Grass Fed Beef Musings....

[Wilbur]

As some background I am no beef farmer. I live in MA and have never raised cattle. I had some range management and cattle courses in college so like a lot of things in my life I know enough to be dangerous! Ha! Oh and I also used to live in Greeley CO so I know what a feedlot looks like (yes…and smells like!). I am also highly skeptical of the hype we see in society where everyone gets behind a movement and pushes its benefits with a sneer while looking down their noses at those uneducated fools who they choose to deign with their superior knowledge. *rolling eyes* My post will likely offend some and I apologize for that. It is not my intent. I am interested in the subject but I really prefer it be backed up with facts as opposed to what someone heard or (god forbid) read on the internet!

So I am a beef lover. I can’t help it….I just love steaks, roasts, burgers, you name it…if its beef, it’s my favorite. And I always have. Now my wife won’t eat beef…just doesn’t like the flavor. So for the first 10 years of our marriage we had mostly chicken….I mean all the *bleepin’* time. So much so that I HATE chicken now, I mean really hate it. Well….unless it’s been fried but that’s another story altogether. Ha! Sorry….I’ll get to my point….
My wife is very nutrition conscious. She’s been that way all her life. She reads a ton on nutrition and is generally very sharp about things related to food and nutrition. Recently she’s been talking to another woman who is a natural foods fanatic (in my mind this woman is more fanatical about it than is normal or healthy but it makes her happy so be it). So my wife was saying we should be buying only grass fed beef for a variety of reasons (what she means is I should be eating grass fed beef as she doesn’t eat beef!). So I asked her what she meant and why. She said cows don’t eat corn in nature so we shouldn’t be eating corn raised beef and instead should eat grass fed beef (I am big on the fact that because my eyes face forward and not to the side, have canine teeth etc. thus I am a predator and will never be a vegetarian so we approach a lot of things with a “what is natural” attitude). I asked her if she realized that most cattle are raised primarily on grass and corn (and other grains) are only fed the last few months or so at the feedlot. She didn’t know this and had envisioned cows being fed only corn. I explained that this would be way too expensive and we could never afford beef raised this way (I cant afford Kobe/Wagyu beef). She then mentioned Omega-3 and how grass fed beef is more nutritious than beef that has been finished in a feedlot. Some of the “grass fed” stuff I have seen seems to border on fanatical so I wondered if some of this was more of the hype about grass fed so did some research on grass fed versus “regular” beef. So I’m finally getting to my point….sorry if I lost you along the way.

Here’s what I have found….and like I suspected there IS a lot of hype around grass fed versus grain fattened beef. And if you prefer grass fed to grain finished beef more power to you. I am NOT pointing any fingers at you. But please refrain from pointing them at me for preferring highly marbled steaks to lean unmarbled ones. Deal? I don’t like bear meat that often for the same reason, it’s too lean to eat as a steak by itself.
So I started poking around to see what I could find. Most articles on grass fed beef are like this writer:

http://www.foodrevolution.org/blog/the-truth-about-grassfed-beef/

full of all the reasons why grass fed beef is so superior to grain finished beef- this author goes so far as to say grain finishing may be “the dumbest ideas in the history of western civilization”. Wow….it must really be bad! (He gets off on a tangent at the end it seems and starts chasing his own tail with the idea that grass fed beef leads to more global warming but I am not going to go after the global warming craziness in this). He cites all the benefits of grass fed explaining that cattle do not convert grain to beef very well as it takes “anywhere from 7 to 16 pounds of grain to make a pound of feedlot beef”. Maybe I should point out that it often takes about 20-25 lbs of grass to make a pound of beef but I figure he’s lost already.

He also cites the improved Omega 3 etc. I have seen a lot mentioned about improved Omega 3 levels in grass fed beef so I was kind of curious about it. But we find a bit of a dichotomy on the issue. Yes grass fed beef appears to have more Omega 3 in it but it’s not as dramatic a difference as one might think, nor is Omega 3 the only benefit of beef:

From this study by the National Institutes of Health:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2846864/

here is a table comparing amounts of Omega 3 for grass fed versus grain fed beef:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2846864/table/T2/

And while the difference is there, it’s not enough for me to have a cow over (to use a phrase! Ha!)

