How long to nurse, when to separate

[mary,tx]

I have a couple of cows nursing pretty good sized calves and expecting again in two and three months.

So I'm wondering how long do you usually let the calves nurse, and how long do you like to have them separated before the cow calves again?

Obviously she's not going to wean them on her own.

I did separate one today, but still need to separate the other, which will be harder to do.

I just checked the calendar and the calves are about eight months old.

[G. Seddon]

It's perfectly fine to wean them now; that would give the cows about 2+ months to prepare for the new calves. The calves are not physically dependent on the milk at this point, but the psychological dependence is a different story. They'll do better if weaned with a companion (each other or an older dry cow who can babysit and offer them the security of being with an adult). Make sure your fences are secure. It'll take about 3-4 days for everyone to get over the hollering, including the mothers. Check the Farmers Almanac for the "best days" to wean. Don't plan on putting them back with their mothers for a long time.

[topside1]

Most cattleman here in Tennessee wean @ 6-8 months old....Good to hear from you Mary hope all is well....Topside

[mary,tx]

Thanks

Well, the separation didn't last long. Both cows went right back over the fence before evening chores.

Other than that, everything's going fine. I guess the fence needs more work.

[Awnry Abe]

It isn't easy. I keep mine deep in the inner workings of the working pens for 24 hours.

[idigbeets]

We wean our beef cattle at 6 months, they holler for a few days but get along just fine w/out the dam around. Sounds like you need a better fence, or fence charger to keep em contained, or maybe just mow ?

[mary,tx]

It's a stock fence originally put up for goats, and just not tall enough, I guess, at four feet, to keep the biggest cow in. DH had intended to put a couple of strands of wire above it, but evidently it didn't register with me that still needed to be done before I moved them.

They are contained on the exterior field with double string hotwire.

[wannabfishin]

you could always just put a weaning ring on them, that might be easier than fixing the fence

[Homesteader333]

Sorry, but what does DH mean? Im new to HT. Thanks!

[mary,tx]

Sorry, DH just stands for Dear Husband.

Wannab, my other issue is that I don't have a catch facility, hence no way to put in nose rings, either.

My biggest problem is really the big cow that went over the fence that I need to be getting to locker soon, because she prolapsed last time. Once I get rid of her, I think I can keep the smaller cows in the field.

[wannabfishin]

i would suggest atleast going to buy a couple corral panels. you can buy the economy ones fairly cheap at a place like tractor supply. even if you dont need them this minute, with cattle there is definitely going to be a time when you need to catch one of them for treatment.

[hiddensprings]

we wean ours at 6 months. And, we are preparing for the noise coming next weekend. We put the calves in the corral area where they can't get out and put the momma's in a back pasture as far away as we can get them from the calves. I did screw up a bit last night when I was separating some heifers and 1 cow out to give them shots in preparation of AI-ing on friday. got the wrong calve in with the wrong momma cow. didn't realize it until I went out last night to figure out why everyone was yelling....Oops, my bad. Sorry momma.

[southernmom]

We never really wean ours, they just roam and eventually eat more grass than milk. When the mamas have new calves the other calves just stop nursing.
Although, sometimes you do have an older calf that will try and 'steal' milk. Doesn't do any harm, really, the mama cow tends to kick them off.

[G. Seddon]

Originally Posted by southernmom

We never really wean ours, they just roam and eventually eat more grass than milk. When the mamas have new calves the other calves just stop nursing.
Although, sometimes you do have an older calf that will try and 'steal' milk. Doesn't do any harm, really, the mama cow tends to kick them off.

I see two potential problems with this:

One is that cows normally require about two months' "rest" before calving so that they can build up a good supply of colostrum for their new calves; if last year's calves are constantly nursing, this colostrum will not be available to the new calves. Colostrum is critical to a newborn calf's well-being and good start.

Two is, unless you are castrating or banding all of your bull calves, you are running the risk of having them breed their heifer siblings and/or their mothers.

[southernmom]

Originally Posted by G. Seddon

I see two potential problems with this:

One is that cows normally require about two months' "rest" before calving so that they can build up a good supply of colostrum for their new calves; if last year's calves are constantly nursing, this colostrum will not be available to the new calves. Colostrum is critical to a newborn calf's well-being and good start.

Two is, unless you are castrating or banding all of your bull calves, you are running the risk of having them breed their heifer siblings and/or their mothers.

As a raging advocate of breastfeeding I totally get the importance of colostrum I will add that there isn't a 'set' amt of colostrum that can be 'stolen' from a cow as a change from colostrum to actual milk occurs when the placenta separates from the uterus after birth, so a pg cow can't run out of colostrum, per se. IF this is incorrect in some way in regards to cows please point me in a direction so I can read otherwise.
I'm not denying the need to rest, etc. Perhaps it is the difference of operations we are talking about because no one out here separates unless they are little bulls-in which case they are sold young or cut. I should have mentioned about the bulls. But out here where it's mainly beef cattle, we just let them run together and it works out fine, but everyone has a different operation. I'm just speaking from my personal experience ranching in FL.

[wannabfishin]

i dont believe everything i read but ive heard and read this one and similar ones enough that i believe it

"Cows begin to produce colostrum five weeks prepartum and ends at calving. The antibodies are transferred from the bloodstream. Typically, mature beef cows in good condition will produce an antibody mass in approximately ½ gallon of colostrum. It is important to ensure during the week prior to calving that the cow is not “leaking” milk or being nursed by other calves, otherwise colostrum will be deficient when the cow calves."

http://www1.agric.gov.ab.ca/$department/deptdocs.nsf/all/faq8021

[southernmom]

Originally Posted by wannabfishin

i dont believe everything i read but ive heard and read this one and similar ones enough that i believe it

"Cows begin to produce colostrum five weeks prepartum and ends at calving. The antibodies are transferred from the bloodstream. Typically, mature beef cows in good condition will produce an antibody mass in approximately ½ gallon of colostrum. It is important to ensure during the week prior to calving that the cow is not “leaking” milk or being nursed by other calves, otherwise colostrum will be deficient when the cow calves."

http://www1.agric.gov.ab.ca/$department/deptdocs.nsf/all/faq8021

Thanks for posting that-I will definitely read up on it.

I will add that my family has been ranching in florida since the late 1800's and we have never separated a calf from a pg mama. I suppose all those years it was mamas kicking calves off when the persisted in nursing, or some sort of divine intervention because we haven't lost calves from lack of colostrum.
I will add this and maybe it's what makes the difference-usually our cows don't breed soon after birth. They breed 4-6 months later and my the time the duration of pg is up the calves are too big to be interested in nursing a lot anyway. We don't push our cows to breed quickly.

[montysky]

I/we shot for 7 months give or take a couple weeks of age and never put them back with the mother cows, at that point the weaned calves will stay with the clean/mop up bull until he is needed and the calves will stay together until We sell them and harvest one for our use.

Black Angus and Black Baldies.

[mary,tx]

That brings up another issue. I've been concerned that the bull is still in the field with the cows and calves. Do you worry about your heifers getting bred that young in with the bull?

[montysky]

Thanks Mary don't know what I was thinking wean steers not Heifers I should have caught that.

I would not put a bull anywhere near a young heifer nothing good would come out of it. Once I have calves on the ground the bull is removed from the herd.