Try to save or put down?

[Lizzieag]

Hi everyone,
One of my goats was returned to me and it was foundered. She is in a lot of pain. We are treating, but I she will never fully recover.

Does anyone have experience with founder is goats? I don't want to put this poor goat through a whole bunch of treatments that hurt her, if she isn't going to recover enough to have a happy life. I am thinking of the recent case of the race horse (barbadoes?) Seems a shame that he went through tons of pain, only to be put down anyway.

If there is hope for her to at least make a decent recovery, I am more than willing to put the work in. I just don't want her in pain.

What would you do? Anyone know of any tried and true things that will help founder?

[Liese]

My philosophy is "where there's life, there's hope". In my goat vet book Dr. Dunn states: ' ..with modern drugs it is always worth a try'. He goes on that your vet will most like perscribe an antinflammatory to relieve pain. So perhaps the people who had her will help you out with the meds costs, but either way it if she were mine I would be taking her in ASAP or if they really won't see her at least pick up the meds so she will be more comfortable. You have already done the best thing by getting her feed concentrates down and I think your idea of drying her off makes alot of sense. Now you just need to get positive! You sound pretty knowledgeable, I think you can pull her through!

[Alice In TX/MO]

here's a good link with a picture of the bone structure and suggestions:

http://kinne.net/laminit.htm

[Sher]

Hi .. I read both of your threads. So sorry about your girl. You seem to be a gal that is more than willing to help her through this. So, with that in mind..I would do the following..keep in mind I haven't had enough coffee before writing this..lol.

I don't know where you are..but if its a rainy, humid, hot bed like it is here..I would make sure she has a place to go that is dry footing..be it a cement lot, barn, hog hut, pile of rocks, etc. Because ya don't want to risk hoof rot or hoof scald while she's in this condition.

I would make sure she has minerals..and that she is eating them. If that means buying some minerals that people call candy..so be it. She needs them. And if she doesn't eat them..she will probably not get back to her old self.

Now this one may be controversial (sp..told ya I needed more coffee!) Some vets around here treat founder .. by treating the thymus and thyroid glands. A friend of mine has mules..one old boy foundered..he was put on meds for the above and by looking at him..you would never guess. They keep him trimmed and on his meds..and he goes on the big trail rides..miles and miles long..up mountains, etc. And before he received the treatment..he was in very bad shape. So .. its a thought. I haven't read up on thymus/thyroid treatment for goats..but if you cannot find anything..let me know.

I doubt if she would ever see grain again if she lived here. But maybe months down the road. In other words..I would keep her on alfalfa and pasture.

I think I would also message those front legs..from the knees down. Maybe even use a stimulating lintament. If she hasn't been down forever..I think the circulation can come back. I would also keep a good eye on her pads. To make sure no open sores are occuring that might lead to an opportunistic infection.

If you have B-complex..I would be giving it to her. It will help her thymus/thyroid.

IF you can find where the thymus and or thyroid are on a goat. I would definitely put my thumb there..and gently stimulate that point. Its like doing reflexology on humans.

And lastly..at least for now..I would be patient. You did not sell her on her knees..it took time to get her that way. It will take time to get her back up. And she may always be sensitive when it comes to her feet. And even if she gets back up and gets around great..you may catch her on her knees and you may notice that she prefers to "nap" alot. Doesn't mean she isn't having a good life. Means..she is in control of her destiny in a way. She is listening to her body. Just like we do.

I wish you much luck. If I have time to root around..I will let you know of anything else. Have a great day.

Oh..I know that you and the farrier had your hands full with the hooves. But make really, really sure that there is no "scald". It likes to hide way up in the fleshy/hairy part between the toes. You should be able to see a raw or scabbed up place there if she has it. I almost hope that is what she has .. as you can get on top of that pretty easy!

[QueenB04]

Lizzieag: Everything that Sher said and thensome, even - her extra jolt of java is correct. Treating founder really is a means of treating more holisticly, in my experience. Yes meds are gets, but through vitamins, common sense in terms of solid dry footing, massage, poultices work well too, heat wraps, it's all very involved but this involvement pays off. Founder can be disabilitating absolutely, but if this is her first time (?) then treat and manage the problem as mentioned by Sher. You can also give small amounts of MSM to goats, like a teaspoon full, once to twice a day. This will bring down the inflamation occuring in the leg structure, and stave off any rotation that can occur. The positive thing is that with a goat, unlike a horse, their legs are not as essential to everyday functions. If she is laying down you still need to be on the lookout for digestive troubles, but it's not nearly as critical as it would be a horse. I would also do a round of probios, and electrolytes, keep her body functioning at the optimal level. You can do it, and it will pay off in the end.