Free-martins

StockDogLovr · #1 12/11/13, 08:46 PM

I've heard of free-martins in the Holsteins, but can they happen in any breed? I got two Jersey heifers at the auction to train my dog on for herding, and they were very cheap - me not being in the know about cows much I'm wondering if that's what I ended up with. I don't recall the auctioneer making any special comments about them. They were 400 lb. heifers.

nosqrls · #2 12/11/13, 09:10 PM

It is possible in any Breed. Free Martins are generally a twin of a bull and are sterile.

barnbilder · #3 12/11/13, 09:12 PM

It would be a one in a million shot to get two freemartins at a sale barn. The Free-martin needs to have a twin bull calf. They can happen in any breed. There is now a relatively inexpensive blood test to determine freemartinism.

rhaige9 · #4 12/11/13, 09:14 PM

They can happen in any breed. It's when there was twins born and one was a bull calf and the other a heifer calf. I think it has something to do with a blood transfer in utero and a hormonal thing.

sammyd · #5 12/11/13, 10:35 PM

LOL million to one. Bought 2 at one sale, auctioneer even said single birth calves. Got them weaned and out on pasture looking good
Shipped them on dairy sale day and they both sleeved free martin at the vet check.
Sold them as feeders the next day for 1/4 what I had hoped to get out of them.

PNP Katahdins · #6 12/12/13, 01:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammyd

auctioneer even said single birth calves.

Sellers lie a lot and this is a good example.

To the OP: why are you wondering if your dog-training girls are freemartins? Twins are not all that common in cattle. Your girls will do fine for training and taste good too.

Peg

barnbilder · #7 12/12/13, 10:28 AM

Sometimes a single birth calf can be a freemartin, the other calf is absorbed by the mother or the twin. Those calves grow out to be the "heifer that just won't breed". Probably a lot more of them around than you would think, as sammyd found out. Unless you are willing to milk or graft extra calves on, those two Jerseys might be better off not breeding anyway.

Bret · #8 12/12/13, 10:31 AM

All interesting.

Tango · #9 12/12/13, 05:24 PM

when i was first looking for a jersey back in the day, i went to sale barn and bought a "heifer" that never developed an udder and had a very young bull-like look as a two year old. i later found a couple of jersey cows and tried to sell this one and am glad it didn't sell. i didn't know at the time about freemartins but as it grew and didn't devlop an udder i started to learn about them.... if you see any dairy heifer calf that is cheap, think about freemarten. they really aren't all that rare.

Jennifer L. · #10 12/17/13, 06:47 PM

Holsteins average 5% twins. My own herd ran 10% twins. You don't ship, normally, heifers to auction, so if you see a small newborn heifer calf going through the auction barn you can be 90% sure she's a free martin, or at least co-twin with a bull and the farmer doesn't want to take the chance (rarely they are OK and will breed).

BUT, they are excellent eating if you raise them for beef. Absolute best beef I've ever had came from a free martin I raised.

sammyd · #11 12/17/13, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tango

when i was first looking for a jersey back in the day, i went to sale barn and bought a "heifer" that never developed an udder and had a very young bull-like look as a two year old. i later found a couple of jersey cows and tried to sell this one and am glad it didn't sell. i didn't know at the time about freemartins but as it grew and didn't devlop an udder i started to learn about them.... if you see any dairy heifer calf that is cheap, think about freemarten. they really aren't all that rare.

If you never bred the animal chances are pretty slim you would see an udder anyway. Free martin or not.

StockDogLovr · #12 12/18/13, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PNP Katahdins

Sellers lie a lot and this is a good example.

To the OP: why are you wondering if your dog-training girls are freemartins? Twins are not all that common in cattle. Your girls will do fine for training and taste good too.

Peg

Eventually I planned to sell these off and bring in fresh ones for training. Well, being naive and new to cows, I got to thinking it might be nice to keep one and breed her for milking. I thought perhaps these had traits the dairy owner didn't otherwise like so was moving them out but that they would be good enough for my needs. Certainly fine for herding. I just thought also that they might be sold because the owners don't want to feed them up to breeding size, that maybe they'd be more valuable once they are of breeding age/size. These are my uneducated thoughts, of course! I'm told by some that no money will be made on these even as they gain size, that I'll be lucky to make back my initial investment. I only paid 0.57/lb, about 400 lb at that time. Not sure how old that would equate to, either.

CAjerseychick · #13 12/18/13, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StockDogLovr

Eventually I planned to sell these off and bring in fresh ones for training. Well, being naive and new to cows, I got to thinking it might be nice to keep one and breed her for milking. I thought perhaps these had traits the dairy owner didn't otherwise like so was moving them out but that they would be good enough for my needs. Certainly fine for herding. I just thought also that they might be sold because the owners don't want to feed them up to breeding size, that maybe they'd be more valuable once they are of breeding age/size. These are my uneducated thoughts, of course! I'm told by some that no money will be made on these even as they gain size, that I'll be lucky to make back my initial investment. I only paid 0.57/lb, about 400 lb at that time. Not sure how old that would equate to, either.

Well wont they still gain some weight? So you should get your money back and more just selling them for meat...? (thats my uneducated guess)...Interesting thread....

sammyd · #14 12/19/13, 04:10 AM

If you sell them at the sales barn they will be worth much less than steers even if you feed them up to finished weight. You could sell them privately as halves or whatever and charge what the market will bear.

Tango · #15 12/19/13, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammyd

If you never bred the animal chances are pretty slim you would see an udder anyway. Free martin or not.

Thanks for catching that. Maybe udder was the wrong word. Heifers develop small teats, the jersey fm never developed anything.