Milking machine guidance

[Brooks WV]

I'm looking at three options right now:

1) http://www.portablemilkers.com/catal...62/7731069.htm
2) http://www.portablemilkers.com/catal...25/7795072.htm

3) or... the old-fashioned hand.

I haven't a cow just yet, but I'm close to it. I want to be set up before the cow arrives. I have a barn with power, water is there, but not hooked up yet. I'm plannng to milk a single cow Jersey or Dexter.

I've read pros and cons of each machine, and I'm no closer to an answer than when I began. Hand milking seems to be quicker and cheaper, but I'm a little concerned about debris in the milk pail.

What do you guys find useful for the single family milking cow?

~Mark

[francismilker]

Just my opinion here because I have both methods (hand/machine) and use them both in a either/or fashion. It's a mistake buying a milking machine until you get the whole owning a cow thing figured out. Many a good new dairy cow owners have spent hundreds if not thousands on preps for a barn and supplies only to figure out it's not for them. If you do enjoy owning a family cow after about a month of two then spend the money and buy the machine. (Unless you're buying it for health reasons like arthritis)

Sometimes one cow doesn't make enough to justify cleaning the machine. By the time you go through all the trouble to cart hot water to the barn to clean it or spend the money on a hot water tank out there plus the cost of operating it, you could've handmilked faster and cheaper.

As far as debris in the milk, you might try what I do: I use a large piece of cloth (like an old hankerchief) and put it over the top of the milk bucket with a large rubberband and milk through it. It's the same concept to me as dairyman use on their bulk tanks. They filter it before it hits the tank.

[BlackWillowFarm]

If the cow you buy gives a small amount of milk and milks out fast you may be able to get away with hand milking. That was my plan when I got my first cow. Turns out she is a heavy milker (up to 10 gallons a day at peak) and a s-l-o-w milkout. It was taking an hour, twice a day to get her milked out by hand. After about a month my hands, wrists and arms were keeping me awake at night from pain. I bought a machine and have never regretted it. Between the two you show, I'd go with the Delaval style bucket instead of the Surge one. It's been said that reducing the milk flow down to four narrow openings can cause some backup in the milk lines possibly causing mastitis. Since I switched to the tall can, I haven't had any issues. Can't say for sure that's what made all the difference because there are so many variables, but I do think it helped.

[linn]

A Dexter milk cow will not flood you with milk. On the other hand, not all Dexters make good milk cows, check out the ancestry before buying. Some lines are much milkier than others. Our three Jersey/Red Angus cross cows make fantastic family cows. They milk heavy enough to raise a calf and furnish milk for the house. So far, they have been very gentle too.
If you get an older bred Jersey, she will most likely be past her peak production and will not milk too heavily.
I agree about not buying a milking machine too early. A cow can be an expenisve investment, no need to invest too much until you are sure everything is going well and you and the cow are comfortable with each other. You can always buy a couple of calves to share the milking duty. We have done that many times.

[Brooks WV]

Thanks for the input!

The Jersey I have my eye on is a 3-4 y/o with her second calf (2 months old) on her. She's being used primarily as a nurse cow for a small beef operation. She has been hand milked on the occasions she hasnt had a calf on her.

I'm familiar with dairy, having grown up in dairy country in NY and spending summers at my Uncles farm. We currently have Highlands that we use for farm decorations (and beef, but it's secondary to just having a cool looking cow ). I hesitate to say the cost of the machine isn't a factor, but I am willing to spend the money on a quality machine. Perahps we'll switch between hand/machine as we go, for sake of convenience, but I like having options. I'm looking for a Dexter from milky lines, but they're a scarce find here in WV. I"m in the south east corner, and I'm willing to drive for the right cow if you happen to know of any!

~Mark

edit: forgot to add, the Jersey is bred to an Angus for a March calf.

[springvalley]

I just love the DeLaval milkers, and I grew up with the Surge. I would still use a milker if I had one cow to milk, and if she only gave a gallon or two, i would still use the milker. Cleaning a milker is not wasted time IMO, I think machine milked cows are so much cleaner milking than by hand. Now don`t get me wrong, hand milking has its time and place, but most people can`t hand milk like our forefathers did. And most cows won`t put up with someone milking by hand for half an hour or more. A milker will not loose you money, if you don`t like, you can always sell it again. > Thanks Marc

[Callieslamb]

If you have water, electricity, and the funds - I'd use the machine. It's cleaner and faster. You will have to invest more $ for the cleaning chemicals. We installed a 6 gallon water heater in our barn on a timer. The water was hot by the time I got to the barn for each milking. We didn't notice any difference in the elec bill.

But rather than ask what you'd like, you might want to ask the cow what she's used to. It's easier to do what the cow is used to. Cows are creatures of habit - they like what they know and hate anything they don't know.

[Judy in IN]

Check out http://www.perrysmilkers.com/index.html That's where I found the Delaval milking setup for my sister.

[Brooks WV]

Thanks for the link Judy!

[julieq]

We finally gave up on the loud, new portable milking machine that we bought for our cow and reconditioned a vintage Surge milker for our goats when we sold our cow. It's so much quieter than the newer models, at least in our experience.

