Multiples

[steff bugielski]

I was reading the thread about someone having 24 sets of triplets. I was wondering how you all feel about multiples. I sell milk so a single baby is perfect for me. I also sell babies for meat but have only about 20-25 requests. I sell the babie for $75 ea. but they certainly drink more than that in milk. sI like to keep 2-4 doelings each year. I have had many twins and thats OK but I do not get much milk till Eastertime. I have also had a few triplets and I am not a real fan of them. I am always making sure one does'nt get pushed aside for too many feedings and I hate to take much milk away from the babies. Lets face it big babies bring big money. I guess if you sell meat goats triplets simply triple your income from that doe.
How do you all feel.
Steff

[Alice In TX/MO]

Grateful for babies! or baby. Be happy with what comes. What other option do we have?

[stanb999]

Originally Posted by steff bugielski

I was reading the thread about someone having 24 sets of triplets. I was wondering how you all feel about multiples. I sell milk so a single baby is perfect for me. I also sell babies for meat but have only about 20-25 requests. I sell the babie for $75 ea. but they certainly drink more than that in milk. sI like to keep 2-4 doelings each year. I have had many twins and thats OK but I do not get much milk till Eastertime. I have also had a few triplets and I am not a real fan of them. I am always making sure one does'nt get pushed aside for too many feedings and I hate to take much milk away from the babies. Lets face it big babies bring big money. I guess if you sell meat goats triplets simply triple your income from that doe.
How do you all feel.
Steff

Do you pasture feed? Maybe if you cut the grain at mating time you may have the opposite effect. They may instead of having triplets they may just conceive one. This may have an effect......Maybe not. But it will cost less to try. So it can't be that bad.

[Idahoe]

Unless there's a decent market for kids I'm with you, no big urge for a lot of multiples. I haven't had goats for a year yet. I did read about other's 'formulas' for increasing ovulation in their goats prior to breeding, and I'll do that next time if this current kid crop is fairly easily dealt with. Otherwise, I'm happy with singles or twins as long as I get my goat milk back!

[dosthouhavemilk]

From what I understand, there is some connection to overall milk production being dependant on the number of kids in a litter. Multiples will cause a doe to produce more over her lactation than if she was initially carrying a singleton. The body sends out signals for the production when the kids are developing. I know our does that delivered twins have a lot more milk at kidding than the ones that delivered singletons.
That is what I have heard in any case.

Twins are better for birthing than singletons. Twins will be smaller than a singleton and generally deliver more easily. Triplets are smaller yet, but the more you get the more possibilities for trainwrecks.
I wish I had a higher number of triplets this year. We have the milk to feed them and it means more kids to sell in the end. I can't sell the milk and we certainly don't need it to drink (we have a Grade A cow dairy). Though this soap making ahs been a wonderful addition, but I only need a little over 2 pounds of milk to make 8 pounds of soap.....

[ozark_jewels]

Reasons multiples are desirable:
There is a direct connection between how many kids a doe has and how much milk a doe gives. A doe that has a single never gives quite as much as a doe that has twins or trips.
Multiples are generally easier to birth than singles.
Since I sell all my kids as bottle babies, the more kids to sell, the more money I make. An extra doeling can mean another $150 a year.
There is a direct correlation between a does level of nutrition and how many kids she conceives. In most does, it is a sign of a low plain of nutrition if she conceives a single. Twins and triplets are perfectly natural in a doe who is getting all her nutritional needs met. In a wild setting, that is natures way of cutting the numbers of kids in a poor year so the ones born had a better chance of survival.
So singletons are not something I like to see, and triplets tell me my does are doing well at breeding season, not too thin and not too fat. And no, I do not "flush" my girls before breeding. Twins or trips make me happy.

