cocci question

fishhead · #1 09/26/06, 08:52 PM

I just got a young Togg buckling last Thursday. Since it was raining and I didn't trust my older goats not to drive him out into the rain all night he slept in the back of my truck in a topper with lots of straw. I brought my littlest wether to keep him company for the first night. Since then he's still been sleeping the truck.

His previous owner had been giving him a nightly bottle but said he was old enough to skip the bottle so I stopped.

His diet is mostly browse, a tiny bit of hay and pelleted goat feed. He's eating well.

Anyway, tonight when they were browsing I saw him poop and at the end it looked a bit runny. Sure enough later I saw him cough and squirt at the same time. I gave him a bit of probiotics tonight.

I will definitely be watching him so what do I need to watch for to make sure it's not cocci? I've lost my sense of smell so that's of no use.

Thanks for the help.

Patty0315 · #2 09/27/06, 06:26 AM

I would treat him now for cocci for 5 days . I would also worm him. Keep an eye on the cough to make sure it is nothing else. How old is he ? Do you have access to milk ? If so I would probally continue a bottle for a bit longer. That way you are sure he is getting enough fluids and also it will be easier on him.

Patty

fishhead · #3 09/27/06, 06:40 AM

I'll pick up some cocci treatment (Sulfa?) and some pepto tonight. I don't have any way of weighing him so I'll just have to guess. He feels like about 10-15 pounds. I'll also try to reach his previous owner to find out his exact age.

I have cows milk that I buy at the store. I didn't think I could stop and start without messing up his stomach?

Can I treat and worm at the same time?

That cough is just a random single cough that happens maybe once an hour or 2. The wether I had to put him with is the one with the chronic cough but coincidently that wethers cough has almost disappeared and has changed in tone.

Thanks for the advice.

Patty0315 · #4 09/27/06, 06:44 AM

I use Di-Methox for cocci. Give for 5 days , I would probally treat the wether to.

How long since the last bottle ? Whole cows milk is fine.

Yes you can worm and treat for cocci at the same time . What are you worming with ?

Patty

fishhead · #5 09/27/06, 08:50 AM

His last bottle was last Wednesday. How much can he have at one time?

I have a bottle of Valbazen. That's what my vet recommended for this area.

How much Di-Methox (if I can find it)? I'm going to do a search on the active ingredient just in case my store doesn't have that specific product.

I brought Roger Dodger to work since it was raining. He's out in the topper with hay and goat feed and warm water.

fishhead · #6 09/27/06, 10:34 AM

I just got back from the store and all they had for cocci is soluble Sulfadimethoxine. That's what's in Di-Methox but now I have no clue on how to prepare the correct dose. It looks to be 88% active ingredient.

The package gives a dosage of 25 mg/lb (day one) and 12.5 mg/lb (days 2-4) for calves, heifers and beef cattle.

Anyone?

I picked this off the Fiasco Farm site and will try it.

Sulfadimethoxine Brand Names:

Albon Concentrated Solution 12.5%
Albon Soluble Powder 107 gm pkg
Di-Methoox Concentrated Solution 12.5%
Di-Methoox Soluble Powder 107 gm pkg

Concentrated Solution 12.5% - Straight from the bottle; do not mix with water. Administer/Drench directly into mouth
Soluble Powder mixed as follows: dissolve one package (107 gms) in three cups of water. Keep refrigerated. Administer/Drench directly into mouth
Dose:

Give Orally - Administer straight into the mouth using a syringe (remove the needle). Do not just add it to the kid's water because you will not know if he receives the correct dose. Do not add it to his milk because the milk effects the potency of the drug.

Five day treatment- you must treat the full five days. (we have begun experimenting with only treating three days for the prevention treatment.)
Day one: 1 ml per 5 pounds- given orally.
Days 2-5: 1 ml per 10 pounds- given orally.

Note: We sweeten the drench with a 1 tsp. Stevia herb per cup of Drench; our kids no longer stand around gagging after their treatment and some even seem to like it. (a spoon full of sugar helps the medicine go down...)

fishhead · #7 09/29/06, 08:46 AM

Help!

On Wednesday I treated the little buckling with 2 cc of the above mix and a couple hours later he had a solid dropping. I guessed his weight at 10 pounds but have since revised it to 15 pounds.

I gave him 8 oz of cows milk in the morning and 1 cc last night. I also gave him 8 oz of warm water. He had watery diarreaha but was eating well and very lively.

This morning he had very watery diarreaha and wasn't as lively so I pulled the bottle of milk away after an ounce or 2 and replaced it with warm water. Then I gave him 1 1/2 cc of the mix. I brought him out to the farm and since he wasn't moving as fast as normal I brought him home after hand feeding him some browse. He took the browse but would stop after eating a few leaves of each kind.

I just gave him 2 cc more of the mix thinking I initially underdosed him and then mixed up some electrolyte and gave him 8 oz of that.

The diarreaha is a lighter brown than normal droppings. I can't smell so have no idea if it is strong smelling or not.

Now the questions?

1. Is it possible that I've given him too much water/milk?

2. Should I give him some pepto and how much?

3. Should I split the dose and give the Di-Meth in the morning and the evening?

4. Increase or decrease the dose?

Thanks for the help.

moonspinner · #8 09/29/06, 02:52 PM

I would always advise to match the previous owner's diet as closely as possible in the beginning. Any kind of change can throw kids off, especially when you mix in the new environment. What kind of milk was he on before? Was he on browse and the same amount of hay that you're providing? You could have different browse and perhaps different hay at your place that he's having a tough time in transition. Maybe it's not cocci but either functional diarrhea and/or an infection with the cough. I would definitely do a cocci course on him though.

fishhead · #9 09/29/06, 05:03 PM

Thank you for the suggestions.

I just got home and found that he felt well enough to bail over the fence so he must be feeling better. He looks drier too.

I'm assuming it was cows milk but can't reach the owner. He was on some kind of pelleted feed I believe and no browse. After I got him he was doing great on browse and pelleted goat feed for 5 days.

He's starting to firm up again so I think the increase in Di-Methox is helping. I think I underestimated his weight. I brought home a weight table and will measure him in a few minutes. I'll consider today as day one and go another 4 days of treatment. I'm also going to continue with the electrolytes for a few more days until I see him bouncing around again.

I probably should have given him a prevention course of Di-Methox as soon as I introduced him to the rest of the boys.

His cough is getting worse but I don't know if I can give him shots of penicillin G at the same time I'm giving him oral Sulfa drugs. Can I?

Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians · #10 09/29/06, 06:00 PM

First my ----y self has to say why did you give your hard earned money to someone for an animal and get no help with aftercare??? OK

First if he is only 10 to 15 pounds than he should be on 3 to 4 bottles a day, he is not only not old enough to be weaned but there is no way he is big enough. A weaned Togg kid would be in the 60 pound range. Our weaned Nubian boys are in the 90 pound range!

Always cocci and worm incoming stock, period, and now likely the wether you had in with him. Keep him with the wether for company, and keep him away from all your other stock, the truck cap would make a much better home at night than out in the barn with all the healthy goats you have. From the move he is stressing, he will catch everything, without treatment he likely won't make it if he has scours the first day. It is doubtful that 2cc is enough. Vicki

fishhead · #11 09/29/06, 08:15 PM

Thanks for the help Vicki.

He's another "loaner" so to speak. His owner just happens to be out of town.

He has clumped droppings tonight and is pretty active. I took him over to the farm and he browsed right along with all the rest. Tonight I gave him another 8 oz of electrolytes and 1 cc of Di-Methox. That's a total of 4 1/2 cc today.