corrientes versus dexter

loli · #1 12/08/12, 08:18 AM

I have really been doing some studying on both of these, we want mainly to raise for our freezer, but we still want to be able to sell off some calves for a little money. How hard is it to sell dexters? I know we can sell the corriente calves off to the local ropers. given the drought and my 30 acres of my pastures being wooded, I just figured one of these 2 breed would fit with my goats. Anyone have any insight as to what I would be better doing?

pancho · #2 12/08/12, 09:35 AM

If you can sell the dexters to other people wanting dexters you will do good with them. If you plan on selling through a sale barn you will do bad.
Same really goes for the corrientes.
The main difference would be in the initial investment.
Corrientes are cheap, whether buying through an auction or from individuals. They are also cheap when you sell them.
Dexters are cheap when buying through an auction but high priced when buying from an individual. Same thing when you sell them.

loli · #3 12/08/12, 07:15 PM

Thanks, the corrientes that I have seen run through the sale barn bring about the same as the dexters around me but, they do seem to pay about 150 more for the black ones? I can sell those calves off to ropers, which I think would be easier than selling the dexters. I just wanted a smaller breed of cattle to run on this place. The big old angus/simmetal crosses we had were just way to big

MO_cows · #4 12/09/12, 11:51 AM

The black ones can be finished to where some of them will qualify as CAB. So usually anything with a black hide will sell higher. The Corrientes, you could lease them out for roping and then beef them after their career is over, so you have an extra income opportunity over the Dexters. People can also use them for training cutting horses, competitive penning, all kinds of arena sports. If you can get plugged into that market, you would have some extra opportunities.

loli · #5 12/10/12, 07:44 PM

Thanks, I just wanted something smaller, the corrientes will forage but I have heard they can be a bit wild

haypoint · #6 12/10/12, 08:41 PM

Funny that this post would come up.
Just last week, I was talking to a Vet friend. i mentioned all the dual-use Dexters that were being discussed on HT. She related a story of a guy that bought a small herd of Dexters from someone on the internet. They were the wildest things he'd ever seen. Being small made them just that much faster and harder to catch. He took them to Auction and lost a lot of cash.

Then, I mentioned the horns discussion. She believes that gentle or not, when pushed every animal with horns will instinctively use them to hurt you or another animal. A close friend of hers bought a corrientes calf. She spent a lot of time with her and she was gentle. So when it came time to de-horn, she opted to let her be "natural". Eventually, she learned to use her horns, the owner became afraid and the Vet was called several times to stich up her horse after the little Corriente gored her way to the feed.

I think I'll stick to de-horned Jeresy and polled hereford.

MO_cows · #7 12/10/12, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loli

Thanks, I just wanted something smaller, the corrientes will forage but I have heard they can be a bit wild

They are smart little things, they haven't been bred to be "improved" like so many breeds. They will go hustle for their own feed instead of stand at the gate and bawl. Sometimes the better feed they want is on the other side of the fence - it better be a good fence. I worked at their national show many times. They are not haltered but show loose in the arena, except for the mature bulls. They are housed in pens while at the show. So you get a Corriente out of their pen and drive them thru a maze of pens and alleys to get to the arena. Some of them would know the way back to their pen after one class. Same with the roping setup. Show them their escape gate out of the arena and the return alley, most of them would learn it the first time thru. So you have a bovine that is smarter than most and somewhat independent by nature, well they aren't for everybody.

KSALguy · #8 12/10/12, 11:28 PM

get you a few corriente heifers and put a good low birth weight Angus bull over them, they will russle their own food like no other, produce great calfs that can be beefed up nice and sense a good PURE angus bull is Homogenous for Polled genes all the calfs will be born polled, if you want to lease them to some ropers from time to time and then send them off to the feed yard great, or just let them fatten up on momma and pasture and sell them for beef plus fill your freezer, low input decent out put,

bluefish · #9 12/11/12, 08:19 AM

I'm not the least bit experienced with cattle, but a couple years ago, we bought a correinte cow, bred, with a calf at side. The first night here, they took off and 15 miles to the west of us. She was in a smaller paddock, fairly well fenced, but................

Anyway, we got her back and put her in a small pen built like Fort Knox. Before we put her in there, we pulled her calf out of the trailer and cut him. She nearly came out of the back of the trailer, it was a 2 horse with the back doors not going all the way to the top. The calf got loose during transfer to Fort Knox, but we got her in and she stayed there. A few hours later, we caught her calf. Left them there for a couple months then let her out in the original small paddock. She did grand, came when called for food. The following spring we let her out in a bigger pasture only fenced with electric. She stayed and did great!

After that initial 'issue', she was no trouble. She would always come when called because she know it meant food, she wasn't the least bit tame, but very intelligent. Unfortunately, we had to butcher this fall. Had no way to get her bred. We still have her last calf and I think he's even smarter than his mother, but fortunately for us, this is home and he stays here. He bellers at me every morning for a couple hours for breakfast. If I don't get out there soon enough he wanders off foraging. I don't think he'd bother with the bellering, but our pasture is DRY and pretty much toast right now. Even with the drought and the bad pasture, his mother has quite a layer of fat on her. They didn't start getting hay til a while after we butchered her so she did quite well off of bad pasture.

Based on my vast experience,

, I'd say if you can keep them confined for a while til your place is 'home' they'll stick around and do ok. My penny's worth.

Gabriel · #10 12/11/12, 05:00 PM

I got some Dexters and Red Angus earlier this year. The RA's were fairly tame when I got them, but the Dexters were, to put it mildly, excitable. Three months later and what do we have? I can't tell a difference between the two groups. Some in both groups are nervous, most are tame. Calm, regular handling makes a world of difference. I do worry some about the horns though, will be using a polled bull on all of them.