[Freeholder]

I have a doe who is eight this year. Up until last year she'd always had triplets; last year she had quads. No problems kidding at all. I hand bred her last fall -- usually I leave the does in the buck pen for a few weeks at breeding time, but this time I know she was only bred the one time. She had twins. They were a couple of pounds bigger than the triplets and quads she's had in the past, and while she delivered without help, it took her longer than normal, and she walked stiff in the back for two days after they were born. She's giving almost as much milk now, at three months fresh, as she did at two months fresh with the quads last year, though.

I normally bottle feed all my babies, unless I have a FF with tiny teats, so I can ration the milk out as needed (and I did add about half store-bought cow milk to the bottles for a few weeks here), and make sure we get what we need in the house.

For me, the advantage of more babies (besides them being smaller and easier for the doe to deliver) is that we do put some of them in the freezer. Because I don't have a large herd -- I'm milking four does this year -- and have at least one doe kid sold and want to keep one doe kid and two buck kids, we aren't going to have a lot of meat to put in the freezer next winter. Now, next year, the first fresheners will be two year olds, and we should have more kids, so hopefully more meat for the freezer, too.

Kathleen

[Eunice]

Singles, for me, have always been the biggest troubles in kidding. They tend to come out the wrong way (for me, they're mostly upside down lying on their head, but I suppose it could be different for others). Twins are easier to birth, and easier to keep the mothers and the babies healthy. Triplets are okay, and sometimes even quads, but sometimes more multiples tend to be smaller and weaker. Twins are the best in my opinion. However, I also concur that I'm happy with whatever I get, because it isn't like I've got a choice anyway. The more does, the better.

[ozark_jewels]

And you must feed the pregnant doe for the full 5 months anyway....I want as much profit at the end of that five months as possible.

[moonspinner]

For me, as a general rule, give me twins every time. This is from a viewpoint of dam raising. I have found sometimes when three are fighting for the teats, one ends up pushing up the udder and interfering with the doe letting down milk. Plus, if one isn't as dominant you have to make sure it is getting its fair share. Because of this I sometimes supplement one of trips. I have not found any of my trip moms lacking in sufficient milk to feed three however. Of the relatively few kids I have lost - either stillborn or within a few days of birth - they have been one of trips in every case.
Yes, I love the bonus of having extras to sell, but for me twins are ideal. I do find though, that single kids tend to be more impressive individuals for obvious reasons.

[steff bugielski]

moonspinner I think we agree on the triplet thing. I also love how well a single grows up. I have a doeling born 2 weeks ago at 11 lbs. yesterday she weighed in at 22lbs. She is gorgeous. Full blood nubian .
Steff

[Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians]

We bottle raise and dairy kids are a premium now...and my mad money...so multiples are wanted. We have had only 1 single kidding this year...two young 12 month old first fresheners have had twins, the rest triplets, 1 quad and 1 quint. Nicer is that except the single kidding which is my new juinor herd sire...everyone gave us 1, 2 or 3 doelings! Yeah!

I also prefer multiples, not just for the profit margin, but because they are easier on the doe to deliver and gives your doe the boost to milk as much as she can.

Now if I was dam raising and never wanted a bottle kid, than I would not give Bo-se pre breeding, I would rebreed my meat goats right after weaning, so they are not on a rising plain of nutrition. Vicki

[Jim S.]

I'm in the meat biz, and I cull for triplets. If a doe has triplets, she's gone after that. My kids are raise on the doe and weaned at 3 months. I do not want -- nor can I economically justify -- bottle babies, and it has been my long experience over 16 years that triplets mean at least one will become a bottle baby or will die if not bottle fed.

All my goats have dairy influence in them, so it is not a milk quantity issue. It is a dominance issue. One kid will get left out on 2 teats.

That said, I have seen does with 3 distinct teats, or even 4, who have no trouble raising triplets. I just have never owned one!

We like a doe that kids out with one big kid or two medium-sized ones, unassisted, and raises what she drops on her own. I will keep those as long as they can do it! To the extent they cannot do that, they get marked down in the book and become one step closer to the trailer.