In the “mg/100 g muscle tissue” section, grass fed beef has 97.6 mg while grain fed beef has 63.3 mg. Not being a metric genius I had to look up what 100 grams is but its .22 lbs, so like a hamburger. So that’s something, an extra 34 milligrams in grass fed beef. So how much additional Omega 3 do I need? Well…according to Web MD the AHA recommends 1 gram (which is 1000 mg) per day for people with heart disease. And 2-4 grams per day are used to lower triglycerides (so 2000-4000 mg). So proponents of grass fed beef are saying that an extra 30 mg a day is helpful? Sure every little bit helps I get that. But is it enough to warrant dramatically increasing my cost to buy beef that is less lean and typically has less flavor for something that gives only a modest increase in benefit? Let’s assume I really want to have more Omega-3, maybe I can find the extra 30 mgs elsewhere and save some money buying (tastier) grain fed beef.

I googled “Omega 3 supplements” and just grabbed the first one I found:

http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/p/nordic-naturals-omega-3-1000-mg-120-softgels/ye-1012?sourceType=sc&source=FG&adGroup=40-60&keyword=YE-1012&cm_mmc=Google+Shopping-_-Product+Listing+Ads-_-40-60-_-
YE-1012&gclid=CODHoZ3as70CFUuXOgodSRYAng&gclsrc=aw.ds #.UzSeea1OW-M

How much Omega 3 is in a caplet? 690 mgs. Yes….690. So one caplet has 23 times the difference in Omega 3 that I would get from eating a grass fed hamburger versus grain finished one?
But wait….another article I saw mentioned that Kobe/Wagyu beef has a lot of Omega-3 as well. More than “regular” beef (assuming they mean grain finished). A researcher at Texas A&M studied this and found that Kobe/Wagyu beef had a more balanced mix of Omega-3 and Omega-6 which help reduce LDL’s (bad cholesterol) and triglycerides.

http://animalscience.tamu.edu/files/2012/06/13-December.pdf

This was backed up by a study from Washington State University and echoed by Tim Crowe from Deakin University in Australia:

Tim Crowe, Ph.D., senior lecturer of nutrition at the School of Exercise and Nutrition Sciences at Deakin University in Australia, explains the Monounsaturated Fatty Acid to Saturated Fatty Acid ratio runs up to three times higher in Wagyu beef than other beef. Crowe says half of all marbling in a Wagyu carcass is comprised of monounsaturated fats.

http://lonemountaincattle.com/pdf/articles/Beef_Plus_Added_Health_Benefits.pdf

So Wagyu beef with its very high marbling content is better than grass fed beef. Is regular marbled beef also better in this regard? I am not positive, but it appears the benefits of “grass fed” may not be as dramatic as those making the claim given the actual difference in milligrams of one versus the other.

And there is another factor within beef that is good for us…..and that is the total Mono-Unsaturated Fats (MUFA in literature) found. We see lots of discussions of trans-fats today and MUFA are better for us as they help reduce the amount of bad cholesterol and triglycerides (how much marketing do we see today about “No Trans-Fats”?).

The same NIH study reflects that grain fed beef has 1729 mgs of MUFA’s while grass fed only has 930 mg. So which is better? The higher Omega-3’s in grass fed or the higher MUFA’s in grain fed?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2846864/table/T2/

The same Dr. Smith at TAMU performed a study on individuals feeding them both regular domestic beef an Wagyu strain beef that were raised on a grass fed diet and then switching the participants to grain fed beef (also domestic and Wagyu strains). Using both domestic strains and Wagyu strains would ensure the change is not due to genetic differences of Wagyu beef which some (primarily it seems from those that raise/sell Wagyu beef) claim. So ten men who all had slightly higher than healthy cholesterol levels were given grass fed hamburgers for five weeks and then (after a three week transition period) switched to grain fed burgers for five weeks. What they found was a little unnerving- after the grass fed beef the men had a REDUCTION in HDL’s (Good cholesterol) of 8.3% and an increase in triglycerides of 66.2%. Then after eating the grain fed beef the levels returned to normal.

http://lonemountaincattle.com/pdf/articles/Beef_Plus_Added_Health_Benefits.pdf

Is that definitive? No. Not on ten people. Maybe other factors entered into the increase in triglycerides and the reduction in HDL’s. But it certainly bears investigation.