Quote:

The Corrientes, you could lease them out for roping and then beef them after their career is over

Only if you're doing all burger.

MO_cows · #11 12/11/12, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabriel

Only if you're doing all burger.

If they are finished correctly, they make good beef. Had Corriente prime rib at one function and it was very tasty.

Gabriel · #12 12/12/12, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MO_cows

If they are finished correctly, they make good beef. Had Corriente prime rib at one function and it was very tasty.

I'll bet the animal you ate wasn't used as a roping steer and butchered at the end of it's career. I wasn't disputing that they can be good eating, simply that you must manage their growth properly and that means not letting them be chased around.

linn · #13 12/12/12, 10:32 AM

For me there is not contest, Dexters every time. They take a little longer to finish out, but make good beef. They are also a good dual purpose cow.

MO_cows · #14 12/12/12, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabriel

I'll bet the animal you ate wasn't used as a roping steer and butchered at the end of it's career. I wasn't disputing that they can be good eating, simply that you must manage their growth properly and that means not letting them be chased around.

It was a retired roping steer that had been out of the arena and on feed for 90 days IIRC. If you took one straight out of the roping pen to slaughter, yes, you better plan on getting burger or jerky. But just because they have made roping runs at some point in their life doesn't mean the beef is forever ruined, you just have to prepare them to be beef.

ramiller5675 · #15 12/12/12, 11:28 AM

It seems to me that it would be easier all around to just find something like some Hereford, Angus (red or black), or black baldy heifer calves instead of getting either Dexters or corrientees.

If you start with some heifer calves that are still growing, they should "adapt" to the forage that is available and will turn out to be moderately sized cows.

The resulting calves or beef would be easier to sell and you wouldn't have to have to worry about finding someone to lease them to for roping practice or trying to direct market all the beef.

And, it would be easier to find a suitable bull or sell a cull cow at the stockyard.

You might not be able to run as many on your pasture, but I would rather have a smaller herd with less headaches.

InvalidID · #16 12/12/12, 11:42 AM

It's been my experience that any animal that's run hard and done growing is tough as leather. The trick it seems, from chickens to cattle, is to butcher them during growth. This can be done when young and growing, or you can feed them heavy before slaughter. As long as they are growing the meat will be much better.

Just my .02.

Dreamfarm · #17 12/12/12, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ramiller5675

It seems to me that it would be easier all a
If you start with some heifer calves that are still growing, they should "adapt" to the forage that is available and will turn out to be moderately sized cows.

.

I think genetics have more to do with it than feed...otherwise I know for sure I would be much taller rather than wider.

Gabriel · #18 12/12/12, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MO_cows

It was a retired roping steer that had been out of the arena and on feed for 90 days IIRC.

Color me surprised.

Quote:

If you took one straight out of the roping pen to slaughter, yes, you better plan on getting burger or jerky. But just because they have made roping runs at some point in their life doesn't mean the beef is forever ruined, you just have to prepare them to be beef.

While it's true that you can make a good meal out of old/tough beef (I had some great brisket from a 14 year old cow recently), all the research I've read says that they need to gain a consistent 1.7 Lbs per day from birth to finish in order to guarantee good steaks. My own limited experience agrees.

Quote:

If you start with some heifer calves that are still growing, they should "adapt" to the forage that is available and will turn out to be moderately sized cows.

Are you suggesting that a large frame animal will finish as a moderate framed one if the feed is limited?

ramiller5675 · #19 12/12/12, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gabriel

Are you suggesting that a large frame animal will finish as a moderate framed one if the feed is limited?

That's exactly what I'm saying. Regardless of it's genetics, a calf's growth is limited by it's feed, and once it reaches a certain age it essentially stops growing.

A calf with superior genetics can only express that superiority if it has enough extra feed available.

As an example, I raise my own replacements, and try to get them to calve at about 24 months old. Sometimes I have a heifer that will lose her first calf and I'll give her one more chance to have a calf. Those heifers always seem to have a growth spurt because they aren't nursing a calf like the others are and can convert the "extra" feed to growth.

When she reaches maturity, the heifer nursing the calf will end up being a smaller cow than the heifer that got to take a year off because she lost her calf. They both have the exact same genetics, but are different sizes based on what they had to eat and how they were able to utilize that feed.

On the other extreme, I've got a cow that somehow managed to get bred too early and she calved when she was about 18 months old. Carrying that calf when she was still growing stunted her growth and now I've got a runt of a cow that will probably always raise tiny calves if I keep her around (she's small, but I wouldn't call her efficient)

The same idea would apply to a weaned heifer calf, I could manage her feed to make her smaller or larger (within her genetic potential).

That's why I think that part of the whole "small cows are more efficient" idea is a bunch of bull. Some small cows are more efficient, but some small cows are just runts that were shorted at some time in their growing phase.

Gabriel · #20 12/12/12, 02:59 PM

I don't have the exact numbers because I don't have a scale, but I can tell just by eyeballing the calves that the Dexters wean a higher % of their own weight than do the larger cattle. But if you can't market them to individuals that won't pay off.

It seems penny wise, pound foolish to restrict the feed so much the growing members of the herd can't express their genetic potential. Unless you run two herds you're also stunting all the steers/bulls which are going to be sold, as well as negatively influencing the timely breeding back of the cows. Also, it's not just the bull that determines the birth weight of the calf and the stunted cow will pass on her genetic potential to her calves, leading to possible birthing problems.