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  #1  
Old 05/04/08, 09:28 PM
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 41
Could you help an ignorant newbie?

OK so the prices of milk are SO high that I have to do something. I am considering getting a dairy goat. I've tried goat's milk and like it, and I've heard it's better to start on a goat than a cow anyway for milking. I have 2 fenced acres, and my neighbor has another 3 he'd let a goat munch on. I don't care a bit about pedigree unless it affects milk production. Can anyone give me any ideas on whether or not buying a dairy goat would be cost effective, what kind I should get, general tips, etc? Please forgive my total ignorance as I probably worded half of this incorrectly for goat-lingo.

Thanks!
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  #2  
Old 05/04/08, 10:06 PM
nehimama's Avatar
An Ozark Engineer
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Powhatan, AR
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Well, you're starting out right. Ask lots of questions, read & read & read some more. Find out ALL you can before jumping in. Is there anyone near you who has goats? Could you visit and get a feel for what it takes to own and care for goats? Have you ever milked a dairy animal before?

There is a big learning curve, but most of us who have dairy goats find the work and learning is worth the effort.

I'm not so sure that owning, feeding and caring for a dairy animal is cost effective, but you DO know what's going into the milk you feed your family. That's got to be worth something in my book.

NeHi
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  #3  
Old 05/05/08, 05:18 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: NY
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Don't forget they will need feed, hay and care. They can not just be put out on pasture and expect to give a lot of milk. You also will need more than one.
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  #4  
Old 05/05/08, 06:06 AM
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Texas Coastal Bend/S. Missouri
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The costs are pretty high on the front end. You will need shelter, a milk stand, at least two goats, milking equipment (bucket, strainer, etc.), vet care, meds, de-wormer, an excellent fence, and etc.

Have we saved any money milking goats? Not on your life.

Do we have wonderful milk and cheese? Yessum.
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  #5  
Old 05/05/08, 06:38 AM
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Greensburg, Pennsylvania
Posts: 111
The savings varies depending on how much milk you use. When all 4 kids are here we can go thru 2 gals a day easy. We also get a better price on some things like hay by going in with others to purchase larger quatities. 1 thing that really helped us get started was Storeys "Raising Dairy Goats" book. They have tons of info in there and we had a good idea of what we could expect and what we needed.
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  #6  
Old 05/05/08, 07:18 AM
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: ohio
Posts: 1,068
I started with two goats. The barn was here when we bought the place. So was the fence. I already had jars, barn cleaning tools and a wheelbarrow. dd and dh built my milk stand as a christmas gift. so my costs were - goats, feed, hay, minerals, straw for bedding, water pail and drinking bucket, feed dish, two collars, hoof shears, breeding fee, straining supplies and milking pail, medical (minimal - my friend does my shots, not the vet) and some "city" water. also grooming tools and vet certificates for 4-H for my dd.

last year I milked one goat and fed both. Subtracting out the original cost of the goats and the 4H costs, and dividing the rest of the expenses for both goats for the full year by gallons of milk (from one goat, over 9 months), my milk was cheaper per gallon than cows milk at my grocery store. just barely. I had enough milk to supply my family and make plenty of cheese. I had no income from kids because I still have the wether and buckling - the first as a companion for the second who hopefully bred his unrelated "auntie" at the end of feb - but I'm not sure yet - she has trouble catching.

I also did amazing things for my garden with used goat bedding but don't know how to factor that in financially.
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  #7  
Old 05/05/08, 07:56 AM
DQ DQ is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: ok
Posts: 1,825
1 50lb bag alfalfa pellets $9.00 (.18/lb)
one dairy doe 4lbs per day cost .72 per day
1 50-lb bag of corn $9.00
1lb per day .18

Total costs .90 per day

This is what my does are getting. they raise their own kids and I get about two quarts from one and over a quart from the others (ff) every morning . the tools/buckets and even the milkstand (made from pallets and scrap wood)I already had in one form or another.