So where does all this leave us or me? I guess my conclusion is that:

a) There is a lot more to the grass fed versus grain fed than the proponents of either would have us believe,
b) There are benefits to both and we don’t know all the information yet (remember eggs being demonized for having cholesterol years ago?) and it may take a long time to know more,
c) I would prefer to know where my beef comes from and how it’s being raised rather than worrying about whether its grass fed or grain fed.

So sorry to take so long to get through this. And I welcome any opposing ideas or thoughts. I am not trying to preach, nor do I feel I have all the answers. So I am willing to listen. But I do prefer well thought out arguments and ones that can be backed up. If your experience is that you feel better or you prefer grass fed beef then I suggest you only eat that. I am not trying to convert the pro-grassfed to the “dark side”. I am interested in eating more healthily. But I also enjoy the food that tastes good. Oh, and as with anything on the web YMMV. J

[Wanda]

In my opinion I like a good grain fed beef the best. That is what I was raised with so that is what is my preference. I have had good grass fed but it would not be my first pick. The one thing that bothers me about the debate is when the first thing out of a persons mouth is HOW BAD THE OTHER IS. If you can not convince me how good something is on its own merits, please don't waste my time with horror story's. There is a place for both but much of what is offered as fact does not pass close scrutiny. By the way ask your wife if her chicken eats the same food that it would in a natural setting.

[Donna from Mo]

We are retired, and on a limited income. We buy a Jersey bull calf every year that we don't have one born on the place and butcher it at a year old, grass-fed. But there's NOTHING better than a good beef-breed animal that's been grain fed, especially if you want perfect steaks. We usually have our grass-fed animals put into ground beef and share with relatives. Ground beef is what we use the most anyway.

[Wilbur]

Wanda I think you raise a very good point....some prefer to attack others instead of saying simply "this is what I do".

Donna that makes a lot of sense.

Thanks for commenting ladies.

[Gravytrain]

First of all, it's grass finished vs. grain finished...not grass fed vs. grain finished. As the OP correctly pointed out, virtually all beef is grass fed. Grass finished will marble up just fine, just not as quickly as grain finished.

Grass finished will be a deep, richer color, and in my opinion a deeper richer flavor. I've had grass finished beef that wasn't ready and it was good, but tasted a bit like venison. IMO grass finished beef that is allowed to marble is fantastic. The problem is, in my experience it takes 24-30 month for it to be well marbled. This often means in my climate that the animal will have to be fed through another winter...which will elevate the costs dramatically.

Full disclosure: I raise grass finished beef. I have a waiting list for my product. I don't have a moral opposition to grain finished beef like some people do however. I like good beef period. I don't turn my nose up to a nice hunk of ribeye in a restaurant because I can't verify how it was finished. I like a properly grass finished steak better though.

[Peggy]

I just bought and ate steak from a grass feed beef. I have to say it was MUCH better tasting than corn finish beef!!!!!! when I finish up all the corn feed beef in my freezer I WILL be buying grass feed beef!!!!!

[jwal10]

We don't grow corn here for grain. I have never bought corn to finish my beef but it was finished on grain. Good chemical free oats, barley and wheat and all the grass hay they would eat along with the grass....James

[JulieLou42]

We totally enjoyed having four of our own grass fed and finished bull calves on the table over the past 10 years. They were tasty and tender. Most were processed between 10 and 16 months age.

These strange ones were never even interested in their mother's grain ration...so I just left it at that...tho' offered to them from time to time. They were Guernsey X Jerseys, Guernsey X Saler, and Guernsey X Guernsey. My processor noticed how clean they were and pretty well marbled. They were shot and dressed out right here at home, but taken to his abatoir for butchering up. Even their mother, at age 11 when we had to put her down, was very good eating, all 700lbs of her...tho' she'd had some grain in her last year or so. [She could no longer conceive.]

The report from WSU made it to our evening news here out of Spokane when it came out. I don't recall mention of what sort of cattle were used.

