepto smoothie this AM, and as disgusting as it sounds, he is drinking it. I gave him hay, and he is eating it.

Agreed, will get a fecal. There is a large animal vet about 45 minutes out, that would probably be my best bet. (though they really know nothing about goats).

I'll keep you posted, and thank you all.

[Minelson]

Originally Posted by beccachow

Update: he made it through the night, and looks like he *might* be drying out a little. I had given him a oh-so-yummy Gatorade/yogurt/pepto smoothie last night. He had the gatorade pepto smoothie this AM, and as disgusting as it sounds, he is drinking it. I gave him hay, and he is eating it.

Agreed, will get a fecal. There is a large animal vet about 45 minutes out, that would probably be my best bet. (though they really know nothing about goats).

I'll keep you posted, and thank you all.

Glad he is doing better! If you have a small animal vet closer they may do the fecal for you...worth asking. My vet would

[Bricheze]

I would have suspected overfeed from the first post but glad he is doing better

--oh and the proper name for that cross is apparently boobian from now on!

[KimM]

Cute!!

beccachow, I'd repeat the antitoxin a few times as well and even give him some orally too. It won't hurt him.

Originally Posted by Bricheze

I would have suspected overfeed from the first post but glad he is doing better

--oh and the proper name for that cross is apparently boobian from now on!

[Backfourty,MI.]

I would give him the C & D antitoxin & also get the fecal done.
I have a recipe for homemade electrolyte water that I got here I while ago but can't remember from who? I have used it after kiddings, etc. & when I do make it up the goats drink it right up.

1 liter water( I use warm)
2 TBSP. Sugar or Honey
1/4 tsp. salt
1/4 tsp. Baking soda

I wouldn't give him any grain either. When he is back to normal & you want to help build him up or give him grain I would only use the medicated feed with the ammonium chloride already in it.

[shiandpete.1]

I liked your rhyme Becca! Any more news? We have a tog wether that if he looks at grain he gets the poos. I keep kaopectate on hand just for him.