So, I get about 3/4 gallon every morning from three does costing me $2.70

there are also yearly expenses
wormers
vaccinations
a few supplies for emergencys
probably total less than $10 per year per goat

one time costs:
disbudding iron
fencing
shelter.


I have three grade does costing me a total of $250. fencing costs the most. on a side note I just completed fencing off 2 acres and now everybody gets browse all day. they arent' real concerned with eating their alfalfa pellets now to the point that they are voluntarily consuming less than half of the 4lbs I was feeding them. but I have seen no drop in production yet (3 days in). also a note, the goat I paid the most for ($150) gives almost 2x as much as the $50 goats. keep in mind too that you can be putting some meat on the table or selling the kids to help cover costs. for me its worth it not to mention you are getting a healthier product (goats milk is better for you than homogenized cows milk and doesnt' come from animals of questionable health)

Now if you want a fancy barn and fencing, fancy milkstand, registered goats all the home dairy equipment and udder washes, santizing solution etc... you are going to be upside down in a hurry. if you are willing to "make do" with things you have, even if they aren't so pretty or convenient you can come out OK. that is what makes the difference between it being an expensive hobby or an endeavor to provide for your family.
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  #8  
Old 05/05/08, 08:03 AM
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 78
I don't use a milking stand. My does stand quietly in the barn stall (concrete floored) and eat grain while I milk them. If you're at all handy they're supposed to be pretty easy to make, anyway.

I think that goat care can be as expensive as you want it to be (save some basic supplies). For example, I bought a fancy stainless steel milk tote to milk into. It cost me about $50. Some people buy a stainless steel pot from the Dollar Store for $6. Both work just fine. I bought a stainless steel strainer, some people just use a Brawny paper towel or a coffee filter. So I would make sure to get many opinions on what extras you "need", as there will be many of them.

We found out that, around here, if you have the feed store mix up your own blend it costs a *lot* less than the premade 50 lb sacks of feed. It's more nutritionally sound for lactating does, too.

Heck, we didn't even buy collars. My favorite doe wears a collar made out of a string from a hay bale.

Some people don't use straw as bedding and just use a plain floor. Some people use straw. Some people empty their stalls twice a year. Some people never do. I know a few who do it daily (that's a lot of straw!) Fencing is another thing with lots of varying opinions. I'm 6 months pregnant and don't feel like putting up a lot of fence so I buy cattle panels. They are pricey but instant--you attach them to the fence posts and walk away. I'm sure if I bought a roll of farm fence I would save a bundle.

Even geographically you're going to have huge differences in prices. Around here goats are pretty plentiful. The prices I've seen people here mention make my eyes pop. Also, there is going to be differences in hay costs in, say, New Mexico over somewhere in the Midwest.

Are we saving money buying milk? That depends. We're not really into homesteading to save money at this point (we're still investing--in the future hopefully it will all work out), we're more interested in self-sufficiency. If I bought a gallon of milk I would only buy local, organic milk because I'm very concerned about hormones and additives as well as the ethics of largescale dairy farms. It would cost me about $3.50 a quart. The last time we bought fresh mozzarella from the health food store it was, IIRC, $3 a ball.

Keep in mind that my 4 and 6 year olds can polish off a ball just pinching pieces off as they walk through the kitchen.

If I bought milk and cheese from the discount store it would probably take me a long time to break even. Buying the way we do (organic, preferably local) we can tell a huge difference. For one thing, availability. We would ration cheese before because we needed it for dinner the next day or whatever. Now we can eat whatever we want and just make more. I know how my goats are treated, what conditions they live in, what goes into their bodies, and how the milk is handled. Also, unless you find an 'underground' source for raw milk you can only purchase pasteurized dairy in my state.

If that is important to you, there is nothing like raising your own dairy animal.

As for general tips--I've had some of every dairy breed except for Sanaan. I have heard that Sanaan's are the Holstein's of the goat breeds--lots of milk but not a lot of cream. I like cream.