[Awnry Abe]

Can't say it any better than Gravytrain. A couple of extra comments:

1) I've been tinkering with the flavor profile as it correlates to processing time and grass life-cycle. I wish I were dealing with rabbits, because I could come to a conclusion so much faster. I've all but decided that I am going to give beef away for a short spell to ramp up the sample size so I can see what varying just processing season does for me.

2) be aware of the human side of the scientific method. You really can't trust peer review to happen anymore. If you want to cite a study, you need to assume the role of the peer. Doesn't matter to me, I don't know what's healthy. I just know what tastes good.

[sammyd]

We have done both and will do grain finished with our next beefer.
We may even do a totally corn fed steer from start to finish.
I did not care for the grass fed and finished animal at all.

[1shotwade]

Originally Posted by Wilbur

As some background I am no beef farmer. I live in MA and have never raised cattle. I had some range management and cattle courses in college so like a lot of things in my life I know enough to be dangerous! Ha! Oh and I also used to live in Greeley CO so I know what a feedlot looks like (yes…and smells like!). I am also highly skeptical of the hype we see in society where everyone gets behind a movement and pushes its benefits with a sneer while looking down their noses at those uneducated fools who they choose to deign with their superior knowledge. *rolling eyes* My post will likely offend some and I apologize for that. It is not my intent. I am interested in the subject but I really prefer it be backed up with facts as opposed to what someone heard or (god forbid) read on the internet!

So I am a beef lover. I can’t help it….I just love steaks, roasts, burgers, you name it…if its beef, it’s my favorite. And I always have. Now my wife won’t eat beef…just doesn’t like the flavor. So for the first 10 years of our marriage we had mostly chicken….I mean all the *bleepin’* time. So much so that I HATE chicken now, I mean really hate it. Well….unless it’s been fried but that’s another story altogether. Ha! Sorry….I’ll get to my point….
My wife is very nutrition conscious. She’s been that way all her life. She reads a ton on nutrition and is generally very sharp about things related to food and nutrition. Recently she’s been talking to another woman who is a natural foods fanatic (in my mind this woman is more fanatical about it than is normal or healthy but it makes her happy so be it). So my wife was saying we should be buying only grass fed beef for a variety of reasons (what she means is I should be eating grass fed beef as she doesn’t eat beef!). So I asked her what she meant and why. She said cows don’t eat corn in nature so we shouldn’t be eating corn raised beef and instead should eat grass fed beef (I am big on the fact that because my eyes face forward and not to the side, have canine teeth etc. thus I am a predator and will never be a vegetarian so we approach a lot of things with a “what is natural” attitude). I asked her if she realized that most cattle are raised primarily on grass and corn (and other grains) are only fed the last few months or so at the feedlot. She didn’t know this and had envisioned cows being fed only corn. I explained that this would be way too expensive and we could never afford beef raised this way (I cant afford Kobe/Wagyu beef). She then mentioned Omega-3 and how grass fed beef is more nutritious than beef that has been finished in a feedlot. Some of the “grass fed” stuff I have seen seems to border on fanatical so I wondered if some of this was more of the hype about grass fed so did some research on grass fed versus “regular” beef. So I’m finally getting to my point….sorry if I lost you along the way.

Here’s what I have found….and like I suspected there IS a lot of hype around grass fed versus grain fattened beef. And if you prefer grass fed to grain finished beef more power to you. I am NOT pointing any fingers at you. But please refrain from pointing them at me for preferring highly marbled steaks to lean unmarbled ones. Deal? I don’t like bear meat that often for the same reason, it’s too lean to eat as a steak by itself.
So I started poking around to see what I could find. Most articles on grass fed beef are like this writer:

http://www.foodrevolution.org/blog/the-truth-about-grassfed-beef/

full of all the reasons why grass fed beef is so superior to grain finished beef- this author goes so far as to say grain finishing may be “the dumbest ideas in the history of western civilization”. Wow….it must really be bad! (He gets off on a tangent at the end it seems and starts chasing his own tail with the idea that grass fed beef leads to more global warming but I am not going to go after the global warming craziness in this). He cites all the benefits of grass fed explaining that cattle do not convert grain to beef very well as it takes “anywhere from 7 to 16 pounds of grain to make a pound of feedlot beef”. Maybe I should point out that it often takes about 20-25 lbs of grass to make a pound of beef but I figure he’s lost already.

