Disbudding - why?

[Scrounger]

I have always wonder why people disbud. Let's hear some "pros and cons".

[Minelson]

I did it because I didn't want their horns to get caught in the electric fence or anything else. Also, for the safety of me and my other critters.

[nehimama]

Well, I have all my dairy doelings disbudded. The ones with horns KNOW they have horns, and can inflict some serious damage on each other. Those horns can hurt humans, too. Even if not done intentionally on the goat's part. Ask me how I know. . . .

I have a yearling newcomer here. She came with horns. Just untangled her from the fence three times yesterday. Had I left her there, the others would've rammed her to death.

The bucklings, on the other hand, keep their horns. As umblemished (unaltered in any way) kids, they bring more at the meat buyers auctions.

Just my personal opinion and personal experience.

NeHi

[DQ]

I took care of a breeders goats while they were on vacation. they all have horns. I cut two goats out of fences in 3 days. his fences are a patchwork of cut and repaired panels and field fence. that settled it for good for me. my goats keep the fence lines nice and tidy and don't get stuck my teaser buck has horns and he has caught me with them unintentionally on more than one occasion. I can't let my 3yr old duaghter in with him because of the horns. even if he were not intact. if I had tons of acreage and the goats had absolutley no inclination to reach through the fence I would consider leaving them on.

[BlueHeronFarm]

I don't ever want to be poked and I don't want any of my expensive ladies to receive an udder injury - no horns on Blue Heron Farm.

Also, as former show goats many of ours had to be disbudded per the rules.

It is an unpleasant job for the farmer, but the babies recover faster than you could ever imagine. We did one tonight. She had some milk and started to play again as soon as it was over.

[texican]

horns and net wire fencing don't mix....

My cousin has over two hundred goats on their 380 acres next to mine, all perimeter fencing is net fencing. I hear them on a regular basis hung in the fence... those get removed, a few times. Every now and then I stumble upon one, silent... these don't last more than 24 hours, as the coyotes thin them quickly.

[KimM]

They are easier to sell without horns. More people want dehorned goats than horned ones, it seems.
I have both and a couple get their heads stuck in the hog panels occasionally, until they grow too big to get their heads through.
It's nicer to cuddle a dehorned goat!
I broke down and bought a disbudding iron.

[Backfourty,MI.]

I have some horned & some not horned & have never had a big problem with them either way. Actually still can't decide if I'm going to disbud this April's kid's or not. Never get stuck in the fence either. Actually I think it is personal preference but God gave goats horns for a reason so why should we decide they don't need them.

[Chinook]

I have had both horned and disbudded goats. I like the horns because I think they look natural and God made them that way. However in unnatural settings where there are fences involved the horns can easily get stuck. It just depends on the fence.

The only time I've ever had a problem was when I bought a buck who had been disbudded incorrectly. Because the disbudding was done wrong it caused his horns to grow tightly curling to the sides and towards his head, because of this he got one horn stuck in the fence one day (the horn curled/wrapped around the wire fencing) and he pulled it off. That was my only bad experiance with horns though.

And some people believe that the horns make goats mean, which I totally disagree with. Yes, they know they have horns and know how to use them, but you should always be careful around an animal anyway. Horns aren't going to make them mean.

In the end it just depends on personal preference I think. And how you are going to raise them. After my first kidding I decided to start disbudding the kids simply because no one around here wanted to buy a goat with horns.

[Scrounger]

I, personally, leave the horns on. For me it makes them easier to handle and more able to defend themselves against a coyote. I have had a few stuck in a fence, but have been able to train them not to do it anymore. Also - several of my Boers have figured out how to get their head back through without getting caught. I do have some without horns, though.

[Chinook]

Yeah, I like knowing that they have a least a little protection for coyotes and stray dogs

[dosthouhavemilk]

Basically, horns and our management system do not mesh well.
I do have goats with horns...and there are days that I wish I could just rip them off. We currently have four of the 70 mature does with horns. Two of them are leaving here in a month. Bound for a farm where horns are welcomed. They are not welcome here. The one caused numerous late term abortions this past winter. She is a witch with her horns and uses them fully to her advantage. Ours was her third home in less than two weeks. She lasted here less than two years. Her next home should go much better and I will see her on a regular basis to keep tabs. She is going with another horned doe, as well as her daughter. The five kids going along all have horns as well and belong to the three mature does. Plenty of land and space for the small herd and they will be the first goats.
Both of the other two does that will stay here with horns are Boer does. One a fullblood and the other a grade. Beyond them I have one Fullblood Boer buck with horns (and one without, thank goodness!). I am already regretting buying him...I stated earlier this Fall I would never buy another buck with horns after the last one (he threw my docile 4 year old Boer/Saanen buck through a wall).
Sparky was the right price and we will not dehorn mature goats. So now I have a Boer buck with horns. He was stuck in the fencing two days in a row. A cattle panel he can get his head in and out of. The woven wire fencing? Nope....Weaving his head through one cattle panel and then another? Nope....Needs help being removed from both...luckily he isn't all that stupid and does not get stuck regularly.
He and the fullblood Boer doe end up stuck in the hay feeders on regular ocassions. They stick their heads through, some loose hay falls down and then they are stuck.
Beyond that, at some point his head will not fit through cattle panels and my system for feeding him hay and grain will limit the pens he is able to be in. I already have that problem with the 5 year old Boer/Saanen (very big heads and he has some serious scurs) though so it isn't near the issues it could be.
So, I disbud everything I can here. Unfortunately, due to my month of illnesses in January, there are a number of bucklings (soon-to-be-wethers) running around with their horns still on their head...and they are already getting their heads stuck in the fencing...*sigh*
I only leave horns if a buyer requests it. Which is rare.

