Insulin resistant mare

ShyAnne · #1 03/28/12, 03:50 PM

Has anyone ever had an IR Mare in foal?

If so I would like to know how you managed her feeding during pregnancy.

This mare is very controlled by soaked hay and timothy pellets and beet pulp thats been rinsed to wash away the molasses. However I am curious how to manage the late term pregnant IR mare.

This mare is a friends mare, not mine, and she is very early pregnant.

I was thinking a good mare foal vitamin/ mineral supplement, such as Farnam Vita plus. And possibly adding alfalfa pellets later to help with protein.

However it would really be nice to get information from someone who has done this.

wr · #2 03/28/12, 11:17 PM

Why does she need bigger and better feed. I always fed my broodmare good grass hay in the winter and in summer they were on grass. Fresh water, good feed and lots of exercise gave outsanding foals and my mares milked very well.

Irish Pixie · #3 03/29/12, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wr

Why does she need bigger and better feed. I always fed my broodmare good grass hay in the winter and in summer they were on grass. Fresh water, good feed and lots of exercise gave outsanding foals and my mares milked very well.

Me too, wr the less supplementation the better. The TBs usually had to have grain in the winter and I had to increase it after foaling when they were in milk.

Shyanne, I'd be very careful about giving this mare anything other than what she's been getting. Does she need it to stay in condition?

ShyAnne · #4 03/29/12, 08:32 AM

She can not have grass being IR. Literally all she gets is soaked hay, rinsed beet pulp and timothy pellets. She has had alfalfa and done fine on it, pelleted form. She has to be kept on a dry lot, so her feed has to be managed. She also can not have grain.

Thats why I was thinking the alfalfa to help her protein, and the vita plus to add in vitamins and minerals needed she wont be consuming from her diet. She also can not be given free choice minerals.

Thankfully this mare isnt very bad, has never foundered, and is easily controlled by diet.

wr · #5 03/29/12, 08:56 AM

In the winter mine just get good prairie wool and they're just fine so I'm still not understanding all the extras. The way I see it, horses do better when we keep their situation as close to what Mother Nature intended and problems arise when we tamper with her system.

Irish Pixie · #6 03/29/12, 09:24 AM

Shyanne, Cornell is looking for IR horses for a study of Equine Metabolic Syndrome because there is an indication that EMS is genetic. Here's a link: met_description

Does this mare fit the criteria?

ShyAnne · #7 03/29/12, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irish Pixie

Shyanne, Cornell is looking for IR horses for a study of Equine Metabolic Syndrome because there is an indication that EMS is genetic. Here's a link: met_description

Does this mare fit the criteria?

I will pass this info on to her owner.
I am learning as I go towards helping her. I know some horses are much worse and need extreme measure taken. This mare seems more borderline. However he owner is very strict on her diet as she doesnt want things to get worse.

Wr, Its not really 'all the extras". Its simply adding alfalfa for needing increase in protein, and also a vit min supplement. Most broodmares need extra in late pregnancy which they can get when they have free choice pasture, or grains. Providing this mare has neither It would be, IMO, in her best interest to have some added vitamins and minerals. I definitely agree with keeping things as close to Mother Nature, however Mother Nature is not as easy going on this mare. She isnt a typical broodmare, she has special needs and we have to provide them.
I can understand if she were able to graze on grass all day long, or have free choice hay, but she can not, she has to have hay thats soaked,( 12 hrs is best to reduce the amount of sugar in the hay) and in limited quantities. She basically can not consume enough to meet late term needs of pregnancy. So thats why I am here hoping someone has fed an IR mare late term pregnancy to see what exactly they did to manage the mares needs.

ShyAnne · #8 03/29/12, 09:48 AM

Sadly, they are looking for Arabians or Morgans, She is 1/2 Welsh. However she does belong to a group where a Dr Keller, I believe, is the leading expert on this.

southerngurl · #9 03/29/12, 09:48 AM

I would leave the diet alone and just make sure she has a good mineral/vitamin supplement since soaking the hay leaches some of those other along with the sugar. As long as her weight is good I would not be worried about her. I would consider grostrong by ADM.

If she is overweight, nursing the baby will be great for her health and I would use it as a tool to get weight off of her, by letting the baby nurse as long as possible and not adding calories that are going to keep her from going to her excess reserves.

I trim a pony that was very fat when we started on her, she had just had a little mule filly (so stinkin cute!). She has been nursing that thing for months and months and she shed most of her weight and looks so much better! Just what she needed and what she was designed to do.