He also cites the improved Omega 3 etc. I have seen a lot mentioned about improved Omega 3 levels in grass fed beef so I was kind of curious about it. But we find a bit of a dichotomy on the issue. Yes grass fed beef appears to have more Omega 3 in it but it’s not as dramatic a difference as one might think, nor is Omega 3 the only benefit of beef:

From this study by the National Institutes of Health:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2846864/

here is a table comparing amounts of Omega 3 for grass fed versus grain fed beef:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2846864/table/T2/

And while the difference is there, it’s not enough for me to have a cow over (to use a phrase! Ha!)

In the “mg/100 g muscle tissue” section, grass fed beef has 97.6 mg while grain fed beef has 63.3 mg. Not being a metric genius I had to look up what 100 grams is but its .22 lbs, so like a hamburger. So that’s something, an extra 34 milligrams in grass fed beef. So how much additional Omega 3 do I need? Well…according to Web MD the AHA recommends 1 gram (which is 1000 mg) per day for people with heart disease. And 2-4 grams per day are used to lower triglycerides (so 2000-4000 mg). So proponents of grass fed beef are saying that an extra 30 mg a day is helpful? Sure every little bit helps I get that. But is it enough to warrant dramatically increasing my cost to buy beef that is less lean and typically has less flavor for something that gives only a modest increase in benefit? Let’s assume I really want to have more Omega-3, maybe I can find the extra 30 mgs elsewhere and save some money buying (tastier) grain fed beef.

I googled “Omega 3 supplements” and just grabbed the first one I found:

http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/p/nordic-naturals-omega-3-1000-mg-120-softgels/ye-1012?sourceType=sc&source=FG&adGroup=40-60&keyword=YE-1012&cm_mmc=Google+Shopping-_-Product+Listing+Ads-_-40-60-_-
YE-1012&gclid=CODHoZ3as70CFUuXOgodSRYAng&gclsrc=aw.ds #.UzSeea1OW-M

How much Omega 3 is in a caplet? 690 mgs. Yes….690. So one caplet has 23 times the difference in Omega 3 that I would get from eating a grass fed hamburger versus grain finished one?
But wait….another article I saw mentioned that Kobe/Wagyu beef has a lot of Omega-3 as well. More than “regular” beef (assuming they mean grain finished). A researcher at Texas A&M studied this and found that Kobe/Wagyu beef had a more balanced mix of Omega-3 and Omega-6 which help reduce LDL’s (bad cholesterol) and triglycerides.

http://animalscience.tamu.edu/files/2012/06/13-December.pdf

This was backed up by a study from Washington State University and echoed by Tim Crowe from Deakin University in Australia:

Tim Crowe, Ph.D., senior lecturer of nutrition at the School of Exercise and Nutrition Sciences at Deakin University in Australia, explains the Monounsaturated Fatty Acid to Saturated Fatty Acid ratio runs up to three times higher in Wagyu beef than other beef. Crowe says half of all marbling in a Wagyu carcass is comprised of monounsaturated fats.

http://lonemountaincattle.com/pdf/articles/Beef_Plus_Added_Health_Benefits.pdf

So Wagyu beef with its very high marbling content is better than grass fed beef. Is regular marbled beef also better in this regard? I am not positive, but it appears the benefits of “grass fed” may not be as dramatic as those making the claim given the actual difference in milligrams of one versus the other.

And there is another factor within beef that is good for us…..and that is the total Mono-Unsaturated Fats (MUFA in literature) found. We see lots of discussions of trans-fats today and MUFA are better for us as they help reduce the amount of bad cholesterol and triglycerides (how much marketing do we see today about “No Trans-Fats”?).

