Putting a stop to butting?

whinnyninny · #1 04/15/08, 08:08 AM

I went out to feed my goats this morning (2-year-old nanny and her 6-mo old doeling), just like I do twice a day, every day. As I walked in the gate the doeling started rearing up and butting me in the leg (I pushed her away and she kept doing it, and then a few moments later the nanny butted me! Ouch!

What do I do to put a stop to this? I'm not gonna put up with it! (I'm also 6 mo pregnant and a bit of a sissy!) They're Nubian/Alpine crosses.

DQ · #2 04/15/08, 08:40 AM

I hate to make this long but....if your a admitting your a sissy then that is your ultimate problem. if you were pushing them away they probably figured you were just playing the game. whatever you do has to be uncomfortable enough that they will not come back at you and make them realize it is not even close to a game and that they have no business picking a fight with you. goats push on each other all the time they think it is fun, as well as it being a way to establish dominance.
lest you think you are going to have to be "mean"....you are not being nice if you are allowing them to "walk all over you". it is not mean to assert your dominance. just because you are nice to them doesn't mean they will be nice to you. they are willing to hurt you. are you going to prove to them that you have the capability of hurting them? a dominant goat would. in my opinion most livestock that people think have been "abused" because of their unacceptable behaviour have actually been spoiled (a form of abuse) you would be surprise how hard you have to smack some goats to get them to back off. it takes a hefty kick in the face sometimes to get my herd queen to stop pushing me around the gates. they will challenge you and you have to be ready to end a fight that they pick. I would rather them be slightly wary of me than think they can crowd me then push be then eventually head butt me.

option 1. squirt bottle
option 2. a big stick or kick (kick works for mine)
option 3. an electrified stick (I hate this but I know of a breeder that has to carry one for a particular doe that will getchya if you turn your back)
option 4. Lay them down (if your six months preggo I would be careful doing this if you do it at all and if your admitedly a sissy you may not be able to) grab them and lay them down, you will have to take their legs out from under them and pin them on the ground for a minute. it would of course be best to do this when they threaten you but staging it might be effective too. get a hold of both front legs and pull the legs to one side and push their head to the other. hold them down by their head for a minute. this is best done a few times in adolescence when they are still small. you don't have to be rough you just have to get the job done.

I hope you are able to stop this behaviour in its tracks immediatly!

Patty0315 · #3 04/15/08, 08:48 AM

Lead

TexasArtist · #4 04/15/08, 08:51 AM

fill the bucket with a good amount of water and walk out there with it. If she starts to come at you throw the water on her. It'll be a big shock to her. It was to lucy when I did it to her

jode · #5 04/15/08, 08:55 AM

If you have several goats pushing on you at the same time, a squirt bottle won't work - you need a super-soaker. Because you can pump them up for a sustained blast, you can keep a lot of animals at bay at once with one. I keep one at the gate and don't enter without it because we have a billy that pushes too much and a ram that will literally back up 20 feet and come at you full force. I have never let him hit me, but I bet it would break a leg or ligament.

whinnyninny · #6 04/15/08, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DQ

I hate to make this long but....if your a admitting your a sissy then that is your ultimate problem.

Okay, maybe "sissy" is the wrong word... I'm not afraid to smack them good if they need it (I just don't want to risk them injuring me, or butting me in the stomach... though I don't think they can quite reach that high, at least not easily).

Backfourty,MI. · #7 04/15/08, 11:51 AM

I agree on the squirt bottle, That's what we've used in the past & it works. I do like the BUCKET of WATER though, Good idea if it's more than 1 or a real problem situation. Definately try to nip this quick, I won't have a goat that butt's people here, they'll be hamburger.

DQ, if I were your friend with the mean doe that'd getcha when your back's turned, well I'd be inviting you over for a BBQ. That goat must have something pretty spectacular going for her for him to keep her!

