FF teats....looking good!!

[desertshi]

I have two FF does about to deliver this week or the next. They both have such differences in their udders. One, Wisdom, looks like I would imagine a FF udder to look like. Small teats, similar to those of a mature sheep and has a bag but isn't developed too much as of yet. The second doe, Faith has a HUGE udder and large, long, thick teats like those of a cow!! I am soo surprised because I was waiting for itty bitty FF teats like I hear everyone talk about and like what Wisdom has! Needless to say, I am very, very happy with what I am seeing so far on Faith. We will see how her production is though.

Does this happen often?? I must put in here too that she came from a herd that is nowhere near being registered or bred with careful planning as to high milk production!! lol. Or is she just one of a kind??!!

[QoTL]

I don't know, but I have a ff with teats that I pretty much have to milk with my thumb, ring finger and pinky... She's my first milking goat and I feel like it would take an hr for me to actually milk her out (and she's outta there, bucking and acting horrid as soon as she sucks down her grain..)


Lucky you!!


Meghan

[steff bugielski]

I've got one like that.She is not due till the 19th but I might have a few surprises this morning. Her udder looks like it will be wonderful.

[desertshi]

Originally Posted by QoTL

I don't know, but I have a ff with teats that I pretty much have to milk with my thumb, ring finger and pinky... She's my first milking goat and I feel like it would take an hr for me to actually milk her out (and she's outta there, bucking and acting horrid as soon as she sucks down her grain..)


Lucky you!!


Meghan

Only 1/2 lucky!! My other girl, Wisdom, looks like she is going to be PAINFULL to milk too!!!

[chamoisee]

It isn't so much about the size of the teat as it is about the size of the orifice. Big teats with teeny orifices are a real pain to milk. I woudl much rather milk inch long teats with nice orifices. Of course, the worst is teeny teats with needle thin (beading needle thin!) streams of milk....

And the odd thing is that while teat size usually increases, orifice size doesn't seem to.

[madness]

Gotta agree with Helianthus here. We have four FF and I've just learned to milk. One has decent sized teats but HUGE orifices. Even though you can't get your whole hand on her teats, she is the easiest to milk. Another has big ol' cow teats but tiny orifices so it takes longer on her. And then we have Ms. Small-teats-and-small-orifices. And she likes to kick. Ton of fun on that one!

[hoofinitnorth]

The teats can certainly change over time (with age, pregnancies, lactations, milking, and nursing), but you will see obvious differences that are there congenitally even before they freshen. If you develop your eye well, you can see it before they are even bred (I'm not good at that yet).

In my two, going on three years with ND goats so far (big grin), I have had three first-fresheners so far. Two had good teats that were easy to milk. They weren't huge, but they were adequate. One of these had huge orifices so she was very easy to empty in a flash. I do so miss her! Then I have an older doe that has AWESOME teats. You can grasp them with your whole hand and still have some sticking out. They are not blown, they are just naturally large and easy to milk. She does have smaller orifices than I would like, so it does take some effort to empty them, but she is not difficult to milk by any means. As for the third first-freshener, she has, what I consider to be, tiny teats. I am not happy, especially because I am hand-milking her. BUT, she is easy to milk with large orifices and she is very well-built in all other respects, threw beautiful babies, and milked a whopping 4#+ on her first DHI test at 3 weeks fresh to boot. It does take me a while to get her empty though, just because the teats aren't long enough to really fill up for quick expression. Hmmm. I had wanted to sell her when I saw her small teats, but now I am thinking I may give her one more year to see how she changes and to freshen her daughters and see how their teats look. She has already improved after three weeks of milking and nursing, but oh my. If I can take everything else about her and keep it, improving upon her teats, I'll have some amazing little goats that will be extremely competitive. Of course then you have the gamble of nature that even if you use a "teat buck", you may not get good teats out of her daughters. Oy!

I do have to chuckle though, I have been told that teats are only 3 points on the scorecard - I think they should be more!!! LOL This is probably why we have so many goats out there with small teats, hard to milk teats (small orifices), or teats that point this way or that. *sigh*

[Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians]

2 points.

And if more folks actually milked goats to pay their feed bills, little itty bitty titties would be gone The worst are pencil thin long teats, they colapse in your hand. Have to admit with a milking machine teats are of little consequence now, but when we hand milked 35 daily...it was a huge thought in our breeding program in our LaManchas. Vicki

[desertshi]

Originally Posted by Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians

2 points.

