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06/21/11, 10:52 AM
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Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 9,129
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How to tell which is the alpha mare
Count the hoofprints! It is the one that does NOT have hoofprints on the rump!
I put the 'lawnmower' back out in the pasture before this last series of rains started as it was dry enough her lawnmower duties were on hold. She and Lady have been eyeing each other and trading insults for several days. The discussion about alpha status erupted this morning in the corral when everyone came in to grain, with lots of squealing (and am I glad I don't speak equine!) and a few rump-to-rump thumps. When I got to the corral, Lady was on one side of the corral and Dolly on the other side of the corral, both very pointedly *NOT* looking at each other.
However, counting the hoofprints, I believe Lady is the clear winner. Lady - 0. Dolly - 3.
In this case, she who has no hoofprints on the butt is the alpha mare!
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06/21/11, 11:17 AM
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NW Arkansas
Posts: 191
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LoL
yeah its usually not hard to pick out the alpha.
And its not always the largest one either.
I’ve got a huge FT an she lets the smaller mustang
be the boss and the even smaller one is 2ed in line.
D
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Dying is no solution, nor living either.
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Can make a heaven of hell, a hell of heaven.
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06/21/11, 11:40 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ocala, FL
Posts: 3,540
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I'm about to try this with Tony, Sammie and Neo on Saturday....Saturday will mark his 2-week time on the farm. When I put them together before (way too early, my bad), Tony and Neo were tied 3 to 3.... Hoof-shaped missing hair spots on both....
Now, Sammie has at least acknowledged that Neo exists, lol, and Tony and Neo have been smack talking each other for over a week over the fence.
I''m wondering if I should try them one at a time? Let Sammie and Neo have their smack-down alone together, and then let Tony and Neo go 12 rounds without Sammie interfering or cheering for her favorite... hmmmmm..... never had this much trouble introducing horses before....
SFM, your girl has one nicely padded backside....I'll bet she took her lumps very well, lol!
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...'o shame on the mothers of mortals, who have not stopped to teach; of the sorrow that lies in dear, dumb eyes; the sorrow that has no speech... from -'Voice of the Voicless', Ella Wheeler Wilcox
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06/21/11, 11:53 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jill.costello
I'm about to try this with Tony, Sammie and Neo on Saturday....Saturday will mark his 2-week time on the farm. When I put them together before (way too early, my bad), Tony and Neo were tied 3 to 3.... Hoof-shaped missing hair spots on both....
Now, Sammie has at least acknowledged that Neo exists, lol, and Tony and Neo have been smack talking each other for over a week over the fence.
I''m wondering if I should try them one at a time? Let Sammie and Neo have their smack-down alone together, and then let Tony and Neo go 12 rounds without Sammie interfering or cheering for her favorite... hmmmmm..... never had this much trouble introducing horses before....
SFM, your girl has one nicely padded backside....I'll bet she took her lumps very well, lol!
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I would think just turning them all out together to get any issues resolved right off the bat will save time and injury in the long run. I think the one on one matchups would only draw out the amount of time it will take to settle it. We have had alpha horses before that would assert their dominance every single time we took a horse out and put it back. You think they'd settle it and be done, but no, everytime they'd have to duke it out.
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06/21/11, 12:00 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ocala, FL
Posts: 3,540
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolffeathers
I would think just turning them all out together to get any issues resolved right off the bat will save time and injury in the long run. I think the one on one matchups would only draw out the amount of time it will take to settle it. We have had alpha horses before that would assert their dominance every single time we took a horse out and put it back. You think they'd settle it and be done, but no, everytime they'd have to duke it out.
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I'm worried because both Tony and Neo were gelded late (Tony age 3 and Neo age 2-3). They might believe they have to duke it out to the death for the right to hang out with the only mare, Sammie R.......I do not have the money right now to deal with TWO sets of mortal injuries! 
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...'o shame on the mothers of mortals, who have not stopped to teach; of the sorrow that lies in dear, dumb eyes; the sorrow that has no speech... from -'Voice of the Voicless', Ella Wheeler Wilcox
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06/21/11, 12:04 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jill.costello
I'm worried because both Tony and Neo were gelded late (Tony age 3 and Neo age 2-3). They might believe they have to duke it out to the death for the right to hang out with the only mare, Sammie R.......I do not have the money right now to deal with TWO sets of mortal injuries! |
Whoops. Thought Sammie was a gelding for some reason. Yeah, it may be best to let the boys sort it out without a cheerleader/antagonist. 