The same NIH study reflects that grain fed beef has 1729 mgs of MUFA’s while grass fed only has 930 mg. So which is better? The higher Omega-3’s in grass fed or the higher MUFA’s in grain fed?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2846864/table/T2/

The same Dr. Smith at TAMU performed a study on individuals feeding them both regular domestic beef an Wagyu strain beef that were raised on a grass fed diet and then switching the participants to grain fed beef (also domestic and Wagyu strains). Using both domestic strains and Wagyu strains would ensure the change is not due to genetic differences of Wagyu beef which some (primarily it seems from those that raise/sell Wagyu beef) claim. So ten men who all had slightly higher than healthy cholesterol levels were given grass fed hamburgers for five weeks and then (after a three week transition period) switched to grain fed burgers for five weeks. What they found was a little unnerving- after the grass fed beef the men had a REDUCTION in HDL’s (Good cholesterol) of 8.3% and an increase in triglycerides of 66.2%. Then after eating the grain fed beef the levels returned to normal.

http://lonemountaincattle.com/pdf/articles/Beef_Plus_Added_Health_Benefits.pdf

Is that definitive? No. Not on ten people. Maybe other factors entered into the increase in triglycerides and the reduction in HDL’s. But it certainly bears investigation.

So where does all this leave us or me? I guess my conclusion is that:

a) There is a lot more to the grass fed versus grain fed than the proponents of either would have us believe,
b) There are benefits to both and we don’t know all the information yet (remember eggs being demonized for having cholesterol years ago?) and it may take a long time to know more,
c) I would prefer to know where my beef comes from and how it’s being raised rather than worrying about whether its grass fed or grain fed.

So sorry to take so long to get through this. And I welcome any opposing ideas or thoughts. I am not trying to preach, nor do I feel I have all the answers. So I am willing to listen. But I do prefer well thought out arguments and ones that can be backed up. If your experience is that you feel better or you prefer grass fed beef then I suggest you only eat that. I am not trying to convert the pro-grassfed to the “dark side”. I am interested in eating more healthily. But I also enjoy the food that tastes good. Oh, and as with anything on the web YMMV. J

I'm sure your post is a good one but honestly I wouldn't bother reading one that long.Lordy! I'd have to take 2 smoke breaks and rest my eyes some just to get through it! And if I did get through it I would have forgotten what I had read at the top of the page by then!I'm not anyone special at all and really don't want to sound critical but I also know I'm not the only person on here that feels this way.If you can somehow feed us a more condensed version of whatever you are wanting to talk about I think you'll get a lot more replies!Just my thoughts! Don't take offense.

Wade

[barnbilder]

I think you are missing two of the driving forces behind the grass fed movement. Number one, people are concerned about chemical residues possibly present in the grain, and the effects of GMO influence. Secondly, grass fed is more in line with the philosophy of sustainable agriculture. If you let cows roam around on a hillside, make a little hay off on your own place, don't ship in grain, ship calves across country to be grain finished, and process and market locally, you would stand to produce the same product using less resources.
I personally think the taste is superior, but that is totally subjective. I do know that with the Angus beef hype and marketing, a lot of people are giving grass fed beef a bad name by trying to capitalize on two marketing schemes. It has been my experience that Angus do not finish well on grass alone, tending to be either lean and flavorless or, if kept a little longer, marbled well enough to taste good, yet tough. Shorthorn beef is trying to be the equivalent to Angus beef in the US, and the shorthorn breed are very efficient producers of well finished beef from grass alone. To the extent that American producers don't want them because, when put in a feedlot with standard commercial breeds, they finish too early, which leads them to be too fat before the rest of the group catch up. Meaning they cost less to feed to achieve the desired result. As a result of their perceived "non-performance", beef shorthorns are primarily a show breed in the US.
There are a lot of people drawing some good conclusions, but as long as commercial interests and high profile breed organizations are involved in the discussion, your not likely to see any real data.

[Gabriel]

You can find plenty of studies at eatwild.com.

Grass finished will marble, but most people use poor genetics, poor grass and no management. That's hardly the way to get a great product.

IMO, grass finished is either the best, or the worst. I will also say that when I'm out and eating commercially produced meat, I eat beef, then chicken... and won't touch pork.

Not morally opposed to grain and don't care who eats what.

[1shotwade]

Originally Posted by Gabriel

You can find plenty of studies at eatwild.com.

Grass finished will marble, but most people use poor genetics, poor grass and no management. That's hardly the way to get a great product.