And if more folks actually milked goats to pay their feed bills, little itty bitty titties would be gone The worst are pencil thin long teats, they colapse in your hand. Have to admit with a milking machine teats are of little consequence now, but when we hand milked 35 daily...it was a huge thought in our breeding program in our LaManchas. Vicki

35 goats!!?? My respect to you! LOL. Was that once or twice a day?! Ouch...When we had our Holstein I would milk out 30 liters of milk from her by myself when my DH wasn't home. She had good sized teats and large orfices...my hands would cramp up just thinking about having to do it again! lol. And that is only about 6-8 good milking goats!! Yowza! lol.

[shiandpete.1]

I have two does that will be FF this year. Carla has anece shaped udder with decent teats and I have milked a ittle colostrum off of her when I needed it the other day even though she had not kidded yet and one side was easy to milk, the other not so much. Then Gloria is just starting to develop and udder but even as a kid had a great udder attachment and large nice looking teats, I am hoping she will be easy to milk with those nice sized teats. Both of their mothers are 3 and 4 * milkers and the one is a permanent champion. I milked their mamas before I bought the girls and they were easy to milk, I hope it has been passed down.

[hoofinitnorth]

I was too busy to look this up before, but I just found four different ADGA scorecards that say teats are 4 points for lactating does, 5 points for bucks. I still think they should be more!

[nehimama]

LOL! I had an Alpine-cross doe that I'd had high hopes for, as her mama have very nice teats. THIS gal, though - the teats were like pimples on a balloon. Fortunately, she was not sold as a milker; rather to produce meat kids.

NeHi

[chamoisee]

You don't have to breed according to the ADGA scorecard. Easy to milk teats were always a top priority for my breeding program, along with disposition, hardiness, rear udder attachment, feet and legs. What use is a goat that can give 2 gallons of m ilk a day if you can hardly milk her??

Cull the does who have hard to milk (large or small) teats, teats that point out instead of down, or that lack delineation from the udder. If they're fantastic otherwise, breed them to a really great buck via A.I. and keep the daughter and get rid of mom.

I wouldn't cull small teats with decent orifices though, especially in a first freshener, because the teats do enlarge in subsequent years. And HUGE teats are more susceptible to injury and are scored against on the ADGA scorecard. Frankly, I find the great big teats that men so love in a goat to be almost as hard to milk as little inch long teats.

[DairyGoatSlave]

I have a ff whos udder is so great! it fills lovely and looks great, great attachment, great position of teats, but milking her is a pain! shes a member of the ittty bitty ----- club, might as well be the presedent of it. I have very very small hands and her i have to milk with two fingers! my other ff, great size teats! absolutly perfect! bah...

[hoofinitnorth]

Originally Posted by Helianthus

You don't have to breed according to the ADGA scorecard.

Of course not (and we don't). It just shocked me that they didn't carry more weight on the scorecard.

Originally Posted by Helianthus

Easy to milk teats were always a top priority for my breeding program, along with disposition, hardiness, rear udder attachment, feet and legs. What use is a goat that can give 2 gallons of m ilk a day if you can hardly milk her??

Exactly!

[chamoisee]

Originally Posted by hoofinitnorth

Of course not (and we don't). It just shocked me that they didn't carry more weight on the scorecard.

Yeah, I agree. What is the use of a perfect and productive goat if you can't milk her??

[Freeholder]

I agree with the premise of this thread! The doe I'm milking now is three years old, a second-freshener (she missed last year, and I gave her a second chance). She's still a thumb-and-two-fingers milker, not hard to milk, but it takes a while because her teats are short. But when she first freshened as a yearling, I was ready to give her away to the first taker! Thankfully, it looks like the yearling I'm waiting on now (looks like she'll kid within a couple of weeks or so) will have teats at least as big as the three-year-old doe.

Kathleen

[Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians]

35 points mammary
13 medial points
fore 5 points
rear 7 points
balance 6 points
leaving 2 points for each teat.

It's likely so little since it is so hard to genetically alter. Vicki

[hoofinitnorth]

Originally Posted by Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians

leaving 2 points for each teat.

(Emphasis mine.) Ahhhh, that is where we are getting the discrepancy. 2+2=4.