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06/21/11, 12:19 PM
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Join Date: May 2002
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I don't like to be the voice of doom here, but with both late-term geldings and one mare, this may not be something that works, ever. This is why big ranches out west do NOT have mares in the remuda ... there are always turf wars among the geldings about who gets which mare to pal around with. All geldings in the herd and very few problems ... put a mare in with them and let the games begin.
Sometimes it works. I hope yours get it sorted out and it does work. But do be aware that it may not. In my experience, what usually happens is that one gelding ends up alpha, gets the mare and the other gelding is not allowed to 'pal around' with the mare/gelding pair.
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06/21/11, 01:33 PM
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Animal Addict
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I saw your horse in a movie called "Hooves of Fury." It was all about this little mare that got picked on til she learned karate, then she went back and took vengeanceon everyone who ever wronged her. Her foes got a Black-and-Blue belt from the karate master.
Ummm...isn't lady that dog sized pony you got a while back?? I bet Dolly is sooo embarrassed to have had her butt kicked by a little punk, lol.
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Becky
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06/21/11, 01:45 PM
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Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 9,129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beccachow
Ummm...isn't lady that dog sized pony you got a while back?? I bet Dolly is sooo embarrassed to have had her butt kicked by a little punk, lol.
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No, Lady is the 15 hand lovely, ladylike Andalusian/Arab aristocrat that simply walked into the herd and took over by reason of her bloodline and arrogance apparently. No big battles with anyone, just "okay, I'm here ... I've obviously better bred than any of you peasants, so I'm boss."
Dolly is the rough and tumble little drafty type with a chip on her shoulder ... I'm tougher than anybody in the crowd so just don't push me!
Oops!
I've had one of the really little tough ones though, some years ago. Put her out with one of the mare herds, with one gelding ... I had geldings at the time so there was one gelding with each group of mares. I had to move the mare ... she had the gelding so intimidated he wouldn't eat and was losing weight (winter/ hay) ... and she couldn't even kick any higher than his hocks but she'd bite him in the belly!
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06/21/11, 01:51 PM
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Animal Addict
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Ahhh, right, the one you were supposed to give me. I'm still waiting, by the way.
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Becky
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06/21/11, 01:56 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ocala, FL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFM in KY
I don't like to be the voice of doom here, but with both late-term geldings and one mare, this may not be something that works, ever. This is why big ranches out west do NOT have mares in the remuda ... there are always turf wars among the geldings about who gets which mare to pal around with. All geldings in the herd and very few problems ... put a mare in with them and let the games begin.
Sometimes it works. I hope yours get it sorted out and it does work. But do be aware that it may not. In my experience, what usually happens is that one gelding ends up alpha, gets the mare and the other gelding is not allowed to 'pal around' with the mare/gelding pair.
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In my heart, I know this is very likely <sigh> but Tony was just SO bored and frustrated with Sammie who wouldn't play with him; no face-game, no romping, no mutual grooming. All the things he USED to have with his "brother", Spyder. They were partners since 18 months old, and since Spyder lives in Texas, now, Tony just seemed to really need a companion his own speed..... I SO wish it would work out....
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...'o shame on the mothers of mortals, who have not stopped to teach; of the sorrow that lies in dear, dumb eyes; the sorrow that has no speech... from -'Voice of the Voicless', Ella Wheeler Wilcox
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06/21/11, 01:59 PM
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My nieghbors have a mare over there, with two geldings. One of them just took over as head man, and they do all manage to graze and switch off playmates. No stallions in the big filed, though.
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Becky
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06/21/11, 02:05 PM
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Sometimes it does work ... will keep fingers crossed for you!
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06/21/11, 02:28 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
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Granted the dominant gelding usually gets the girl, I have seen multiple geldings and a just a mare or two peacefully coexist.
Back when we had a "herd" of horses. We had 5 geldings and 3 mares to the pasture. The dominant gelding spent more time with the younger geldings playing games(taking their halters off and chasing them with feed buckets). The used-to-be alpha mare and the wanna-be-alpha gelding used to go at it pretty good, then the alpha mare(a stout pony) would come flying in, give them both a butt-kickin and settle it. They had their spats and bickering, but nothing overall concerning. (The geldings took great joy and rubbing eachothers mane's bald along the withers. And one young gelding went around and decided to eat everyone's tail-something I can only attribute to his malnourishment from being a rescue).
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06/21/11, 02:51 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ocala, FL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolffeathers
Granted the dominant gelding usually gets the girl, I have seen multiple geldings and a just a mare or two peacefully coexist.
