Dam raised vs bottle baby question

[Rockin'B]

Is it all about the socializing? Are there other considerations that are important to consider as well?

I'm a newbie with 4 Nigerian Dwarfs and will have a doe ready to breed in the future. I'm trying to learn the right way for us to go about this.
Thanks for your thoughts.


Bill

[christij]

Well, this year I didn't have the time with a young babe and starting to subsitute teach so I let my two does raise thier kids. I tried to be out there as much as possible the first few days to bond. But as it was cold and I was getting called a lot to work I couldn't be consistent. They saw me twice a day but it wasn't enough. Now that school is out I am going to be devoting time to winning them over. I can catch them and move them into thier own stall at night but they don't run to greet me. Now the bottle boy I had for a week was all about greeting me!
The plus side has been when I haven't been able to milk (due to DD keeping me up with teething,etc) the kids did it for me! =)
Next year I hope to able to bottle feed any does.
Somepeople aslo fear CAE spreading from kids from mothers milk. But my does all came from a safe herd so I wasn't worried about that.

[Idahoe]

I have both dam and bottle kids all comingling in the same herd. It's my first kidding season ever, so these are just my experiences SO FAR .

The dam raised kids I was at their births, and handled them a lot. They are now a month old almost, and if I'm in the pen for a while, they come over and crawl on me just like the bottle babies. They are more detatched than the bottle kids, who mob me once I'm inside. They are friendly and enjoy scratching and even holding, but they aren't so darn NEEDY as the bottle kids. The dam raised kids don't come running when they see me, they notice I'm there and think I am interesting, so they come on over.

Since they are my first kids I will probably pay more attention to them than the next crowd , but with some daily time spent with them, I think dam raised kids are more to my personal taste. But this is early on in my life with goats. Also, dam raising is a management option many goat owners choose not to do for disease protection.

Of course my bottle babies are "special", I know their personalities so much better, and they LOVE me in the way a goat kid can love you to death (yours).

[Oldntimes]

I have both bottle and Dam rasied goats in my herd and I see absolutly no difference in them as far as temerment or personality. I my self Dam raise my kids. I work full time so bottle feeding is impossable. That is what works for me. My Dam raised kids seem very friendly as I spend time with them as much as I can. I believe it is up to each individual and what thier goals are for milk production and what thier schedules are. For us the milk is only for my family ,so volume is not a problem so, Dam rasied works well for us. Others that rely on milk production have to bottle feed to meet thier milk demands.

[deetu]

When I got my first two goats, mother and daughter, mom was bottle fed. They had 5 doelings between them the first year and I spent alot of time playing with the kids so they were all friendly. Now mom was matriarch and a terror to the rest of the herd so I culled her, even though she threw beautiful kids. Daughter is now matriarch and keeps everyone under control.

Then I had a little triplet that took two days to stand up. She was bottle fed and moved to the barn once she was strong enough to play with the other kids. I can honestly say that this goat, as an adult, is the biggest pain in the butt. She gets into the most trouble because she wasn't given goaty manners. She will try to push me around. When the matriarch was moved for kidding, she terriorised the rest of the herd. She would wait outside the door for a kid to come out so she could pop it. She won't leave me alone if I am trying to work on something in the pen (goat spit, especially after drinking water is not that appealing)

I didn't spend as much time with the newer kids and they are not as friendly but are okay. The one wild one I had decided she really liked me when I started combing her winter hair out. Now when I feel someone biting my butt, it's her waiting to get a good scratching.

So I decided that if I need to bottle feed a baby, it goes right to the auction so someone else can do the bottle feeding. (I hold onto it until time of bidding so it never touches the ground there.)

That's just me.

[pookshollow]

I have one bottle baby (mom rejected her) and the rest are dam-raised. Emily knows her name and likes to be with me more than the rest, but they're all friendly. Sara, Emily's mother, was also a bottle baby, but I don't find her to be any different than my other mature goats. I handle them all enough that they're well-socialized. I'm sure I have hoof-prints up and down the back of all my barn clothes - I know I have them on the front!

Now, Emily has been in with the herd full-time since she was two weeks old, (and started jumping on the dining-room table ) so she is well-socialized in herd dynamics too. She knows she's a goat.

[mary,tx]

Probably the biggest arguments for bottle raising are CAE prevention and socialization. Also, if you want to sell the kids, you can do so sooner if you have them on bottles.