Having witnessed mature does being dehorned, I refuse to be responsible for that. If I do not do the quick disbudding at a young age and that horned goat ends up in the hands of someone who really wants the goat but no the horns, that goat could go through some serious pain and stress that could have been easily avoided.

I've been hit with horns before. Could have lost an eye when a sick goat who didn't have full control of her head hit me. The Boer buck who made me swear off horns on bucks drew blood when he slammed the back of my leg with his horns (he was on the floor lickety split after that incident and didn't dare try it again).

We have removed the goats from their natural environment and confined them. We are therefore responsible in keeping their best interests in mind.
Lots of herds with horns function just fine. I only know they simply do not fit my preferred management style.

[fcnubian]

Goats are disbudded here because I dont want them getting hung up in the fences. That wouldn't be a good sight, driving up the drive way and see a goat hanging in a fence dead b/c they got their horns stuck. Two, because horned goats are dangerous. I've been rammed by a goat with horns. All of my goats that are born here are disbudded. All does that are bought are disbudded.

I also raise nubians, they have to be disbudded to be shown.

[fillycate]

I have small children, and I need them to be safe around the goats. Our first goat, a wether, had horns and liked to "play" inappropriately with my children. When he began hurting them, he was out the door! I now have a strict "no horns" rule and a LGD to protect against coyotes.

[goatkid]

I show my dairy goats and horns are not allowed. I also don't want them getting caught in the fence. I once had a Boer doe who had horns. She put a big blood blister on the side of one of my does prior to a goat show and used her horns to scoop other does into the air. I sold her. No horns here.

[Goat Servant]

Everyone has to make this decision according to what kind of goats, what kind of fencing, if they have small children etc.
We raise Boers and personally I think they look more dignified with horns. Generally they are pretty docile, the only time I get hit is at feeding time and its not that they are attacking me, they just get excited about food and Im in the way.
On the other hand, the herd queen is a disbudded Nubian who uses her hard head and her teeth to get what she wants.
One of her daughters we disbudded. Guess who kept getting her head stuck in the hay rack.
We have one Boer who would get her head stuck in fence. We taped a stick across her horns.

Im wondering what the horn configuration is.... our girls horns are back, not straight up or to the side....they would have to really lower their head to do real damage to another animal.

[Filas are Prima]

I was glad that horrid buck had horns this past fall while he was here for my doe!
The fiend became agressive to everything, and got out on his power trip rampage. Luckily, I was able to get a hoolihan around those mighty antlers of his, and get a dally around a stout post and whoa him down into manageability.
He went down the road shortly after that.

[Meg Z]

When I was a kid we had goats with horns. Every day we had to patrol the fences and remove goats from it.

One day when I came home from school I found my favorite goat, Ginger, had been stuck in the fence. A pack of feral dogs had gotten to her before I could, though. They were outside the field fence, where her head was. Had been, by the time I found her. Wasn't much left.

Not something most 12-year-olds should come home to.

I disbudded all my dairy goats as an adult. Boers have a different horn set, and aren't so inclined to get hung up, so we've never done those. Once they're past a certain size, they're pretty well fence safe.

Meg

[steff bugielski]

All my goats have horns. They are full sized and no problems. We use electric fence so they don't get stuck. There are reasons they have horns who am I to remove them. Besides they look so cool especially my buck. I have never been injured beyond a black and blue. I liken them to teeth in dogs. Both can be deadly but we train our dogs to not bite, so I train the goats not to use their horns on people.

[goatsareus]

wild goats and domesticated goats are kept in entirely different circumstances. I believe goats in the wild benefit by having horns.

My first two adult goats; one was polled (didn't God also create the polled gene?) and one had horns and had been the dominate goat from a 75 head herd. She was just too dangerous. She knew where those tips of her horns were and did not hesitate to use that knowledge.

So my issue is with the safety of humans and other goats. Since I choose to keep goats in an unnatural confinement, then it is my responsibility to also manage those goats so the goats and humans receive the least possible harm. And considering God did create the polled gene, maybe she is winking at us saying it is okay to remove those horns?