Winter kidding benefits?

[DixyDoodle]

This is for all you goatie people who have goats in the northern parts where the winter is REALLY winter! Well below freezing temps, bitter winds, deep snow.

I happened to notice that several people are waiting for winter kids. Just curious if you find a benefit to this or is it due to some "ooops" matings, or you just run your bucks with your does all the time, so kidding occurs "whenever"? Or maybe you are forced to because getting your does in heat at the right time is difficult?

I was under the impression from most goatie folk that it is best to schedule your does to kid in the mid-spring or later so the cold isn't as much of a bother or danger? Perhaps I'm wrong with this? Not trying to attack anyone for their decision on kidding time, just wondering.

My plan was to get my does bred so they will kid in May or a bit later. Not too much later as I would like them to be fairly grown come next winter.

Your plans?

[jerryf]

I am in Minnesota. I have a Registered Full Blood Boer herd. Traditionals, Reds and Blacks. All my kids are sold as breeding stock. I have a good barn--metal exterior and the interior is sheeted with plywood. No insulation in the walls. I have perfected winter kidding so kid loss is minimial. I kid the herd once a year. Once the kids are dry and a couple days old the cold doesn't bother them. During kidding the goats are confined to the barn. On November 29th this year's kidding started--- I had 7 does kid in one day! During our first big winter storm, high winds and zero degrees. I use 55 gal barrels with a heat lamp in the top, New borns are put under the heat. When does with kids are turned together, I have a small creep area with a heat lamp. After a few days I elinimate the heat lamp. Kids are bounsing around the barn on fresh straw. The barn stays just above freezing.Air quality is good, not damp as there are fresh air intakes in the walls.
The benefits of winter kidding:
1) No flies to pester the young kids, eg no pink eye. Kids gain well.
2) With cold temps there is no germ growth so the kids are healthier. Does milk better in the cold than in th summer heat.
3) Gestating does get plenty of excerize during the summer on pasture
4) When fall feeding starts, the does start kidding. On Good alfalfa hay and grain the does milk well. I figure if I am dry feeding the herd may as well be kidding and nursing kids.
5) No kidding occurs on pasture. We have coyotes around here, we avoid predator loss.
6) In deep snow winters goats are in the barn for most of the time. If I am cleaning barn, they may as well be nursing kids. Buck kids are weaned at 3 1/2 months, the doe kids nurse till they are 4-5 months old. I figure the doe has plenty of milk why wean early.
7) Late fall kids are large at 5-6 month old and ready to market as breeding stock in early Spring, when most kids are just being born. So I get a jump on the market. I have found selling breeding stock-- beautiful doe and buck kids at 5-6 months old 'in Bloom' -- is easy in Spring......pasture are geening up and buyers are ready to buy. Traditonal Spring -summer kidding the kids are ready to sell in fall, when buyers are faced with barn space issues and buying feed for winter......and winter family living is more expensive in winter so the buyers budgets are tightier.

Everyone's situation is different. This is what works for me.

Jerry Fletcher
http://www.fletcherthreeoaks.com

[AnnaS]

My does are bred to kid in mid-March and early April. I did have a round of unanticipated early heats that would have led to December & January kiddings. I aborted those.

One big advantage for me is the timing of the dry period. My herd is on DHIA test so we just do 60 days dry. With March/April kidding, I'm not milking during the coldest part of winter and the does aren't being pulled 3 ways between growing kids, keeping warm and milking.

Winter/early spring kids also have a growth advantage. Worms & coccidia are dormant. There are no flies to spread pinkeye or bacterial diarrhea. The kids will be 2 or 3 months old by the time they get these challenges.

Many show breeders want older, larger kids to show in the summer. Size and maturity is an advantage in the show ring.

Early spring kids will also have enough growth to breed to freshen as yearlings. May kids may not make weight in time.

On the other hand...

Dealing with the cold can be a huge challenge. I had a April 5 kid who was an attended birth, dried off with towels, the hairdryer and his momma's love, but still had frostbitten ears. My 2008 March babies will probably spend some time in the kitchen or in my cabin instead of the huge cold barn. Any bottle babies will need some supplemental heat when it's -14 in the barn.

Show breeders may want does to freshen in May or June so they will have peak milk (and thus lovely udders!) during the summer show season.

Later freshening lets the herd use more pasture to make milk. If hay is expensive, freshening does when pasture is available is a good strategy.

Both strategies have their good points & bad points. It is really one of those things that is up to the individual breeder's plan and resources and not a "right or wrong" answer.

[moonspinner]

As long as you're present at cold weather births to make sure the kids are completely dried off, as long as they're healthy, as was mentioned winter can be a positive for kids. Reduced chances for cocci too. However, if a kid(s) is sickly in winter, not fun. I used to do winter kiddings but no more - not because of the goats, but me. I just hate going out there in frigid temps!

[Trey]

For a commerical meat hear, the advantages are the same as above, lack of bugs, germs. Also you want market kids around easter time, Dec./Jan. is the time for them. I will be breeding 1/2 for easter kids and 1/2 for Christmas time kids.

[topside1]

Good reads, thanks.

[armeda]

Our kidding in the winter was an accident. The does had their 1st kids
May 30 - June 17. Well in July, we got a new tiny buck. He kept escaping!
On July 11, my husband saw him breed a doe. He escaped over a 3 week
period so we're not exactly sure when the other 2 are due. Lily had hers on
Dec 12. We wanted them to have a break between kiddings. I am glad they
are young, healthy does. We are wondering how hard it will be to find homes
for them this time of year. They are pygmys. I think March or April is a good time
to kid for us.

