Kinder Goat

white eagle · #1 04/26/07, 11:47 PM

What is a kinder goat?

I have seen folks talking bout these goats What type of goat are they?

How can a person get some and plus how is the milk from them?

Thanks for the help.

fcnubian · #2 04/26/07, 11:50 PM

Kinders are nubianxpygmy. Not sure on the milk though. The only one I owned I ended up selling because she had horns and kept getting them stuck in the fence and I was afraid she's hang herself.

DixyDoodle · #3 04/27/07, 04:16 AM

Ideally, a Pygmy buck and Nubian doe, from what I understand. And of course the goat can be disbudded (horn buds permanently taken off when young) so horns would not be an issue if you don't want them left on, just like other goats.

I haven't heard anyone say what their milk would be like, but since they would probably be smaller than a Nubian, you would not get quite as much milk as a large goat, but more than a Pygmy (which would maybe be a litre a day).

Good luck in finding some, they are scarcer than hens' teeth around my area, just like Nigerian Dwarfs.

DD

Gailann Schrader · #4 04/27/07, 08:48 AM

My Kinder doe gives ~3/4 gallon a day. A heavy milker REGULAR sized doe can give 1 1/2 - 2 gallons a day. NORMAL (what is normal anyway?) is a gallon to a gallon and a half a day during heavy lactation.

The Kinder milk is richer- due to the Nubian/Pygmy.

AND they are good personalities!

MamaDee · #5 04/27/07, 09:51 AM

We have two Kinders. They are a cross between a Nubian doe and a Pygmy buck. But I think once you have a Kinder, you just breed Kinder to Kinder. Anyway.......

The milk is awesome! It is richer than regular goat milk and therefore, better for cheese, butter, yogurt, etc. --although I have not done that yet. I like the milk we used to buy from pure Nubians just fine. But once I tasted the Kinder milk I was hooked. Yummmm! And I was used to store bought skim--so for me this was surprising.

I'd be interested to hear others' comments on temperment, too. Our 7 year old is no fun on the milkstand...but she is 7. Our three year old is a breeze on the milkstand but thinks she is the queen of the herd. Maybe b/c they are older than our Nubians (who are 1) they behave this way? I've never heard anyone else say they have problems with Kinder personalities.

They are also easier to handle than the bigger Nubians--especially for the children.

Luna is easy to milk--with good sized teats. Pickles is hard--my son can do it easy, though. Her teats are smaller and shorter. What does the average Kinder have teat wise?

I really like them....the milk has sold me!

In Missouri, there are places to get Kinders--also Iowa. Where do you live? I'm sure there are others--this area is what I am familiar with.

Dee

Gailann Schrader · #6 04/27/07, 01:09 PM

in addition, they eat less because they are smaller, can be put in smaller areas, and tend to have "litters" instead of one/two/three kids.

My FF last year had trips and I expect her to have trips this year as well.

One/Two to butcher for the freezer (or sell) and one/two to sell/grow up for next year's FF...

I'm going to try for SPOTTED Kinders. Mine are not going to be registered (my son's last year in 4-H is this year), but I plan to breed for udders and temperment.

cjb · #7 04/27/07, 04:41 PM

I don't have kinders but our local goat expert recommended against them because of the temperament. I know by experience that Nubians can be loud and are escape artists and pygmys are the latter. From what she says - the kinders are a real handful so did not take off well as a breed.

Gailann Schrader · #8 04/30/07, 09:37 AM

I believe the temperment depends on the parents. Like dogs, horses, people, anything. If you have flighty, unruly parents? The offspring will have the tendency.

LomahAcres · #9 04/30/07, 10:10 AM

I would agree with the above. Our kinders are very laid back, and have been the easiest to fence in so far (compared to our Nubian & Nubian crosses). As for milking, I currently have FF Kinder girl, and no milk stand to put her in, because she is too short for our stander one, so she is being milked on the ground. She stands and waits for me to milk with no restraint. Occasionally she will take a step forward, but for the most part she stands still and is very well behaved. She is bringing in about 3#s and day.

Our 3-year-old buck is also very sweet and easy-going. I don't have to worry about the kids (human) with him, and he has been so easy to handle, I wish our other bucks were that good!

Freeholder · #10 04/30/07, 03:22 PM

The only temperament issues I've had with my Kinders in the three years that I've had them is one doe, and her daughter, who are shy and a little skittish. That pretty much straightened out after they freshened for the first time, though.

I suspect that the so-called 'goat expert' has absolutely no experience with Kinders -- don't know where she got her temperament assessment at all. Everyone I know who has them says they really like their temperament. And, the Kinder breed has only been around since about 1985 -- they are just starting to take off now. There has to be some critical mass before a breed can become fairly common and well-known -- people have to hear about them, try them, tell others about them. It takes time! We hear from people on the Kinder goat list who are interested in them, but can't find any near where they live . . . as we get more people raising them, more people who want them will be able to get them.

They are noisier than my Oberhasli crosses, though. I suppose that comes from the Nubian side of the family.