IMO, grass finished is either the best, or the worst. I will also say that when I'm out and eating commercially produced meat, I eat beef, then chicken... and won't touch pork.

Not morally opposed to grain and don't care who eats what.

We had to go to town yesterday and it was late before we could get started home. We decided to get something to eat and saw a "steak n Shake" . Haven't eaten there in years. The first bite out of my burger was"THAT'S BEEF!" you could actually taste BEEF! It's been a long time since I grabbed something that actually can be identified by it's flavor!
Now I'm wondering what all those other hamburgers I've eaten over the years really were! None of them tasted like beef!


Wade

[barnbilder]

Originally Posted by Gabriel

You can find plenty of studies at eatwild.com.

Grass finished will marble, but most people use poor genetics, poor grass and no management. That's hardly the way to get a great product.

IMO, grass finished is either the best, or the worst. I will also say that when I'm out and eating commercially produced meat, I eat beef, then chicken... and won't touch pork.

Not morally opposed to grain and don't care who eats what.

Well, when I said you couldn't find real data, I should have said, you couldn't find much data that the commercial marketing establishment would put their "green stamp of credibility" on which would make it "peer reviewed". Oh, there is plenty of data.

As you mention, genetics plays a huge factor. Why for thousands of years were cattle bred toward an ideal for beef production centered around grass pasture, and that ideal suddenly doesn't work? The ideal I'm talking here is the stocky, deep, easy finishing type animal. This is not isolated to cattle. Pigs, sheep, and cattle seem to be going toward an ideal that looks more like a loin supported on saw-horse legs, high enough to keep it up out of it's own waste, with a grain spout at one end. These animals have been bred to the point that they won't survive without grain. Part of the problem comes when someone tries to make a modern production bred animal perform in a more primitive model. Thus the grassfed beef we hear of that was flavorless or tough. This also happens with people, usually retailers, jumping on the marketing bandwagon. Somehow grass fed sounds better than, six year old feral bull caught in another country.

[1shotwade]

SOW-have you seen the recent markets? Feeders closed out the week at just under $1.80 and hogs at $1.25 while expecting a short fall on corn and adding 5-7 million acres in beans. With the drought spiking back up by summer you won't be able to buy the south end of a north bound billy goat!

Wade

[solsikkefarms]

It doesn't have to be one or the other. Depends on what you plan to do with it. I myself prefer grass fed, finished with corn. Each piece of meat is different though as is each animal and each cut. Sometimes I like a lean meat, sometimes I like a heavily marbles one that melts in your mouth. What can I say, I just love meat.

[Wanda]

The other thing that I see is people that are buying or selling ''grass fed'' beef and there is not a common Idea what it should be. My idea of beef is a bovine that is ready to harvest for food. A bovine that has lived on marginal forage and hay for 12-48 months does not necessarily fit the description for me. The only thing that some have going for them is they never had a chance to consume any grain.

[barnbilder]

Excellent point Wanda. Many of the new folks that I see getting into farming are setting lofty parameters for their product, when the fact is, the piece of farmland they bought is marginal, that's why the old farmer sold it to begin with. Then it gets overstocked, and because they feel they have to stay away from the evil grain, and evil fertilizer, the livestock suffer. Whether you feed grain the whole time, creep feeding right to the feedlot, pasture raise and grain finish, or do it all with grass, there is nothing tougher and nastier than a piece of meat off of an animal that was starving to death when it was slaughtered. There are few places on earth, where cattle could truly be grass finished, meaning finished to feedlot specifications. And in those places it still takes the right genetics and some know-how to be able to pull it off. If you don't know the farmer, the grass fed sticker is just there to hold the cellophane together. Or in some cases it means, "caution, this piece of meat tastes funny and will break your silverware."

[Alaska]

WE like grass fed. Slaughtered our first steer last year. at 24mos. Actually was better than I expected. Our second went to the butcher at 14 mos two weeks ago. We added a bagged alfalfa (chaffhaye) to the finishing process for the last two mos. I will have pictures and let everybody know in another ten days or so when he comes home for dinner.
Mainly I dont want my beef to come from a feedlot pumped full of antibiotics,hormones and GMO grain. And if it is a bit leaner and taste a little more like game, Im all game as I have always liked wild game.