[Sher]

Jerry said it perfectly. You DO want to be checking quite a bit more than you would in the summer. For us, besides the good reasons that Jerry gave, our kids will be hitting the market at a great weight.

We only have one doe left to kid. We lost one kid in this years kidding and had I been there..it may have made it.

[Oldntimes]

I usually always kid in April and May, just works out better for me with my working scheduel, I am away to work full time, so warmer weather works best if I can not be there.

However, that means any retained kids are not ready to breed in the fall. So this year I am taking the challange and breeding 1/2 my herd to kid in Feb. and the Jr's will kid in summer. I want to retain a few kids out of my Feb. freshening and want them to be ready to kid late next spring. So I will see how this works out for me. After this year eveyone will be back to being bred in late fall to kid in March and April.

If I was home all the time , I ertainly would spred them out from Feb-April having no summer kids, but I am not in that situation, so I have to do what works best for me.

[goatkid]

We breed to start kidding the beginning of March, when the weather isn't quite so cold, but the parasites and cocci aren't as prevalent. We kid through May and sometimes June with the younger FF kidding then. The earlier kids we had here were an oops ( feisty bucklings snuck back in).

[Laura Workman]

I like kidding in January/February because the kids can be bred the next fall for milk the following spring. Plus, March/April, when the time the kids are weaned, is the time of year when people are looking to buy and kids sell easily. Later kiddings, like from May on, make for slower sales.

Yes, it's cold and nasty out, but I put does into freshly cleaned kidding stalls when they look about ready to kid, and keep them there for several days to bond and give the kids a good start.

[waygr00vy]

Here in Florida, winter is ideal for kidding because it is not so dang hot and humid! Not as many parasites although still have to be careful. Also, I find christmas time is the easiest time to sell kids (nigerians). I have found fall-early spring alot more people tend to buy goats and horses around here because in the summer we often have drought, hay shortages, and it is so hot no one really wants to be outside dealing with extra animals! The weather is just about perfect right now, you want to be outside all day long...

[steff bugielski]

I have had them kid out in the snow with temps below 0 degrees F. Those did get a bit of frostbite on their ears. Winter kidding for me hads to do with easter sales. Also when the kids are to be weaned everything is growing and it makes for some good eating.

[hoofinitnorth]

Breeders up here in Alaska often breed year 'round. Most that don't do it say it's due to convenience/comfort for them (including the level of worry they would have over dam and kids). Those that routinely do it have a great set-up with indoor kidding areas, heat lamps, many supplies, and lots of experience.

Although I've been learning about goats for almost a year now (slowly, steadily, lol), I have only had mine for a few months. I am pen breeding my dry doe in to one of my bucklings now and if she took the first time, she is due in late April, if she took the second time, she is due in late April or early May. That is about the coldest time of year I'd like to strive for as a newbie and I do have indoor kidding areas, great local mentors, etc.

Now maybe in a few years I'll have enough experience and hutzpa behind me to try for earlier kiddings... lol

Actually, I do have a plan to breed my oldest doe in fall 2008, which would give me an early 2009 kidding. Yipes! I better be prepared if I plan to keep that schedule! lol

[DixyDoodle]

Aha, so there are some benefits! Makes sense to me! I particularly agree with the having kids to sell come spring. I find here also that people are "thinking spring" which is really prevalent at the spring auctions. No one is thinking about horrible winters, lack of hay, frostbitten fingers....LOL

[moonspinner]

I have to agree, early year kiddings means you can breed does in fall. And I like buck kids to be early as well, as I have gotten boys born in spring still not up to the task of breeding come fall. For those who show, earlier births mean more mature juniors. On the other hand spring kiddings mean the moms can get out on pasture and more peak udders for showing.

[JB114]

We just had a doe give birth last night she is a fainter and we have 3 other does about ready to give birth also (Nigerians). Being in Fla does have its advantages of not haveing to many freezing nights but i do make sure they have proper bedding likw cedder chips and a heat lamp in the shelter but not where it would create a hazard. I also prefer to keep the new mom and kid by themselfs in a stall for a week untill the kid is strong enough to be with the older goats but the stall is in the big pen so its not like there alone but protected from the others being to curious.

[Sweet Goats]

I always kid in the winter. Jan Feb is the best for us. I have never lost a kid and I have never had a sick one either. I have never had any Cocci trouble with any kids, or anything for that matter.
I really do believe that they get a better immune system built up. I also show so they are a little bigger if they kid early.
I don't know maybe I have just been really lucky.

[fcnubian]

I'm in North Central Indiana.

I try to have all the does kid out by April. That didn't go as planned this year. My pygmys I want kidding out between Dec.-Feb. And the Nubians I want any time between Jan-April.

The reason is because I dont want any does due during the summer, those are my show months. I dont want to have to worry about a doe kidding while I'm at the show.

My barn is set up for winter kidding.

[dbarjacres]

I like winter breeding. I'm usually home (except for work of course) and don't have to plan too much around kidding does. Plus it's cleaner this time of year vs. having kids in spring when everything goes to mud and slop in Wisconsin. And I especially like that I have kids ready to go when people are looking and bucks that are ready for breeding in fall.

I also do have a small barn specifically for kidding and milking that's 12x20 and fully insulated with an electric forced air heater and heat lamps I can hook up in a jiffy. I have 6 does due between late January and March, I then have enough space for everyone to kid in clean area, get to know each other and then kick them back out with the rest of the herd (we use Poly Dome calf huts and also have a 10x10 shed with their hay in it that they like to sleep in as well that all stay cozy). Plus in Wisconsin you never know with the weather. 5 years ago in early May we had a tornado take our horse barn - it was 90 degrees that day - and 5 days later we got 8 inches of snow!