Possible Dexter purchase?

Creamers · #1 12/30/10, 04:28 PM

I am thinking about buying this heifer - the older one on the right (2 yrs old).
Not registered, easy to handle, open.

I am just getting more info on her now, haven't seen her in person. . .

Would this be a short legged? If so, is that something to avoid?

What all is involved in dehorning as far as recovery and expense or is that something that must be done?

Our goats all get disbudded, of course and our Jersey came to us already done, so I do not know anything about having dehorning done.

How would be a fair offer on her?

Possible Dexter purchase? - Cattle

I'd like her primarily as a small cow to breed to a local Dexter bull for beef with steers or to sell the heifer calves. . .if she milks, fine, if not, I have plenty of milk in the Jersey and goats.

genebo · #2 12/30/10, 07:47 PM

She looks like she's short legged. The scientific description of her condition is that she's a carrier of chondrodysplasia. It means she's a dwarf.

It has no effect on her health or well being, but breeding her to another dwarf can sometimes produce an early abortion or a dead calf. The odds are 1 in 4.

Being a Dexter, she has the heritage to be very gentle and easily handled. Most of them are, barring bad experiences. Just like the gentle breeds of dogs, once in a while you get a cranky one. You should go visit this cow before buying, to see if you would like to share a part of every day in close contact with her.

The Irish have been milking these gentle little cattle since the 19th century, with the horns on. If you're afraid of horns, they can be removed, although it's a traumatic experience for an adult cow. It could change her personality. All of my Dexters have their horns and I walk among them all the time without fear or injury. They're very well behaved and respectful of me.

Dexters are very trainable. They readily bond themselves to us.

Take a good look at the local Dexter bull before you decide to buy her. You're looking to see if he has short legs like her. If you're lucky, the bull has been DNA tested for chondro. You can ask his owner. If he's short legged (chondro carrier) then you should pass on this cow and instead look for a long legged cow to breed to him. Unfortunately, a long legged cow will be a few inches taller.

This is a nice looking cow, from the pictures. The udder and teats can't be seen. They're so important when you're milking. Long, straight teats are really nice. She has on a halter and is not fighting it, so there's a possibility that she's been trained to lead.

Her value is widely variable. It starts at the low end if she's cranky and hard to handle, or has problems with her teats or udder. Her value goes up if she has been trained to lead or is super gentle or has been trained to enter a stanchion or if she has been previously milked or if she is already bred or if she comes with a fresh calf.

Prices vary widely according to your location, too.

Probably the lowest price you'd find for an unregistered Dexter cow anywhere in the country would be $500. Probably the very highest price you'd find for one that had every one of the good traits but was unregistered would be under $2000.

Since she's not registered, you can't plan on selling her offspring as breeding stock. You have to consider yourself as the end user. Her true value to you is what you're willing to pay to have a nice, small milk cow.

After you get her, you might want to have her DNA tested for a condition called PHA. If she's positive, you'll want to avoid breeding her to a PHA positive bull. That can be a catastrophe. You might also consider having her tested for the type of beta casein in her milk (A2 or A1). If she's A2/A2, you'll definitely want to hang on to her.

A Dexter is a very good choice for a small acreage and a moderate milk production. You won't get as much milk as a Jersey, but she'll eat less, too. Don't buy milk you don't need.

If you get her, I wish you the best of luck for the duration of your relationship with her. Dexters have been known to live to 30 years old and continue calving into their twenties.

Genebo
Paradise Farm

copperhead46 · #3 12/30/10, 10:14 PM

She's really small so I would figure her to be short legged. You can have the horns removed if you want, doesn't cost much and little or no recovery time. At her age it will be harder on her than if she was a calf. You will have to make sure the bull is long legged, the bull owner should know what he has, talk to him about the breeding possibilities. As to her price, just ask around, don't be tempted to pay the same money that you would for a registered cow. You might check on Craigs list. Good luck, hope you do well with finding a Dexter.
P.J.

Creamers · #4 12/30/10, 11:20 PM

They want $700 open or will have her bred for $750, but I'd rather breed her to one of the bulls I've seen - all here locally are long legged. I thought she was short legged.

She is well halter broke and in some photos, you can see the man's young daughter leading her around.

She hasn't calved before and just turned 2. They bred her to a young bull, but it apparently didn't take because she just came into heat again, but he said the bull is very young, and he just had not taken her to the older bull to be bred yet.

He said they just wanted a milk source now and were buying a Jersey in milk rather than wait on this one to be bred and calve.

I'd have to factor a long trip to get her, but a wild registered Dexter heifer locally is $1000, and the unregistered wild ones run $800, so. . .it is a strong possibility, this one.

Carol K · #5 12/31/10, 07:53 AM

Hi Creamers,
ask yourelf what you want her for, she's very tiny, she may not produce lots of milk if you wanted to milk her. Same on the beef side, what she throws may also be very tiny and not worth raising for beef.
I disagree with Genebo a tad on the health issues of Chondro carriers. When they age they seem to suffer from joint issues, so just something to consider.
Anyway, just a few more things to consider.

Carol K

Onthebit · #6 12/31/10, 09:08 AM

I remove the horns not because I am afraid to be hurt but because the cows will hurt each other.

myersfarm · #7 12/31/10, 09:52 AM

for the $50 difference I would let him bred her the first time.....to make sure she will bred then next time bred to the bull I wanted...IF she doesnot bred she is worth very little if you wanted to sell when she would not bred like $250 to $300 see how much you would lose...I would take the $50 chance

genebo · #8 12/31/10, 10:02 AM

I disagree with you about the smaller steers not being worth raising for beef. That's not the case at all. The best steak I ever ate came from a Dexter steer that only stood 36" tall and weighed just 500#. Outstanding! It was because of him that I sold two other steers and am now raising two more.

