Kiwi Cross?

InvalidID · #1 03/08/12, 10:18 AM

Can anyone tell me about the Kiwi Cross or direct me to some good information on them? I know they are dairy cattle, but I've come across a good cheap source of bottle bull calves and I'm wondering if they are worth the effort.

As a reference on worth the effort, we've done ok with Holstein bull calves so something like them or better is perfect. Grass fed operation here BTW, so efficient grass eaters got extra love.

myersfarm · #2 03/08/12, 01:28 PM

Kiwi Cross ...which kind Kiwi-Cross’ Holstein-Friesian cow or the Kiwi-Cross’ Jersey X Friesian or is this the cows and crossing with a bull breed from USA

InvalidID · #3 03/08/12, 06:14 PM

It's a Kiwi Cross that was then crossed with a Holstein. I've never heard of a Kiwi Cross before today. What I read they are suppose to be a Friesian Jersey cross?

myersfarm · #4 03/08/12, 06:22 PM

I have friends in New Zeland they are both kinds....were I got the idea of the milk bars 10 years ago

the Friesian looks the color of a holstien but they really have a bigger gut and I do mean big they looked bloated compared to a holstien...and different dairy's breed them to Jerseys or holstiens

InvalidID · #5 03/08/12, 06:25 PM

So basically it'll be a fat Holstein Jersey cross.

myersfarm · #6 03/08/12, 06:25 PM

they are good grazers and the holstien ones will be the better match here in USA...the jersey cross ones bred to a jersey bull will really be to small for the usa market to bring much

myersfarm · #7 03/08/12, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InvalidID

So basically it'll be a fat Holstein Jersey cross.

NO never did I say fat ...I said bigger gut...you will still see bones ..on the outside just like a holstien only bloated...they are bred to convert grass and there rumen is big so they can eat more grass and make more milk

good part they will almost always be black

myersfarm · #8 03/08/12, 06:32 PM

Several people I use to know raise the Friesian / Hereford calves from the dairiers over there...they work good as replacement heifers for the beef guys they put a Angus bull on them and get a black baldie calf

InvalidID · #9 03/08/12, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by myersfarm

NO never did I say fat ...I said bigger gut...you will still see bones ..on the outside just like a holstien only bloated...they are bred to convert grass and there rumen is big so they can eat more grass and make more milk

good part they will almost always be black

I knew what you meant by bigger gut, I shouldn't have said fat though. My bad. The dam was a Kiwi and the sire a Holstein. They come form a local organic dairy and everything on this place is over sized. I'm just guessing, but I think they are breading the Kiwi back for more size maybe? I dunno.

I do know that his cows are all giant sized, like big barrels on legs. They make the neighbors beef herd look tiny, though I know a lot of that is bone. The calves I raised last year turned out good for Holsteins so I'm not too concerned. Not sure if I like the Jersey blood though.

Ronney · #10 03/09/12, 04:31 AM

Invalid, as the name implies the so-called Kiwi Cross is exactly that - a first cross Friesian/Jersey. They've been around for a very long time and in my first commercial sharemilking job 40 years ago, almost half the herd was made up of Friesian/Jersey crosses with the balance being straight Jersey or straight Friesian. They tend to take on the attributes of both breeds - good milk production of the Friesian, higher butterfat of the Jersey, lighter boned so less hard on the paddocks and many of the Jersey personality traits. I have one in my little herd now - she's jet black other than for a tad of white on her udder, bigger than a Jersey, smaller than a Friesian and produces a nice calf to an Angus bull.

If these first cross cows have gone back to a Friesian bull, the calves are probably worth a look at. You will still have that bit of Jersey in them but personally, I don't find that a problem.

Myers, the Friesian and the Holstein are the one and same breed, originating in what we now call the Netherlands but was once North Holland and Friesland, hence the name of the cattle. They have a history that goes back nearly 2,000 years. Over many years, different countries have done their own "breeding up" and NZ mostly bred the British Friesian which was a much smaller cow than the American Holstien. Then we got greedy and started to import American genetics to build up a huge cow that produced huge amounts of milk. The large gut that you refer to is the result of having to breed up a cow that is grass-fed, producing large quantities of milk and needing the amount of stomach to eat the amount of grass needed to produce that amount of milk. That's it in a nutshell. In some areas there is a move away from American genetics because of problems associated with feed intake, pasture damage due to size, failure to get back into calf.

Friesian/Herefords are not often used as replacement cows for beef breeding operations other than with lifestyle block owners (read that as homesteaders) because of the problems associated with them, mainly with the udder and milk production. Both the Friesian and the Hereford are good milk producers for their respective breeds, put them together and they are massive. Add to that, most inherit the Hereford udder - low slung back quarters and huge teats - and you have trouble. Newborn calves that can't suckle from an engorged teat and udder, too much milk leading to mastitis and most true beef farmers stay clear of them other than to fatten for the works.

In the last couple of years I've had two neighbours get out of this Friesian/Hereford game because of the problems associated with calving and also with cancer eye. Interestingly enough, both used my Angus bull and neither got a white-faced calf out of their calves. They were all solid black.

Cheers,
Ronnie

Valmai · #11 03/09/12, 05:45 AM

My answer to your question is, what does your market want? Will your buyers take an animal based on weight or must it look like a beef cross? Here in NZ any calf that has (or looks like it has) jersey in it is very hard to sell, unless it is a recorded heifer.

myersfarm · #12 03/09/12, 07:06 AM

deleted

myersfarm · #13 03/09/12, 07:29 AM

ronney basicly what I said here they are breeding ... the frisian to jersey bulls ....Holstien bulls from usa and back to the frisian bulls...

Quote:

Originally Posted by myersfarm

they are good grazers and the holstien ones will be the better match here in USA...the jersey cross ones bred to a jersey bull will really be to small for the usa market to bring much

InvalidID · #14 03/09/12, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valmai

My answer to your question is, what does your market want? Will your buyers take an animal based on weight or must it look like a beef cross? Here in NZ any calf that has (or looks like it has) jersey in it is very hard to sell, unless it is a recorded heifer.

I'm fairly lucky in that I live near Portland Or. This means any steer that won't fetch a fair price at an auction can easily be sold as halves or on the hoof to the public. Lots of people wanting grass fed here.

My real concern was would he get fat enough to even try. The Jersey in him had me concerned knowing they are a runty boney lot. Ronney and Meyers put me a little at ease so I think I'll give this guy (and maybe a few more if they are cheap enough) a test run.

myersfarm · #15 03/09/12, 11:20 AM

Would like a update on these when you sell if you could

InvalidID · #16 03/09/12, 11:21 AM

No problem. I intend to track them pretty closely to see how they do.