goats with swollen faces- help

[lazybee]

You all have been so helpful and here i am again asking for advice!! Just after kidding, one of our does began to swell in the face- it was worse at night and then gone in the morning. I learned this is "bottle jaw" from worms- right? We de-wormed her with Cydectin for three days in a row and gave some antibiotic. After a couple of days her face blew up in the evening like a balloon and the next day she was fine and it was gone. Few days later, it happened with another doe- the first doe's mom actually. We've been treating like the first one and it all seems to be the same. Well, last nite my daughter came in to tell me that the first doe we treated is swelling again! Is it possible it's worms again or are we looking at something different?

[oberhaslikid]

Do you have wasps in your barn? I went through this but the swelling lasted 2 days. They were getting stung.Is this possible?

[Delinda]

How many cc's of wormer did you give her? It does sound like bottlejaw to me.

[homebirtha]

I've never heard of using Cydectin three days in a row? That seems like waaaay too much wormer. There is one type of worm that Cydectin doesn't get and you may need a different wormer for that. Ivermectin Plus? Ack, my brain isn't working.

I would run a fecal to see if you missed something, but I would think the Cydectin would have taken care of a worm problem.

[goatmarm]

Look for other symptoms. A swollen face is one of the symptoms of orf. Do you see any bumps or pimple-like spots on her lips, ears,under her tail area, groin, or on the udder. When they get orf/sore mouth, their faces can puff up like you are describing. The virus is also contagious which could account for the others getting the puffy face too. It doesn't stay swollen for the whole course of the virus( usually as they are just breaking out with it), and can appear to come and go until the goat is over the virus.
Just a possibility.

[mary,tx]

Normally you worm, wait 10 days or so and worm again, to get the ones that hatched out after the first worming. Check your dosage.
mary

[Sher]

I agree with goatmarm. I think she is right about what it is.

[lazybee]

Those who questioned the amount of Cydectin are correct!! We found out today that we are supposed to de-worm and then wait seven days to de-worm again So we will de-worm her again and see if that takes care of the problem. We've been using Ivermectin but it was time to change. I will also look for the signs for sore-mouth but so far they don't have signs for that. I really think it's the worm problem. The two does that got bottle jaw were the thinnest after kidding. Thanks again for the help- i've learned so much on this site!!

[Teacupliz]

we had bottle jaw one year we gave safguard and ivemic three days in row--repeated 10 days later then again in 10 days it can kill a goat -- the swelling will go up and down

liz

[billygoatridge]

I would agree that you might have wasp or spiders in the barn or hay. I've seen bottle jaw to know what it looks like, but we see a goat every once in a while whose whole head swells up to almost double. I think they get a hold of a bee every once in a while when they are grazing. When this happens we give them a couple benedryl and the swelling starts going down in a few hours.

[Delinda]

Sometimes drastic measures are what is needed in extreme cases of bottlejaw. I have delt with sever bottlejaw before and have dewormed the goat way more than what is called for on the label. This doe had it so bad after kidding I hit her 3 days in a row with 5cc's of cydectin. A swelling face is a sign of a huge overload of worms. But you do take a chance of killing to many worms at once, and could kill the doe. But the overload of worms can also kill her. In my case I opted to overworm and she pulled through and is just fine now. Your best bet might just be to take her to a vet, request a fecal, and inform him or her what you have givin her.

[Corky]

If you have goats with swollen faces you have a worm or lice problem big time and you need to get the help of a vet at this point.

Check the eyes and gums to see if they are pink. I will bet they are not!
Give 15 cc red cell vitamins twice a day to build back the iron fast. or ask your vet about giving pig iron paste. I had this happen in my herd one year.
It took time to build them back up.
They will soon start staggering and falling down from weakness.

CALL YOUR VET!

[Laura Workman]

Worm problems tend to have other symptoms before bottle jaw, except right after kidding when things can come on very suddenly. Still, if your goats have nice, shiny coats and pink gums, I'd vote against bottlejaw, and for heaven's sake lay off the wormer. Besides, bottlejaw has a particular look, swollen under the jaw, not the whole face.

You might be getting blister beetles in your hay, or perhaps some other poisonous weed. Or they may be getting stung or bitten by ants, spiders, wasps.

[Delinda]

As I said I would take this doe to a vet and see just what you are dealing with, And Lord knows I don't want to start anything, but bottlejaw can cause the whole face to swell up, not just under the jaw.

[Corky]

My goats whole face swelled up and it was this time of year. Right after kidding even though I had wormed them when they kidded.
It was because they were enemic. I almost lost one.

[lazybee]

Thanks for all the information and advice. This was definiteley bottle jaw. We don't have wasps or bees in the barn- yet! We do deal with fire ants but they learn very quickly to stay away from those hills! Both goats are doing very well. We've added power punch to their diet every now and then and yesterday did a major cleaning out of the barn- spring cleaning! We just didn't worm correctly with the "overload of worms" and not just as maintenance. We neglected to do the 2 weeks later de-worming to kill the next cycle but we've learned our lesson! Thanks again.

[Delinda]

I am glad your goaties are doing well

[Corky]

Me Too! Bottle jaw is scarey! I remember it well!