Question on milk temps for cheese

[Naturaldane]

As most of you know, the interent can be a very good tool for learning things, or frying your brain, and mine is about fried.

Ok, some say cheese wont turn out as well if you use the milk strait out of the goat, some say bacteria can be a problem if you dont chill the milk asap.
So far, we have not gotten sick and I have made (attemtped is a better phrase) allot of cheese and Im using strait from the goat since we only have one for now. I have used chilled milk in my cheese and it didnt seem to do as well, but isnt it all ok no matter what way you do it if you heat it up to the 212? I finally have my rennet and itching to try it out.
Now, for drinking milk, same question heat then chill, or chill, heat chill?

And the answere from the experts shall apear below....

[Leo]

Hi,
I'm no expert, but I think in France it's a crime to heat treat/pasteurize milk as it denatures the proteins and complexity of flavors. If people do heat treat the milk, I think most do it to a max. of 180F, then cool it down to the preferred temp. of the bacteria, wether thermophilic or mesophilic, thermo prefers higher temps. were as meso works great with fresh milk,(80-100F est.)
http://www.cheesemaking.com/ has some nice pic. intensive tuterals. And artisan cheesemakers yahoo group is good too.
Megan

[Naturaldane]

I have been heating until 180, adding lemon juice or vinager to make the curds, this process has worked pretty well for me but leaves the cheese with a bit of an after taste of vinigar or lemon juice. So far my best cheese has been flavored with garlic and Tony Satchers Cajon seasoning.
I belive in the power of natural immunity so bacteria in moderation doesnt bother me, but I dont want to make any one sick either.
So, Im fine if I just chill the milk asap after straining (I use the clorox dawn to clean the udders) for drinking. For cheese it can go either way.
My ex husband isnt to happy with the kids being raised in a farm life (hello idiot, where do you think your food comes from) and swears our kids are going to get some weird illness from the animals.

I ordered my rennet from the cheesemaking site, I didnt have allot of luck with it last night. I wish this cheese recipe link worked for this site.

[Alice In TX/MO]

I use milk without pasteurizing for our own cheese making. For giving away, I pasteurize.

Look at http://www.gourmetsleuth.com/cheeserecipes.htm


Also http://biology.clc.uc.edu/fankhauser...ese_course.htm

If you get one of the kits from cheesemaking.com, it comes with a nice recipe book.

[Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians]

When I was making hard cheese the only way to get a consistant cheese each time was to pasteurise the milk, 165 then cool to warm and start making the cheese...this way the culture was the only 'bacteria' working in the cheese. But for us, and all the soft cheese I make now for sale, it is raw...in fact I milk the does, strain and pour the milk right into the gallon cheese buckets, add culture and go.

So I think it has alot more to do with your intentions...what are you doing with the cheese afterwards, because for family cheese just use your milk raw. Vicki

[Naturaldane]

It is going to be just for us now, even if I did ever sale I wouldnt with things made from raw milk as theres too much risk there.
Thank you for all your responce, I am going to go ahead an order that kit. Im getting another goat this weekend I hope and will actually have a gallon at a time.

[BlueHeronFarm]

My answers would vary depending on what kind of cheese you are making.

Mozzarella needs to start with cold milk. So we pasteurize, cool milk and use it the next day.

Chevre - I pasteurize, cool to 86 then culture. Same with feta.

We pasteurize because we sell it. Law and all that.

Cheeses like ricotta & paneer I don't pasteurize first, as you are raising it well above the temp needed to flash pasteurize. We don't sell these cheeses, but I make them for home use.

You can post over in the dairy forum. Julia is the resid3nt expert and she knows a lot of details about the science part of cheesemaking.

[cmharris6002]

Freshly drawn milk has a bactericidal quality that kills off the culture. Traditionally cheese was made by adding cold milk from the previous milking to the freshly drawn milk. Also, if you allow the milk to rest at room temp for two hours the bactericidal properties will be diminished to the point that they can not interfere with your culture. Quickly chilling the milk is necessary when you will be holding the milk prior to cheese making.

I use the culture packets from cheesemaking.com, they contain enough bacteria that they can be used with freshly drawn milk to make Feta and Chevre because I have made it that way with no problems. For hard cheese I combine milk or allow the milk to rest.

I am a home cheese maker and only use raw goat milk for cheese.


Christy

[Naturaldane]

I did not see that there was a dairy forum on here, its an awesome site and has allot of info.
Now, Im having trouble with rennet, I cant get a single curd from using it, and Ive tried every which away, emailing the cheese place as soon as I get done with this but I had a question.

I dont want to toss this milk I have that the rennet didnt curd, Its been kept at 90 all night (5 hours for us) and nothing has became of it, can I still use this and just make cheese from lemon juice still or anything other than throw it to the dogs?

[mamajohnson]

Naturaldane, I don't have an answer to this question, but I just wanted to say, glad you started this here! I just posted a help question over on dairy, and then came here to scout about.
Vicki has mostly answered my question.

So far I have only made the acid cheese, and I use a bit of the pickled jalepeno juice for a better flavor.
Well, off to re-try my chedder.

[Eunice]

I have had rennet from the health food store that just plain did NOT work. I tried a second bottle and then told the store owners. That batch was just no good. So now I go 100 miles to a commercial cheese plant and buy some from they at 1/10 of the price and 10X stronger. It sure works good, but I have to "translate" the amount to 1/10 of what the recipes say.

[Naturaldane]

yummm, pickled jal. juice, never would have thought of that, I dont know why either.
So far the family and the friends love the Tony Satchers and garlic cheese the best.

I dont know what to say about the rennet, my pc died on me and I have just gotten it back and trying to find out what went wrong while dealing with the rest of the world whos going nuts because ive been off line for 24 hours.

I really enjoy the forums, though I put the cart before the goat and chickens I was able to get my questions resolved and information that gave me a ton more questions...lol.. I wonder what people did before interent

[Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians]

Lots and lots of trail and error

Rennet has a shelf life, not sure about the junket rennet if you are using that from the health food store. A year is tops for the rennet you get from cheesemaking.com and it's why I love the little cultures instead...keep them in the freezer and they stay wonderful from season to season. I have used 2 year old packets I found and they still made wonderful cherve! The acid cheeses are nothing more than full fat ricotta's which are good, but take the plunge with the cherve from cheesemaking.com around $6 for 5 packets, and each packet turns a gallon of milk into about 1 and 1/2 pounds, more if you have alpines with their high protein, of cheese. Vicki

[BlueHeronFarm]

Here's my little secret about the cheesemaking.com chevre culture. You can actually get two gallons cultured and set from one packet. ...cha-ching.

[Naturaldane]

I was killing my rennet, still havnt gotten things just right consistancy wise but its good.
Thank you guys.