Placing milker by myself

SueMc · #1 02/10/13, 11:43 AM

I haven't figured out the trick to placing the milker on the cow's teats by myself and am asking for advice please. I've watched numerous videos and see that most people are able to do it themselves but see others do it with a helper. So far DH is helping.
I hold the claw with inflations down and the valve pulled out so that vacuum can build. I then flip it over to attach to the cow. We both put the inflations on the teats then one of us pushes the valve in and milking starts.
If I push the valve in quickly and try to attach the milker by myself I have no vacuum almost immediately so am unsuccessful.
I want to be able to do this myself even though I have good help. There must be something I'm not doing right.
This cow is a jewel and stands perfectly still while being hand or machine milked. She will stand even out of the stanchion so it's not her.
Thanks!

BlackWillowFarm · #2 02/10/13, 12:01 PM

This is how I do it, hopefully you'll find something here that will help you.

With the pressure built up in the milk bucket and the pulsator pulsing normally, I have the pressure button on the bottom of the claw pulled out so air flow to the inflations is blocked off. The inflations are hanging down under the udder ready to put on. There shouldn't be any sound of air flowing through the inflations at this point. Next I take one shell/inflation and pull it up as if I'm going to attach it which will open it to the air flow. The other three are still hanging down off the claw. Immediately, with the shell positioned to go onto the teat, I push straight down on the shell to stop air flow by crimping the air hose attached to the base of the claw. Then, almost as fast, I allow the shell/inflation to rise straight up onto the teat and the vacuum pressure should pull it up and snug. Repeat all way round and you should be milking away. To release the inflations after milking I pull the pressure button on the bottom of the claw to stop vacuum and tug the whole thing gently off the cow.

commonsense · #3 02/10/13, 06:02 PM

Did you watch this video?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=0qx9GezxSeM

This one helped me tremendously when I switched from a Surge to a Nupulse.

matt_man · #4 02/10/13, 11:11 PM

I have the same problem. I have to keep the pressure valve off while I try to hook her up and hopefully I get them all on at once so I can push it in. Even with the cups dangling, if the pressure valve is not out, the pressure drops to almost nothing and it's not enough to keep the cups on if I try to hook her up that way. I can manage it by myself but it's still frustrating.

Just wanted to let you know that I feel your pain...

francismilker · #5 02/10/13, 11:27 PM

Do any of you having these probs have any type of balancing or "holding" tank to provide a bulk source of vacuum during your process? One can easily be made out of about any large drum, capped pipe, 12" pvc capped on both ends, etc.

You simply put an inlet and outlet nipple on your reservoir of choice and plumb it in-line between your vacuum pump and bucket. It's easy and cheap if you have a little ingenuity about you. Even a 4' piece of large pvc pipe (6-12") provides a large volume of vacuum reserve giving you a little more time.

You just have to wait a little longer for vacuum to build up and start your pulsator to working before you begin.

BTW, do any of you have claws with automatic shut-offs? They are designed to shut off vacuum flow when an inflation is hanging in the down position and keeps you from losing vacuum when an inflation falls off one teat.

I feel all of your pains. I worked on a dairy that had ample vacuum supply and when I had my first experiences with a bucket milker (8 years ago) I almost gave up on it because of the type of difficulties you're experiencing.

Forgot to mention above, if you do install a vessell or tank to hold vacuum it's a good idea to put a regulator on it to keep vacuum from collapsing it. I've actually seen a 55 gallon drum collapse with very little vacuum put on it.

Callieslamb · #6 02/11/13, 06:36 AM

You might be holding your claw too far from the cow's teats. Hold it close so when you lift the inflation, it's just a few cm from the end of the teat. Like Blackwillowfarm said- the vacuum should pull it right on for you. Then you can lift them one at a time. Keep the inflation pinched so the air can't release. It's a quick motion.

To take them off, I pushed my thumb against the udder to release vacuum and pulled the inflations off one at time. You can also pinch the inflation until the suction is gone and then pull it down. There are all kinds of creative ways to bend and twist the inflations around themselves to keep the suction going while that last, slow-milking quarter finishes up.