As far as the original post, Kinder goats (if you want to be able to register them) come from a cross of a registered Pygmy buck on a registered Nubian doe. You could do it the other way around, but would risk kids too big for the Pygmy doe to deliver. Then subsequent generations come from crossing Kinder to Kinder. You can get a Kinder either by getting a good-quality Nubian doe and breeding her to the best Pygmy buck you can find, or by finding someone who is breeding Kinders and buying some from them. As already mentioned, in some areas there are plenty of breeders, but in other areas there aren't many or maybe even any at all.

The milk is the best-tasting milk of any I've ever had, and I've had almost every breed of standard sized goat, and was raised on a cow dairy so grew up on fresh raw cow milk. Kinder milk beats them all hands down. (Mini milk, or Nigie, is probably as good as Kinder milk, because Nigies have rich milk, too.) Butterfat from a Kinder ranges from 5 1/2 % up to 8%. Milk solids are double the amount from the large breed goats, more like sheep milk, which gives larger yields of cheese and thicker yogurt. The only problem we've had with the Kinder milk is that it's too rich for some people. It's like drinking half and half.

Kathleen (who has a few Kinders for sale right now, if anyone in our area is looking)

ailsaek · #11 04/30/07, 08:07 PM

I'm pondering seeing if I can pick up a Kinder doeling when I pass through Ohio this summer. By then, if all goes right, I'll already have a Nigie doe and wether, so she'll have company, and then I'll be able to see which breed I prefer. (At the moment, I'm planning a Nigie/Kinder/Pygora herd.)

white eagle · #12 04/30/07, 09:14 PM

thanks for the help. I'm going to do some more soul searching before jumping into this. It sounds like they may be a good goat.

Tam319 · #13 04/30/07, 09:26 PM

I'm always hesitant to take advice from people who use blanket statements like "All Kinders are...." or "All Arabians are..." or "All poodles are...". Kinda silly IMO.

I imagine just like anything there are good and bad specimens and a person must do a little searching to find a good fit for themselves. Its kind of scary that an "expert" would be doling out such "advice".

Ok, this is a super dumb question but I'll ask it anyway

Is it pronounced "Kinder" as in "You were kinder to me than usual" or "Kinder" the same as its pronouned in "Kindergarten". LOL Dumb question, I know

I have raised pygmy goats (grade) for years and have ordered two reg. Nubian 2007 kids from a breeder. I am really interested in raising Kinders as they sound like an ideal homestead type goat.

Tam

MamaDee · #14 04/30/07, 10:24 PM

Is it pronounced "Kinder" as in "You were kinder to me than usual" or "Kinder" the same as its pronouned in "Kindergarten". LOL Dumb question, I know>>>

Not dumb at all! I believe it is kinder as in kindergarten. I recently posted about their teat size and I think I spelled teat "teet" about a dozen times. Didn't figure it out before I read my own post later. Now that's dumb!

Dee

DixyDoodle · #15 05/01/07, 05:00 AM

Quote:

I recently posted about their teat size and I think I spelled teat "teet" about a dozen times. Didn't figure it out before I read my own post later.

Which is way more PC than how some people around here pronounce it.

I call them Kinder as in "kindergarten" but usually I'm thinking about Kinder Eggs (those chocolate eggs with the prize inside). LOL

Ok, I will ask, how does everyone pronounce Sannan.....which I find is also spelled differently depending on where you go.....Sannen, Saneen, etc. "San" as in "sand" + "an" as in "fawn". OR "San" as in "sand" + "an" as in "end". OR "San" as in "say" + "an" as in "end". Argh.

Or Boer: Bow ("boat") + er, Boo + er, Bore. LOL

ailsaek · #16 05/01/07, 07:08 AM

MY own guess as to pronunciations was "kind" as in "kindergarten" (although Kinder Eggs are cool and I wish they were available here), saw-nen, and boo-ur or boh-er (I switch).

Trisha-MN · #17 05/01/07, 09:08 AM

Kin-der as in Kindergarten...
one of their slogans is a play on words: Making the world a little Kinder

Trisha

radar · #18 05/01/07, 01:18 PM

The temperament in my four Kinders has been fine. The does are very friendly and personable, the buck is skittish. He probably did not get as much socializing as a kid. Milking has been easy. Lillian, one of the FFs, was amenable the first time I tried. Mavis, the other FF, was less cooperative and it took me a few days to get her settled, but she's a champ now. Rosemary, who's an experienced milker, also took a few days but she had pretty chapped teats so I gave her some slack for discomfort. I get some hollering, but it's predictable and I walk away when I hear it to discourage it. I am getting good yields for my dairy products, and am even getting a thick yogurt. The cream is pretty incredible, easily an inch thick cream line after a day. I had mentioned in an earlier post, I really like their size. They are so much more manageable and containable than regular sized goats, no fence jumping and easy for me to move around if need be. I had a bumper crop this spring, five doe kids and two buck kids and will need to sell several if anyone is interested. We're in Massachusetts.