goat won't breed--please advise

[JoannaCW]

I'm having trouble getting my 4yo Alpine doe,Amahl, bred. She doesn't seem to be coming fully into heat. I would greatly appreciate any advice or suggestions.
I don't have a buck; before I've been able to tell when my does were in heat and drive them to a buck. In 2005 I bred Amahl successfully in this way. In 2006 she seemed to show normal heat signs but got no interest from the buck. We had some reason then to suspect a buck problem. In 2007 she showed fairly weak heat signs (flagging, slight dsicharge, often opaque brownish) and when I took her to a new buck neither she nor he showed much interest, though that buck impregnated our other doe.
This year I tried giving Amahl Lutalyse. She seemed to be showing weak heat signs at 21-day intervals. A vet scheduled to give her the first shot 10 days after one of these heats. Unfortunately, on day 10 she appeared to be in heat again. He gave the shot anyway--2 mL in the caudal thigh muscle, straight into the back of the leg. . No results. I gave her another shot 9 days and a few hours later. (Possibly bad timing. One vet and mentioned giving at least 7 days after the first shot; one online site mentioned success with shots at 4 and 8 days, another recommended an 11-day interval; another vet suggested 14 days; the one who gave the first shot said 10 days but admitted he didn't know much about goats; I chose based on my convenience.) 2 days later--yesterday--she was flagging vigorously in the evening. This AM she was flagging again and, I thought, discharging slightly. I took her to the buck. No interest.
Now I am wondering:Should I have waited longer to give her the second shot? Would it make sense to give her another on Monday (the 14th day since her first injection)? Is the caudal thigh the correct placement? I've seen diagrams idicating a muscle on the side of the hip instead. What might make a doe fail to cycle naturally or to respond to Lutalyse? She appears healthy, priduces plenty of milk despite not having kidded since 2006, is vigorous and has a good appetite. There is selenium in her feed and in her mineral salt block.
Thanks for taking time to read this.
Joanna

[DQ]

some one with more experience concerning the lute will hopefully answer but I wanted to ask if you were leaving her over night with the buck? I had one doe that always had very quiet heats it took several with the timeing being right for me to be convinced she was actually coming into heat. she also was too freaked out to stand for or even seem interested in the buck when I hauled her up to him. I decided to leave her for a few days because all my other does stand almost immediatly for the buck after they are introduced. neither I nor the owner of the buck ever saw her get bred or even get close to the buck but 5 months later she had kids. maybe she naturally has quiet heats and needs some quiet night time to be confident enough to allow him to blubber all over her. I know that with cattle there is alot more sexual activity in the late evening and early morning hours. just a thought. I'll be interested to hear the ops on the lute. I have a longtime dry older doe that has had several skewed heat cycles. Ihope she is now bred but I am not counting on it and plan to use lute to get her to release those eggs if she doesn't settle this time.

[betsy h.]

Cole Younger, DVM (NC) recommends 3ml Lute for bringing them in to estrus.

I'd check for a uterine or vaginal infection. Low copper can also cause weak or silent heats.

[JoannaCW]

Thank you both!
DQ, did the buck appear interested in your doe with the quiet heats? I've been told by another goat-keeper, but don't know if it's true, that if the doe is in heat the buck will definitely show interest although the doe may not stand.
Betsy H, I've heard a lot of different recommendations about dosage. We had another doe with p[roblem heats who started cycling normally after 1 mL of lutalyse.

[KimM]

Interesting thread, I hope to see more replies.

All I can add to this is when I gave my ND doeling 2cc Lute 13 days after being accidently exposed to the boys, she came into heat 3 days later but I read that it isn't a 'real' heat and for the next 5 days, she acted like she was sort of in heat. Then she came back in a normal heat 17 days later for 2 days so I'm thinking she's getting regulated now. This is the first time I've used Lute but I thought I'd share.

[Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians]

If you want to read over on forum dairygoatinfo.com....search on the left search Lutelyse, CIDR's etc...or email me privately...or call my number is on my website. Lots of questions before you can help with a problem like this. Vicki