**Ross** · #7 02/11/13, 06:57 AM

You just need that reserve of vacuum, when I was milking our cow here I had a surge vac pump and tank and 50 feet of 2 inch pipe. The claw could suck air the entire time I was attaching the claw no problem.

sammyd · #8 02/11/13, 07:16 AM

If you are using a claw you need to learn to flip the inflation up but cock the milk tube part against the milk inlet of the claw. Done correctly you can have the inflation almost vertical yet the vacuum will be cut off.
Get the inflation right under the teat and when you move it upwards the teat should go in about the time the vacuum starts.

And a larger reserve may be needed, or possibly your vacuum pump is undersized.

matt_man · #9 02/11/13, 07:52 AM

I have a tank and line with pressure regulator with a shut off valve where the hose goes from the line to the bucket. The claw does not have automatic shut offs.

I used a different bucket for about a month before I bought this one. I had to hold the claw at just the right angle for it to hang right and build pressure then I would attach cups - didn't have this problem. I do with my new bucket. The old one I was using was borrowed. It is a used Delaval bucket but brand new claw/inlfations/pulsator and hoses. It works great once you get it on.

SueMc · #10 02/11/13, 09:34 AM

It never ceases to amaze me at the help/information that comes from this "community".
Carla, I wasn't sure if I was visualizing exactly what you were explaining until I watched the video that Commonsense posted.
I was successful the first time! I just need a little practice holding all the tubing clamped correctly so it doesn't feel clumsy. Otherwise it was easy.
We don't have a reserve vacuum tank but it does sound like a good idea.
Thanks everyone! I knew I should be able to do this by myself, but sure wasn't figuring it out alone.

Judy in IN · #11 02/11/13, 11:52 AM

What Ross said.

I'll be building a vacuum line from my pump over to the stanchions. I just bought some petcocks off Ebay for the line itself. Your rubber hose fits right over the petcock. So, you have the reserve of your vacuum tank, the regulator, and the airline to work with.

springvalley · #12 02/11/13, 02:39 PM

Man If I had to hold my milker claw like the one in the video to put it on, I would have a fit. I guess my old milkers are so easy it isn`t funny, I just take the claw, hold it with my left hand upside down under the udder, then I turn on the valve on the bucket, And crimp and apply the inflation to the teat. Just as easy as that, no fuss, no muss. There are so many differant types of claws, some are easier to use than others are. Just look for one that will work better for you. > Thanks Marc

CJBegins · #13 02/11/13, 07:46 PM

I want to have this problem! One of these days.........

sammyd · #14 02/12/13, 03:57 PM

All claws have "automatic shutoffs" built into the milk inlets.

If you look at this pictures
http://sefsufficient.com/drill/milker/P1100087.JPG
http://sefsufficient.com/drill/milke...comparison.JPG
You can see how the large inlets on the top of the claw are flattened and at an angle instead of looking like a pipe that was cut off.
This is where the shut off takes place. The weight of the inflation and shell should hold the milk tube part of the inflation against the flat part of the milk inlet and shut off the vacuum.
Sometimes newer inflations will leak by since they are generally a bit stiff.

Quote:

So, you have the reserve of your vacuum tank, the regulator, and the airline to work with.

There is really very little reserve in a vacuum line.

SueMc · #15 02/12/13, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammyd

Sometimes newer inflations will leak by since they are generally a bit stiff.

I think that is the issue with mine. They're new enough that they don't hang straight down yet. Clamping them down by hand is working very well for me and I imagine they'll loosen up.

francismilker · #16 02/13/13, 09:21 AM

You can also use the ol' dairyman's trick for milking 3 teated cows. It's a trick that once you get the hang of comes natural. With the claw in your hand, inflations pointing up at the sky, take one of the inflations and twist it 1/4 turn and roll it down towards the center of the claw. If you have it tucked and rolled just right it will fit snugly in the center of the claw and be bound up so it won't roll out and suck air. I've had to do it on a two teated cow before so it can be done. This could also buy you a little more time.

There's also milk inflation plugs you can buy from dairy supply stores if you wanted to unplug and put on one inflation at a time. To me it would be too big of a pain but it could help you to not lose all your source before you get all the inflations put on.