I've heard it said that we all have the same number of cells in our bodies. If that is true in cattle, then the cells in a small steer are smaller than the cells in a large steer, making it easier to bite through the meat. For whatever reason, every bite of Dexter steak I've eaten (after the first two, that I overcooked and burnt up), was as tender as any steak I've eaten anywhere, any time. Plus it tasted so much better!

Carol may have meant that small steers won't bring as much money when sold for beef, so wouldn't suit a beef raising operation. I can't fault that logic. But for the small homesteader who intends to eat his own beef, they fill the bill quite nicely.

Quality above quantity! Yeah, Dexters!

Anything that is repeated often enough begins to take on a resemblance to truth. The old one about short legged Dexters having joint problems when they get older qualifies. How many old short legged Dexters have you had get joint problems, Carol? Your web site says that you don't own any shorties. Are you prejudiced against them? I'm not. I love them.

Genebo
Paradise Farm

~Tomboy~ · #9 12/31/10, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by genebo

Anything that is repeated often enough begins to take on a resemblance to truth. The old one about short legged Dexters having joint problems when they get older qualifies. How many old short legged Dexters have you had get joint problems, Carol? Your web site says that you don't own any shorties. Are you prejudiced against them? I'm not. I love them.

I have copied and pasted what Beryle Rutherford (Woodmagic herd) a preeminent Dexter breeder in the UK had to say about arthritis in Dexter chondro carriers. Beryle has since passed on, but her dedication to the breed still lives on.

Woodmagic:
"In my own experience the short leg carrier stands a big risk of becoming arthritic between the ages of eight or nine, and most short leg herds will have one or two in this condition. It can occasionally develop much earlier, but it was definitely one of the reasons I decided I must try to produce a short leg animal without the achondrodysplasia. Since I have eliminated it, I can honestly say I have only seen arthritis develop at much greater age, I have had a cow of 21 who developed a limp in her last two years, and one of nineteen at the moment, but I think at that age it is a reasonable impairment. The achondrodsyplasia is a fault in the bone development, and it is not surprising that it can increase the onset of early arthritis. I see no sense in having to cull an animal half way through its life, as I used to do in my early days".

Barb

Lazy J · #10 12/31/10, 07:06 PM

That would be a big NO GO for me. Too small, wait a second WAY too small.

oregon woodsmok · #11 01/01/11, 02:50 AM

2 years old and never conceived even though she has been bred is a bit of a red flag to me.

My suspicious nature questions if maybe this is the reason she is for sale. How about the possibility that she is a freemartin?

Something to think about.

Carol K · #12 01/01/11, 08:50 AM

Gene,
you are correct, I do not raise animals with a lethal genetic defect, so I don't have the experience of them with arthritis. I have however talked to several breeders and read what other breeders have said, to be convinced that Chondro affected dexters have problems with arthritis when they are not even into their teens.
If people want to raise carrier affected animals that is their choice, I have seen some very nice ones and I have seen some not so nice ones, just the same as non carrier animals, that's the nice thing there is choice.
However the poster asked for opinions on short leg, I believe he should hear what I believe is the truth, others posted their opinions, he can then take that info and make of it what he can.
On the horn issue, you can have them removed by your vet, or you can leave them on. I have both horned and polled animals. The ones with the horns do use them on the animals without horns, and some nasty injuries can result. I have decided because of this that I personally will have polled animals after having horned ones for 10 years. So polled animlas are available.
Creamers, if you need help looking for animals I am happy to help you anyway I can, just email.
Good luck with what ever you decide, try and gain as much knowledge as you can, there are many good web sites to read lots on, and Dexter breeders are passionate so will help you where they can.

Carol

linn · #13 01/01/11, 09:15 AM

I googled short-legged Dexters and arthritis and came up with numerous posts concerning the shorties and problems with arthritis. If you have questions, just do as I did and google it.

Creamers · #14 01/01/11, 11:12 AM

Thank you all. I do like the looks of this little gal, but my husband, for whatever reason, does not.
I have a high millking lined Jersey and goats to give more milk than I can ever use, so milk production isn't something I'm concerned about.

A raised steer that is small enough that my husband can process here on the farm is what I am really concerned about, and I feel I can sell any Dexter heifer for a fairly good price locally, registered or no.

Ideally, I want a black, long legged Dexter, but if my husband would have given a greenlight on this one, I'd have put a deposit on her.

Lazy J · #15 01/02/11, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Creamers

A raised steer that is small enough that my husband can process here on the farm is what I am really concerned about, and I feel I can sell any Dexter heifer for a fairly good price locally, registered or no.

Instead of trying to make micro-mini steers why not just get a pig? You'll get more meat in a shrter period of time.

Creamers · #16 01/03/11, 12:28 AM

I have a local farmer that sells us pork almost as cheap as I could "grow it," but we have no reasonable source of beef. . . but at the moment, my husband is not keen on the super tiny Dexters. . .not one as small as that heifer is, at any rate.

cowkeeper · #17 01/03/11, 02:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lazy J

Instead of trying to make micro-mini steers why not just get a pig? You'll get more meat in a shrter period of time.

Lazy J, Isn't suggesting a pig as a substitute, instead of a small bovine for beef, the same as suggesting getting a goat for milk, because you love Jersey milk and cream but want smaller quantities?