*My* experiences are that Nubians are very fussy. They give a lower amount of milk than the other breeds but it's high in butterfat. I had a soft spot for my Alpine but she was as wild as a deer--I never got her tamed enough to milk easily (and, of course, a lot of this is how they were treated before they came to me and not just breed characteristics).

My Toggenburg is a dream to milk--like I said, I don't have a milk stand and don't bother tying my does now. She gives a lot of milk. They say that Togg milk has a stronger taste which makes sense as they were bred for cheese production. However, I haven't noticed this and my kids drink her milk without complaint. In fact, my non-goatsmilk-drinking MIL came over yesterday and took a quart jar with her after having a drink.

My Oberhasli is beautiful (I have always thought that goats' beauty lies in their usefullness, but I do think that Obers are pretty goats). She has a gentle personality, nuzzling my 4 year old whenever he comes near. Even my Ober buck is gentle. She, also, gives a good amount of milk.

I have a LaMancha doe as well, although she's dry and I haven't built that milking-relationship with her yet.

People tend to have their favorite breeds, though, and swear by that breed. You'll find one that works for you.

When we started I didn't care about pedigree either. After all, I was just in it for the milk. I'm starting to understand, though, that it makes sense to pay some attention to ADGA-registered status since the kids can be sold for so much more. When one kid is going to the auction house and selling for $20 and a registerable kid is going for $120, well, that makes a difference to even a novice. Ethically, I also know that the kids with papers are likely going to have a much better life than the auction house kid.

Wow, didn't mean to write a book! Good luck on your venture.

Last edited by Sasha; 05/05/08 at 08:13 AM.
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  #9  
Old 05/05/08, 08:08 AM
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 78
Quote:
also a note, the goat I paid the most for ($150) gives almost 2x as much as the $50 goats.
My first two goats were a registered Nubian and an auction house Alpine. The Nubian was an awful mother (she rejected her kids, nearly killing the doeling before we were able to intervene) and her milk production was always unimpressive. Make sure to ask a lot of questions before buying--with her we were brand new to goats and didn't want to seem rude by asking. Any breeder worth a ---- is going to welcome questions and have the answers. Run--fast--from anyone who doesn't or who seems evasive. A good goat person (who will, presumably, raise good goats) is going to be eager to help and give advice.

My auction house Alpine had great milk production and was a good mother.

After that (we got out of goats for awhile) I thought that it was a crapshoot. Now I buy ADGA registered milkers and have noticed a difference in production. They are also a lot easier to work with.

Last edited by Sasha; 05/05/08 at 08:11 AM.
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  #10  
Old 05/05/08, 07:22 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 28
Nobody here has factored in quality of life. Imagine getting in your car and running to the corner store to pay for a half gallon of milk. A fairly painless experience. Now imagine going out to the barn to milk one of your goats. The smell of the fresh hay you bring with you, the sweet smell of the straw bedding, maybe the little tick-ticking of some rabbits as they lick their water bottles in the barn, the warm welcome from all the critters, the surprises that always come with an animal-filled life (good or bad they are always there and always making life interesting and meaningful). I suppose you could put on your favorite CD in the car on the way to the convenience store but I'll take the goat shed anyday. Plus it makes you a more interesting person at parties.
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  #11  
Old 05/05/08, 07:51 PM
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 460
LOL, we used to have goats till they got out, ate moma's roses, our 5 type apple tree that her Dad had planted, and dropped pellets all over the patios. They did all that in one day--next day, the goats were gone and peace was restored. Looking for some Nubians again but will have a GOOD fence this time. wc
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  #12  
Old 05/05/08, 08:08 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Posts: 5,492
Oh yes - quality of life. Watching my kids interact with the critters and tell everyone they meet about their goats and chickens is priceless!

And don't forget the entertainment value! I'd rather watch my goats playing then go to an overpriced movie or concert any day!
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