How much do they weigh?

[mesa123]

This is related to my previous thread about feeding...
Feed Question

Although the question is no longer so much about feeding, but more about establishing a weight for these heifers.

I was told these heifers were born in the fall of 2009, which would mean they are just about 18 months old now. The bull just arrived about two weeks ago and will be staying for two months. I haven't seen any breeding activity yet.

The bull owner was out over the weekend and commented on how good they all looked, so I guess I'm doing all right, but I still worry about providing adequate nutrition.

As I noted earlier, I am terrible at estimating weights, so please give me your best guesses. I did my best with the pics, but I didn't want to go inside the fence with the bull.

Thanks!

Group shot:


Bull:


The three heifers that I think are in good shape:




The one heifer that I think is too skinny:

[randiliana]

Well, it is hard to tell weight from the photos. They aren't overly fat, but neither are they really thin. I would say that they could use a little more condition though. And, I'm just judging by the photo with the bull (you can see part of the one heifer), that they would probably be in the 900 lb range. So, that isn't too bad.

[myersfarm]

just a guess but the bull looks young and if so is only 1100 that makes the biggest girl 750 small 650


ask the bull ower how much the bull weights will give a better idea

[ksfarmer]

I tend to think the heiffers need to put on more weight, they look in the 650-700 range to me, with the exception of the one who is definately too thin. At 18 mo I would prefer them a little better condition for breeding. They should be able to gain some during gestation if they get enough groceries. If not, you will have trouble. During calving and afterwards. They will be thin and poor milk producers , thus the calves will suffer and rebreeding will be hindered.

[mesa123]

The bull owner said his bull was 2000 lbs.

Does "more condition" mean the same as "more weight"?

Any suggestions on getting the thin one in better condition? As I said in the other post, she's always chased away from the feeders and round bales. I put up additional feeders and they still chase her away. And with the bull in there now, I want no part in going inside the fence to feed individually. She's too skittish to allow me too close anyway. Coincidentally, she is always right at the bull's side. Always.

[randiliana]

I thought you had said that he was an older bull in your other post. So I will stand by my guesstimate on the heifers' weight.

Yes, more condition does mean more weight.

The only way I can see you getting her in better condition is to separate here and feed her separately. Once your green grass comes in that will help too.

[mesa123]

According to bull owner....2 years old, 2000 lbs. I have no way of verifying that.

I'm counting on that green grass coming in!!! We're also going to greatly expand their pasture into the woods this summer (after the bull is gone), so I'm pretty confident they'll be looking better in a few months. I just really hate seeing thin animals.

I dewormed them last fall, but looking back, I think I probably underestimated their weight and didn't use enough, which I know is not a good thing to do. I'm thinking of deworming again this weekend and using more than I think I should. I used Iver-On 5mg/ml ivermectin pour-on dewormer.

[randiliana]

OK, well at 2 years old I doubt he weighs 2000 lbs, that would be quite a bull. But I don't doubt 1500-1700 lbs.

The problem with underconditioned animals is that it can be hard to get them bred. These girls might have a bit more trouble, but they aren't so thin that it should be a huge problem. And they are certainly old enough. Deworming could be the problem, and it certainly won't hurt to do it again. Have they been vaccinated?

[agmantoo]

I am having a problem trying to fine a reference to get a scale of size of the animals. IMO the bull is the only animal in decent body condition. The condition/size of the heifers makes me wonder if the birth date is off. The body condition of most of the heifers,regardless of age, is too low. An animal being bred needs a body condition of at least 5. A heifer is still growing and will loose BCS when feeding a calf unless she is receiving supplemental feed in the form of grain.

[myersfarm]

agman I was using the extralarge ear tags to go by weight


it takes a lot of bull to be 2000 lbs

[cowman]

My opinion: No way that bull weighs 2000 lb. and I would guess the heifers at not much over 700 if any. They really need more weight but they will get that if they have good grass this summer. Another thing, I would get another wormer besides Iver-on. That is a generic and my vet. advised against using it as it isn't regulated as to the amount of the active ingredient in it. I realize it is really cheap but remember: you usually get what you pay for. Just my opinion.

[mesa123]

Originally Posted by cowman

. I realize it is really cheap but remember: you usually get what you pay for. Just my opinion.

The Iver-On was free. And probably kinda old....so yeah, most likely it was not very effective.

I realize this is getting off topic, but which wormer would be best for these girls? A more reputable ivermectin? Safe-guard? Cydectin? Pour-on? Injectable? Paste? Top dress feed?