Back when we had a "herd" of horses. We had 5 geldings and 3 mares to the pasture. The dominant gelding spent more time with the younger geldings playing games(taking their halters off and chasing them with feed buckets). The used-to-be alpha mare and the wanna-be-alpha gelding used to go at it pretty good, then the alpha mare(a stout pony) would come flying in, give them both a butt-kickin and settle it. They had their spats and bickering, but nothing overall concerning. (The geldings took great joy and rubbing eachothers mane's bald along the withers. And one young gelding went around and decided to eat everyone's tail-something I can only attribute to his malnourishment from being a rescue).
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This is more what I'm used to; there will always be "squabbles" in a mixed herd. I know that my problem here is not enough horses to take the pressure of any single one. There will be a dominant, a second in-command, and the lowest. That's it. There's nowhere in my herd dynamic for anybody to take a place in "just one of the gang", so all my three are more concerned with how this intro will go....there's no way for either boy to "gracefully take a one-lesser spot" unless Sammie (the mare) decides to let him....and at her age (28), I pray she does, for both her safety and for a tolerable herd dynamic.....
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...'o shame on the mothers of mortals, who have not stopped to teach; of the sorrow that lies in dear, dumb eyes; the sorrow that has no speech... from -'Voice of the Voicless', Ella Wheeler Wilcox
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06/21/11, 03:33 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Nevada
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[QUOTE=SFM in KY;5212007]No, Lady is the 15 hand lovely, ladylike Andalusian/Arab aristocrat that simply walked into the herd and took over by reason of her bloodline and arrogance apparently. No big battles with anyone, just "okay, I'm here ... I've obviously better bred than any of you peasants, so I'm boss."
QUOTE]
Hey Sharon - does she tiptoe around their manure?
When Potter left last year, Eeyore was still alive and definately in charge. Now we have the almost 16 hands gelding and the barely 15 hands (and I'm being nice) stallion. They are still sizing up the situation, Potter is the oldest now, so it will be interesting to see how things go. So far they are mostly just crowding each other when we are at the fence - each trying to get the most attention!
I hope you can get thngs to work out with Neo - he such a good looking boy!
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06/21/11, 03:58 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ocala, FL
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I have been implementing some horse-psychology for the last three days...judging by the hollering coming from Neo's paddock...it seems to be working....
I have 3 small pastures (paddock sized) all in a row. I can open them up or leave them closed. The "nightime" paddock is the center one, where Tony and Sammie live most of the time and always at night. Neo is in the paddock on the far left, adjoining the paddock with Sammie and Tony so they can "talk" over the fence.
Weeeeellll, for the last 3 days in a row, I have been letting Tony and Sammie out to the far right paddock, where they can get out of sight of Neo..... and Neo has begun calling for them! (of course, they ignore him as of yet...) BUT, my hope is that he will see the benefit of being their friend as he misses them more and more during the day...(they still go back to the center at night).... We'll see.....
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...'o shame on the mothers of mortals, who have not stopped to teach; of the sorrow that lies in dear, dumb eyes; the sorrow that has no speech... from -'Voice of the Voicless', Ella Wheeler Wilcox
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06/21/11, 04:37 PM
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Just living Life
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Now in Virginia
Posts: 8,277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jill.costello
In my heart, I know this is very likely <sigh> but Tony was just SO bored and frustrated with Sammie who wouldn't play with him; no face-game, no romping, no mutual grooming. All the things he USED to have with his "brother", Spyder. They were partners since 18 months old, and since Spyder lives in Texas, now, Tony just seemed to really need a companion his own speed..... I SO wish it would work out....
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You could try putting Vicks up the noses of both Tony and Neo, before you try it again. That way they will smell the same and they "might" not be such backsides this time around.
Icelandic's tend to smell different than other breeds of horse's and that could be part of Tony's problem.
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Shari
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06/21/11, 04:41 PM
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Just living Life
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Now in Virginia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFM in KY
No, Lady is the 15 hand lovely, ladylike Andalusian/Arab aristocrat that simply walked into the herd and took over by reason of her bloodline and arrogance apparently. No big battles with anyone, just "okay, I'm here ... I've obviously better bred than any of you peasants, so I'm boss."
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OMG that is soo funny!
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Shari
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06/21/11, 04:58 PM
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aka RamblinRoseRanc :)
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Morristown, TN
Posts: 5,066
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bergere
You could try putting Vicks up the noses of both Tony and Neo, before you try it again. That way they will smell the same and they "might" not be such backsides this time around.
Icelandic's tend to smell different than other breeds of horse's and that could be part of Tony's problem.
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Seriously? I did not know that! I do know that my gypsy smells different (to me, anyway) than any other horse or breed we've ever had. You know that regular ol' wish someone could bottle it horse scent? His is.. different. His hooves are different too. They're smooth and more like alabaster than horse hooves. 
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