[Looking4ewes]

After a year and a half with my Jersey, I decided to remain a hand-milker. I've flirted with the idea of getting a machine for those times that I travel and the DH milks, but I never followed through with a purchase, and for now, I don't intend to purchase one. A machine would milk cleaner and faster, though clean-up would be difficult for our set-up. I prefer the simplicity and quietness of hand-milking. I have only one cow and I can milk, fed the calf, and clean the equipment in a half-hour.

[Brooks WV]

After talking with my father last night, I may be leaning toward hand milking. Should I end up with more than one cow, I will put some more thoughtinto a machine. My Dad said he milked four cows by hand as a kid and could finish each cow in about 10 minutes. How long does it take, on average?

~Mark @ Brooks Mountain Farm

[springvalley]

Mark: it all depends on the cow and you, some cows milk easier than others and some cows milk very hard. You also may not be a fast milker, and I will guarantee you will have very sore hands for awhile, GUARANTEE !!, this is one thing I have never found anyone that was use to doing if you have never done it before. But after a week of milking you will get use to it and hands won`t hurt so much. If you do get a cow, keep milking by hand in mind, don`t get a cow with short teats. It is a BUMMER to say the least, they are very hard to milk by hand. Teats three inches long are about perfect for hand milking. When you milk with your thumb and index finger thats not fun. > Thanks Marc

[linn]

Marc, you are so right about those short teats. One of my Jersey heifers had short teats when she first calved and I milked out the back teats with a thumb and finger. However, with her second lactation her back teats are long enough that I can milk using my hands on both. It depends on the cow. If a three or four year old cow has short teats, they aren't going to get any longer.

[Looking4ewes]

I alway find that people will exaggerate how quick it takes them to milk a cow. Yes, it depends on the cow and also how one milks, but for me, it takes from start to finish, 45 minutes when first fresh, and now only a half hour. I start counting from the time I leave the house, to when finished cleaning the equipment and feeding the calf. This is the entire chore, not just the milking part. I also think that, back in the day, cows didn't give as much milk as they do now.

As much as I enjoy hand-milking, if I had more than one cow, I would most likely get a machine. One cow is sufficient for our needs.

[Callieslamb]

Will you ever have the need of a relief milker? I know DH could never have milked a cow out by hand since he only milked once a month. I think in many ways, hand milking is less of a hassle. But the flies and tail swishing that goes on in summer as well as the muddy mess a cow can bring into a milking area in winter.....I couldn't hand milk. If you start out by hand, you can always switch to the other.

[Timberline]

I've been hand milking for over 25 years. I've had Dexters, Jerseys, Guernseys. I've also milked some good producing beef cows. Debris in the bucket has never been an issue. I thoroughly groom before milking (I spend a lot more time grooming than milking), cows are on clean pasture or in a clean well bedded stall. Mud around here is not a concern, one of the good points to living in an arid climate. I love to milk by hand and it's nice to have only my bucket and strainer to clean. I can milk any where, any time, whether or not there is power and water available.

But, now I'm getting carpal tunnel so bad that I'm coming down to the choice of getting a milking machine or no longer milking. I do not want a machine, but it would be much worse to give up my fresh milk. I've been looking at the same milkers you have, but have not made a choice of any kind yet. A friend bought one from Perrys and it did work fine, but it was so horribly loud, it was physically painful to the ears to be anywhere near it. She kept it less than a month. My concern is that most portable milkers might be this way.

If you buy a machine, make sure you know how to hand milk and that your cow will let you. You won't have a choice if your machine goes down for some reason.

[mozarkian]

It takes me about 20 minutes per cow to milk when they are really fresh, about 10 per cow toward the end of thier lactations (3 cows). I allow 2 hours in the morning and evening, to do all barn chores for the cows, calves, pigs, chickens, turkeys etc. This includes stall cleaning, feeding calves, watering, unloading feed, checking pastures /fences,etc. It almost never takes that long, but 5-7am and 5-7 pm are what works in my world.
Each cow has her own milk bucket with lid. A good udder washing at each milking and keeping the hair trimmed well goes a long way toward keeping the milk clean. I filter our house milk with a metal coffee filter because I am cheap and it works.
Yes your hands, wrists and forearms will scream at you for a couple weeks, but a couple aleve night and morning will help and it gets better pretty quick. For years, I had problems with my hands going numb when I typed or drove, but milking has cured that.
Main advice is to quickly establish a pattern and stick to it--your cows will give more milk and be easier to deal with when their world is the same everytime.

[sammyd]

I picked up a vacuum pump and a milker bucket for around 200 bucks. Spent a bit more over time updating though. The pump is in one half of a 4 car garage and we milk in the other half so it's fairly quiet.
Takes little time to run a couple of buckets of wash water through the bucket after milking.

If you get a vacuum pump the old Surge piston ones are fairly quiet, Any Universal pump made by Masport should be almost silent especially the old red ones. Any DeLaval or Bou Matic will be a screamer, stay away.
Haven't worked with any of the smaller portable ones....

[Brooks WV]

I've got the used deLaval milker picked out, price shipped is $950. I think I'm going to keep it on the hook and see if I can get by with hand milking. Her teats arent all that long, but not real short either. I will see how it goes when she gets here on Monday. I was supposed to get her yesterday, but I felt I didn't have everything set, so I pushed it back. I've read so much about milking and caring for the a family dairy that I'm dizzy from it! I just need to pull the trigger and get to it!