DQ · #8 04/15/08, 12:17 PM

backfourty- I wouldn't keep her either! but not my decision.

whinny ninny- thats good that your willing give them a good smack or whatever if they need it. some people have whined when I shove a goat with my foot saying I was "being mean" they just don't get it. I forgot to mention I have a youngster that decided headbutting my 3 year old daugher was fun. I borrowed a dog shock collar and sat outside for hours waiting for her to try it. I never could get her to do it to my daughter and finally waited until she tried beating up some of the newborns. whooooeeeeee that worked good! it only took twice. she then would start to headbutt and then would stop before she put her weight behind it and let whatever other goat it was ram her. ha ha ha

. I didn't feel bad one bit. she hasn't tried smashing my daughter again, but I still don't trust her out of arms reach with her. the collars are pretty expensive in my book but if you want to shell out the bucks or borrow one it is worth a shot. my doeling is possibly still on the chopping block for that reason and because she hasn't gained well. time will tell.

whinnyninny · #9 04/15/08, 01:13 PM

Maybe I've watched too many Downunder Horsemanship DVD's... Clinton Anderson says that horses kick and bite each other all the time, so there's nothing that you can do to the horse with your hand that's seriously going to hurt them (this is in reference to holding his hand up next to the horses face while desensitizing, to keep the horse from running into you... they run into your hand.) They have much more potential to hurt us than we do to hurt them... that's not to say we should go to the extreme and be abusive of the animals, though!!

Just a regular spray bottle of water, then?

mpete · #10 04/15/08, 01:28 PM

After my morning experience I like the shock collar idea!!

Scrounger · #11 04/15/08, 02:08 PM

Teach them who the bigger, badder goat is, and you won't have any more problems.....

michiganfarmer · #12 04/15/08, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Backfourty,MI.

I agree on the squirt bottle, That's what we've used in the past & it works. I do like the BUCKET of WATER though, Good idea if it's more than 1 or a real problem situation. Definately try to nip this quick, I won't have a goat that butt's people here, they'll be hamburger.

DQ, if I were your friend with the mean doe that'd getcha when your back's turned, well I'd be inviting you over for a BBQ. That goat must have something pretty spectacular going for her for him to keep her!

SHouldnt you be outside doing something? lol

Chinook · #13 04/15/08, 06:23 PM

Quote:

They have much more potential to hurt us than we do to hurt them

I agree. As long as your using a squirt bottle/gun or your hands/feet, you are not going to hurt them. A good smack, even if you have to push them onto the ground, won't hurt them. They will just stand back up and learn that pushing and headbutting isn't acceptable.

Goat Servant · #14 04/15/08, 08:20 PM

The only suggestion here I strongly disagree with is smacking your goat with your hand. You will be the one with a bruise!!

Wendy · #15 04/15/08, 09:12 PM

I know this won't be an option since your pregnant, but it might work for someone else. I had a buck that liked to bother me. Wouldn't butt me, but would come & just keep pushing me with his head. I finally got ticked off one day & threw him to the ground. I held him down until he stopped kicking & he never bothered me again. It wasn't an easy task, but it worked. You have to show them that you are the high one on the totem pole!

Freeholder · #16 04/15/08, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wendy

I know this won't be an option since your pregnant, but it might work for someone else. I had a buck that liked to bother me. Wouldn't butt me, but would come & just keep pushing me with his head. I finally got ticked off one day & threw him to the ground. I held him down until he stopped kicking & he never bothered me again. It wasn't an easy task, but it worked. You have to show them that you are the high one on the totem pole!

This is what I suggest, also -- and she might still be able to do it even pregnant, depending on how athletic (and big!) she is. Might need some help from hubby or another adult to throw the adult doe, but the kid would be easy enough to handle. They both need to be done *now*, before they get any more aggressive ideas. You don't have to wait for the goat to misbehave, either. Take care of it whenever it's convenient for you -- they remember!

Kathleen

Jillis · #17 04/16/08, 07:22 AM

Squirt bottles do nothing to phase my goats. I go in swinging a broom when I give them their grain. Otherwise they don't bug me. About the only time I ever swear is in the goat pen.
Jill~