Ohiogal · #10 03/29/12, 09:55 AM

Look at adding Chasteberry to her diet as a med - please consult a vet on that as I'm not sure what if any effect that could have on her developing foal. That will help with the insulin resistance issues, if she can have it.
I had a mare with Cushings that I maintained for about 5 years with a restricted diet and Chasteberry to keep normal pituitary function going. Her being in foal makes it that much harder to manage due to the hormone flucuations.

ShyAnne · #11 03/29/12, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by southerngurl

I would leave the diet alone and just make sure she has a good mineral/vitamin supplement since soaking the hay leaches some of those other along with the sugar. As long as her weight is good I would not be worried about her. I would consider grostrong by ADM.

If she is overweight, nursing the baby will be great for her health and I would use it as a tool to get weight off of her, by letting the baby nurse as long as possible and not adding calories that are going to keep her from going to her excess reserves.

I trim a pony that was very fat when we started on her, she had just had a little mule filly (so stinkin cute!). She has been nursing that thing for months and months and she shed most of her weight and looks so much better! Just what she needed and what she was designed to do.

Right now her weight is perfect, she was very heavy when diagnosed, cresty and heading south quickly.
I havent heard of Grostrong..I will surely look into it. I will post a picture of her, she is beautiful!
Her weight is managed very well with the amount of "ration" she is given, and its possible come later she may only need a bit more to maintain. I am just trying to help her find answers and plan ahead.

Irish Pixie · #12 03/29/12, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShyAnne

Sadly, they are looking for Arabians or Morgans, She is 1/2 Welsh. However she does belong to a group where a Dr Keller, I believe, is the leading expert on this.

What's the other half?

In my experience (and from research) Morgans are particularly susceptible to metabolic diseases, my old gelding (Morab) had Cushing's. Apparently, Arabs are too and Welsh ponies/cobs have Arabian in the breed pedigree, don't they?

ShyAnne · #13 03/29/12, 10:16 AM

This is a picture of her at feeding time, sorry not the most flattering picture, but you can see her weight is very well managed.

Ohiogal~I will have her ask her vet about the Chasteberry, I have read some on that, and know that is helpful, although Like you, I have no idea if its safe during pregnancy.

this is a clickable thumbnail:

ShyAnne · #14 03/29/12, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irish Pixie

What's the other half?

In my experience (and from research) Morgans are particularly susceptible to metabolic diseases, my old gelding (Morab) had Cushing's. Apparently, Arabs are too and Welsh ponies/cobs have Arabian in the breed pedigree, don't they?

We say 1/2 welsh right now, although theres a possibility she is full sec B. Her Uncle passed and she was left this mare. She has horses herself, and she is trying to go back and find out details about her. When she got the mare she could tell something was 'wrong" and had several different vets look at her before she was diagnosed IR. She has had her 3 years now and once she got the weight off her she has be able to manage her. She has foaled once before, although the Uncle sold the foal, and no records were passed down to my friend.
She did find a friend of the uncle who is trying to help her trace the mares history.

Either way the foal will be registered 1/2 welsh as she is in foal to our Sec A welsh mountain stallion. :

She did have a BSE prior to breeding and the vet feels she will do fine.

ShyAnne · #15 03/29/12, 10:29 AM

This is a comparison picture from when my friend first brought her home. She was VERY heavy here:

ShyAnne · #16 03/29/12, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by southerngurl

I would consider grostrong by ADM.

They actually make a mineral Vit supplement for the metabolic horse, this is great info thank you so much!
Its called :
StaySTRONGTM
Metabolic Mineral Pellets

southerngurl · #17 03/29/12, 07:25 PM

The staystrong, as I recall, is just a low NSC feed with grostrong mineral added. You don't really need the feed portion in her case.

AugustRED · #18 03/31/12, 08:16 AM

I've feed something called Remission (AniMed) to my sugar sensitive horse with good results. ADM's Growstrong minerals are great, you may also look into their other forage first products. They're designed to use little or no grain and have a couple high fat supplements. Basically if she needs help gaining weight later on fat should be a safe way of getting it to her without risking starches. They also have a product called ShowBoost which is high protein (haven't really looked at it closely though). With my mare & colt (she's not IR) I did use alfalfa to add protein & they're both looking great. Lots of time they can maintain well on plenty of good quality hay, just might be alot! So for her you might be fine with what your feeding, maybe add a vit/mineral mix if you're concerned & just increase her roughage intake as needed (especailly considering IR horse are normally very easy keepers). Even if she gets a bit thin nursing it's really not a huge problem as she's unlikely to have trouble gaining it back once the foal is weaned...