Sometimes a bottle raised kid won't have the instinct to raise her own, which can be a problem if you decide later to do it that way, or sell to someone who wants the doe to raise her own.

I have done both, and usually end of with some of each every year. If you leave the kids on the dam, they really need to be handled every day to be as tame and well behaved as you want them.

It is my own limited experience that it might not be best to bottle raise a buck, who once mature, then considers you part of the herd.
My number one buck was dam raised by a 4H'er who handled him and showed him. He has an excellent disposition.

mary

[Rockin'B]

I forgot about the CAE thing...

Thanks for your thoughts. You've given me plenty to think about when I clean stall tomorrow!

[ozark_jewels]

Besides the CAE prevention thing, it mostly depends on what you want from your goats. If you want friendly, easy to catch and handle, then you will either need to bottle or else spend booku time with the kids as they are dam-raised. And I do mean a *lot*.
If you want milk goats, bottling is the best way to have a great relationship with your future milkers.
After bottling all my kids for three years and having to milk and catch the dam-raised ones.....I will never dam-raise milk goats again, unless circumstances just absolutely prevent me from bottling.
The dam-raised ones do fine about milking as long as I stick to exactly the same routine every time. But alter that routine, they don't know what to do, they are hard to catch.....wastes my time and is not fun for either party. For goats you want to handle....its bottling all the way in my opinion.
For brush goats, meat goats, goats you don't want to handle.....dam-raising will work fine.

[mygoat]

I will be bottle raising most if not all of my kids from now on. Yes, I have a couple of dam raised does in my herd. Though I spent tons of time with both of them as kids, both run away when I try to catch them. ONLY when I try to catch them. If I'm just petting them, they're fine. They are miniatures, so it's not like I have to milk them daily or anything, but have even the slightest suspicion that I'm "after them", they're GONE. Now, I do have a dam raised doe who is an absolute dear, follows me around and just wants to be scritched. Then I have my bottle babies.... Who mob me. I'll be bottle raising all kids out of dairy goats from now on, because singles or even twins sometimes can ruin udders on the dairy does. Especially singles, who often nurse only from one side... And I have a doe that has a ruined udder to prove it, from before I purchased her. Man, I woudl've loved to see her udder before the blowout... She milks about 10.5 lbs a day, and the one side is just lovely. The injured side, though... It's rather sad. I also plan on raising all my dairy kids on CAE prevention, and all bottle baby minis will not get heat treated milk or whatnot, but will only get milk from neg. tested does.

[manygoatsnmore]

I've also heard that if a doe's udder is going to develop to its full size and capacity, it needs that stretch from holding 12 hours of milk at a time. Something to think about if you are going to show, or go on test/do a one day milk test for a milking star. That star adds a lot more value to your kids from the doe, so it may be a consideration, especially for a first or second freshener, where they are still growing that udder.

I really prefer the friendliness of the bottle raised kids, and as long as they are still with the goat herd, they will "learn to be a goat", lol. As far as manners go, they will treat you the way you let them. Kids are NOT allowed to climb on us or jump up. What's cute when they are a month old isn't cute anymore when you are talking about a full-grown buck! I do have to remind dd of this every year, but we do end up with well mannered goats in the end. Dam raised kids that we have bought from elsewhere have been wild and never truly became as tame as the bottle raised kids (home raised or purchased). Our own dam-raised kids with tons of people time are still a little more skittish than the bottled kids. We end up doing a little of both as we have more milk than we can use during the spring, and the time factor in hand milking more than a few does. Only tested CAE/CL neg does are allowed to nurse their kids, and only the ones not destined for a milk test. Ideally, all the kids would all be bottled.

[christij]

Also might want to consider your weaning options if you have milkers! I only have 2 acres and we have alot of crying goats right now b/c they see/hear each other. It's not the easy process I thought it was going to be.

[southerngurl]

Dam raised goat will often take after their mom in how they act around people. If the mama is skittish, then the babies may well be also. Ours did great dam raised, they are very friendly. I didn't spend tons of time with them, just hung out around feeding time petting them and such.

[Feral Nature]

I used to dam-raise, now i bottle-raise for all of the above reasons.

It's funny, everyone uses the expression "being mobbed" by their bottle-babies...so true.

It's like being a "Beatle" and stepping into room full of girls. The bottle-babies love you, love you, love you!!!!!! They are such crazed fans it's just insane!