Dog Attack (minor)

[YoungOne]

OK I'm looking for advice on dogs directly regarding goats.

I currently have two dogs. one, a beutiful boxer/Rhodesian mix. And two, a mut of questionable breeding (looks coyote, I'll never get a parking lot puppy again). Anyways the Boxer/Rhodesian is almost 6yrs old and until a yr agao spent her life as a city dog, while we got our questionable breed dog shortly after the move. We got our goats (two does) in Late January and the dogs went through the I want to see up close phase but never acted agressive or anything. Well both does happened to kid within 24 hours of each other in Mid March and ever since our older dog has taken to chasing the kids around the pen by running along the fence. I finaly thought we had this over because she started laying down at the fence and letting the kids lick her nose or she would lick them and the chasing stopped. Well almost 3 weeks ago my wife comes out after milking just as one of the bucklings starts crying to god all mighty that the world is over! the older dog has somehow pushed against the fencing just enough to grab a tiny chunk of flesh in front of the rear flank and has promptly ripped it off. Wife and I iodine it immediately and twice a day for 4 days and he acts fine (its now been over 2 weeks and he's fine). We chain the guilty dog for 24hrs (a huge punishment since she's had free range since we have no neighbors). Well when we let the dog off the chain she stayed clear of the goat fence in general and we figured we got lucky and she actualy learned a lesson. Well this past weekend while I'm out of town the wife says she started doing the chasing thing along the fence and now that the bucklings are older and even braver if that's possible they are butting the fence. OK, that was a LOT of background for a simple question, but hey, I think I tell a good story. LOL.

Question, should I just give up on the idea of a peaceful farm without intervention and get an electrical line for the outside of the pen (30X70) or AND HERE'S WERE IT GETS A LITTLE DICEY I was thinking that in a week when I put up the pen dividers to wean the kids I could try for some dog training. Please don't tell me how cruel this idea is, I compare it to rattle snake training (that's were I got the idea). I was thinking that I could muzzle her and put her in with the two bucklings who are getting pretty fiesty at almost two months. Would a couple of head butts (I should note with small horns, not sharp) get her to back off or just incite more goat violence?

P.S. - The coyote lookin mutt would rather annihilate any and all rodents within a mile of the house than pay any attention to the goats.

[Minelson]

Your coyote mutt sounds like a good dog
I would do the electric wire idea because then I wouldn't worry about it starting up again. I'm also a softy and think that putting him in a fight without defense is kinda mean. He might just learn that when he has a muzzle on he will get the snot beat out of him...when he has the muzzle off he can be back in the game...

[Togg Lovers]

I would also go with the electric fence. A couple of good zaps and he won't want to be near the goats anymore.

[deetu]

put peanut butter on the electric fence for a good zap.

[Minelson]

Originally Posted by deetu

put peanut butter on the electric fence for a good zap.

OMG! Would he ever eat peanut butter again!!!

[southerngurl]

Do your dogs know the word no? Does it make them stop immediately and slink in shame?

If you really want to try and train the dog to stop this, this is what I would do. Keep the dog physically tied up or in some way restrained away from the pen anytime you are not out there. When you are able to be out there, let the dog off and watch. ANY time the dog so much as looks at the goats, yell a firm "NO!" and as soon as they quit, act like nothing happened. If you are consistent and firm, they should get the point. You would have to do this for a while before ever trusting the animal without you around. Starting with keeping an eye through the window, after you feel you could trust them without supervision.

If not, put the hotwire up.

I've used this simple technique to break two dogs of killing chickens. Only let the chickens out when I'm around. The dogs are not allowed to show any interest in the chickens whatsoever. Looking begets interest, begets chasing, begets seeing the animal as prey, begets attacks.

[Goat Servant]

I would go for the hot wire along with firm NO....yes he might get beat up by a buck...my mistake when I first got my LGD pup was taking him out cause the does slammed him around.

[Otter]

I'd go with training. If I was going to invest in electric, it would be a collar. Every time she looked at a goat, God would smite her. Then any goats out of the pen would be safe too.

[JuliaM]

Electric wire, I have it around my pen, had a stray running around and while I was in the pen, he desided he wanted to get close, well he hit that line and hasn't been back since, then yesterday, almost hit 3 pups on the road so I stopped not thinking about my goats and loaded these up in the truck, brought them home, let them out first thing they did was head for the goats, barking at them, then each one took their turn getting hit by the fence, only took about 20 mins and they learned not to go over there...it is a pulse type.....small bite but effective.....

[chris30523]

Dogs are dogs. They will do it again if you don't put up the electric fence."No" is good if you are standing right there but if you are not they need some other type of punishment.I have 2 dogs that will not touch a goat if I am right there. I have a doe missing her ears,also one missing part of her nose, cause the dogs were loving it through the fence, when I wasn't there.We put up electric fence and not only does it keep out the coyotes ,my dogs won't go within 100 yards of it. Took a couple of good zaps each(took me 45 minutes to find one of them) but it has saved me alot of "No's and noses".

[Kittikity]

I'd say do both the electric fence and the shock collar.. The collar for the dog training measures and the fence to keep out the dogs or anything else..

[Willowdale]

On another note, a ridgeback cross can roam for miles. Electric wire will protect you goats, but it won't protect your neighbors'. Please be a good neighbor and keep any dog that's a danger to livestock confined to your own property.

My dog's a great family protection watchdog, but he can't be trusted with other animals. I have to keep him on lead or on tether anytime he's outside.

I'll take a dog like your parking lot mutt anyday.

[southerngurl]

Originally Posted by chris30523

Dogs are dogs. They will do it again if you don't put up the electric fence."No" is good if you are standing right there but if you are not they need some other type of punishment.I have 2 dogs that will not touch a goat if I am right there. I have a doe missing her ears,also one missing part of her nose, cause the dogs were loving it through the fence, when I wasn't there.We put up electric fence and not only does it keep out the coyotes ,my dogs won't go within 100 yards of it. Took a couple of good zaps each(took me 45 minutes to find one of them) but it has saved me alot of "No's and noses".

Both of my dogs killed chickens. Both of my dogs are loose right now, with the chickens free roaming. It can be done, it takes a long time and you have to be consistent.

[Backfourty,MI.]

My dogs have never attacked my goats but do the fence chasing thing & that scares the crap out of them. They are such lovable dogs (jack russel & #2 dog is a beagle) & never thought any thing like this before we got the goats. Anyways, I used a shock collar on my dogs & they don't like it. Now when we go out I say "NO GOATS' & they stay clear away from the pen even without the shock collar on.
My dogs & goats have equal time to run free but the goats also have a huge pasture area we fenced this year for them too so they can be in there everyday away from the dogs.
Good luck, it's hard when you love the dogs & the goats.