I would really prefer a feed through system, but I didn't think it would work as well. The pour-on and injectables are hard for me to use, meaning the heifers run away from me. I didn't realize that you could use a paste on cows like I do on the horses, and I think I could manage that.

[tinknal]

Is the owner of the bull the same guy who sold you the heifers? The bull is 1200-1500lbs.

The heifers look 14 to 16 months old (still old enough to breed).

If I may ask, did you buy them by the pound or by the each?

[agmantoo]

The haircoat does not indicate a parasite issue. The gut size does indicate less than 3% of their body weight in available feed. The head to arse ratio does make one guess excessively on their age. They could be older than their size indicates. If they were in my herd "as is" I would have culled them.

[mesa123]

The owner of the heifers sold them to me last summer by the pound. He said they were 480 lbs then. I think it worked out to about $400/each. He went through this period last year of buying and selling large batches of heifers, bottle calves, etc. I trust this guy, so I took him at his word on the weight. I've had lots of dealings with him over the past six years and while I believe he may have mis-estimated their weight, I don't think he was trying to rip me off in any way.

Here is the thread I posted last summer when I was trying to find if he was asking a fair price. There is a pic of these same heifers there.

Pricing Heifers

The bull owner is a different guy, but the previous owner of the heifers arranged the free use of the bull.

[randiliana]

Hmm, well, we can all guess about the weight of the heifers and the bull. It is hard enough to guess when they are standing in front of you, let alone from pictures, and especially photos which have nothing to compare the animals to really.

The bull is in good condition, he's a 2 year old. Most 2 year old bulls (large breed) will weigh 1500 lbs + especially if they have been fed well at all. If the bull's owner says he's 2 then who are we to be second guessing that!! I really doubt that the bull's owner is lying to you!

The heifers could definitely use more condition. They are NOT extremely thin, and once the spring grass comes in they will put on condition in a hurry, I've seen cattle in a heck of a lot worse condition than these get bred. Deworming them won't hurt, and as far as deworming goes the best is a feed through or injectable. The problem with feed through dewormers is that unless you can feed each animal separately you can't be sure they are all getting the amount they need. Increasing the amount of grain you are feeding these heifers might be a good idea right now. Unfortunately you also will be feeding the bull. Once the grass comes in and is tall enough to support the cattle you can quit the grain.

As far as not going in the pen because of the bull, is there a reason or are you just being overly cautious?

[randiliana]

Also, in addition to your last post, if they weighed 480 when you bought them last summer, unless you have been really starving them they should easily weigh 800 lbs by now. To put them at only 600 lbs you are looking at less that .5 lbs/day gain and that is really really poor gain

[springvalley]

I have to agree with some of the others, that bull no way in the world weighs 2000 lbs. Trust me on this one, I have been around cattle my whole life. Your heifers look good, but the first and last of the photo`s need some more groceries. Give them some more wormer before they head out for grass and they should be ok. Make sure they have plenty of mineral this summer. And never take the word from someone on the weight of cattle, I don`t care how honest you think they are, I would never go by just guessing. I weigh cattle at the fertilizer plant right on my trailer, then go back and weigh the empty trailer. Good luck with your cattle. > Marc

[mesa123]

Originally Posted by randiliana

As far as not going in the pen because of the bull, is there a reason or are you just being overly cautious?

I am not used to bulls and I am being overly cautious. Plus I'm usually doing my cow chores alone and the prospect of being alone and pinned to the ground or against the fence is not something I look forward to. Honestly though, the bull seems friendly enough. I haven't seen him do anything scary yet. But I've been told to never let my guard down around a bull, and I plan to stick to that.

Thanks for the advice everyone! It is greatly, greatly appreciated.

[oregon woodsmok]

I think they look OK. I'd like to see more weight on their haunches, but if they came from the same place as the bull, he's cat hammed, so it is possible that it is just their conformation and not lack of weight.

Pasture looks poor. They will put a lot of weight on as soon as the grass comes in.

Unless that fence is taller than 5 feet, I don't think he weights 2,000 pounds.

I don't think you over-paid for the heiffers.. Cattle are high right now and they appear to be range cattle. Plenty good enough to start with and you can upgrade later if you decide you like raising cattle.

Just a suggestion: when I have cattle all fed together and they aren't getting along well, I put hay in 3-4 spots. That way the bullies can't guard it all.