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  #1  
Old 10/20/10, 10:03 AM
 
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Question raising veal questions

I have access to Holstein steers, and already have 2 which I am going to raise til about 18 months old for beef. Was also thinking about raising one or two for veal, but I am not sure how to do that. Do they have to be milk/MR fed only? Or can I wean at 6-8 weeks and feed hay and grain? Also, do they require smaller stalls or any special housing? I read this article, and was wondering if those that raise veal on HST do the same thing? If not, how do you raise them?

http://ohioline.osu.edu/as-fact/0007.html

Thanks.

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  #2  
Old 10/20/10, 10:55 AM
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you can feed veal whatever you like.

Grain fed veal usually gets some hay as well as grain. The meat will be darker and fattier.

Modern veal facilities use bigger stalls and some will even run groups so you needn't do anything special. Putting them in hutches would work.

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Old 10/20/10, 01:55 PM
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Most veal in the early days were put in stalls and fed only milk, no exersize, no outdoors. That is why the veal was so pale and almost white, no muscle or very little. You can feed your calves how ever you like, they will be yummy what ever. > Thanks Marc

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  #4  
Old 10/20/10, 05:34 PM
 
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Sorry, but why would you want to butcher for veal when you can feed them a few more month and get much more better tasting meat (IMO) and let them live a happy life for a while?
I have always boycotted veal, I know it's my opinion, but I am really wondering also.
Chris

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  #5  
Old 10/20/10, 05:59 PM
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I understand not wanting to eat mass produced store bought veal, but we're talking about stuffing one or two into the family freezer....Young or old explain the difference? Anyway thanks to Liz D, I raised a couple veal calves and happy I did. They drank plenty of milk and also ran the pastures eating whatever else. Butchered at 350lb the best I can remember. No grain ever. Excellent meat yield and would do it again....Topside.

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  #6  
Old 10/20/10, 08:44 PM
 
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Topside, how long did it take you to raise a calf to 350 lbs? and was it a dairy or a beef breed?

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  #7  
Old 10/21/10, 06:42 AM
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The best I can recall 5-6 months. I'd dig into my paperwork, but then again you haven't seen the mess. They were Holsteins, fed large amounts of goats milk. Topside

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  #8  
Old 10/21/10, 07:08 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by springvalley View Post
Most veal in the early days were put in stalls and fed only milk, no exersize, no outdoors. That is why the veal was so pale and almost white, no muscle or very little. You can feed your calves how ever you like, they will be yummy what ever. > Thanks Marc
That is correct but not quite how veal came about. Veal was once a calf that had been milk fed with some grass/grain and as soon as it was weanable, it was killed. I imagine this stemmed from areas of the world where taking an animal through to an older age was both impossible in terms of acreage/feed, and storage. To be anything close to true veal it should still be milk fed and the meat should look like chicken and in comparison to beef, quite tasteless. It is interesting that a lot of Italian receipes call for veal and they are highly spiced. This is a country that I would think in times past, small farmers would not have been able to take cattle through to an older age so learnt to use what they had and veal is like chicken in that it is bland and will take on the flavour of whatever is put with it.

Nowadays, veal has more to do with age than rearing and run long the lines that Topside described so Stiffle, you really don't have to do anything except rear your calves as you normally would and then decide whether you want to keep them on milk for a bit longer, wean them at the normal time and kill them at that point or wean them and kill them a couple of months later. Whichever way you go, they should be in the freezer before the 6-7 month old stage.

Cheers,
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  #9  
Old 10/22/10, 12:17 PM
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Thats funny about not wanting to kill a veal calf because it is too young. I have a dairy cow who turned 16 in aug, and is bred back for april, her 14 lactation. You people that would kill an 18 month old steer are robbing the craddle! :0)

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  #10  
Old 10/22/10, 01:41 PM
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Good point Tad...Give the old timer a hug for us...Topside

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  #11  
Old 10/22/10, 02:07 PM
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If I can remember properly. Veal was raised on an Iron deficient diet to get the pale meat. Kept off the ground and away from metals that they could lick to get the mineral and also off of milk replacers that have iron in them. I was told that the animal would eventually die because of the deficiancy and that it would not grow to an old(er)age on that diet anyway.Also the meat would be tender simply from lack of movement because it is hard to keep the animal away from the mineral in a large area, that's why they are kept in small pens. This is why many people won't eat veal, they consider it cruel.

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  #12  
Old 10/24/10, 05:34 PM
 
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Stifflej, milk fed veal, I mean real whole goat or cow milk fed, is a really incredible meat. The taste is subtly of beef, tender beyond belief and totally different than any other. Having said that, if you don't have access to real whole milk, and use milk replacer, I think you will end up with that bland stuff that a few people are talking about in this thread. We give our calves as much milk as they can take, free access to grass or hay and mineral and a buddy or two. We kill them about 400 - 450# live weight and they dress (hang) around 250#, at about 4 months. They are usually pure Holstein calves, who would otherwise be sold at the barn for vealers to industrial companies, who raise veal conventionally, also talked about in this thread. Our veal is a rose colour, more like pork, with the different cuts and colour. I understand that there is some stigma attached to vealing a calf, but done properly that calf has as happy a life, albeit shorter, as any other animal. Really when you think about it, if you eat and/or raise meat, a chicken is younger, a lamb and pig about the same age when they are slaughtered, so a veal calf is not so different. Just different perceptions. I'm not trying to convince anyone that they should raise the occasional calf for veal, but I am saying that some of the preconceptions about it are wrong. It is anything but bland and anything but cruel if done with the animal's welfare in mind. Same thing we think about with all of our animals here as I'm sure all of you do too. L ps glad to here that you are enjoying it Topside!

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  #13  
Old 10/24/10, 05:37 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tad View Post
Thats funny about not wanting to kill a veal calf because it is too young. I have a dairy cow who turned 16 in aug, and is bred back for april, her 14 lactation. You people that would kill an 18 month old steer are robbing the craddle! :0)
And then where would the cattle go? We wouldn't have any=theres no need....except in zoos!
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  #14  
Old 12/29/12, 06:27 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LizD View Post
Stifflej, milk fed veal, I mean real whole goat or cow milk fed, is a really incredible meat. The taste is subtly of beef, tender beyond belief and totally different than any other. Having said that, if you don't have access to real whole milk, and use milk replacer, I think you will end up with that bland stuff that a few people are talking about in this thread. We give our calves as much milk as they can take, free access to grass or hay and mineral and a buddy or two. We kill them about 400 - 450# live weight and they dress (hang) around 250#, at about 4 months. They are usually pure Holstein calves, who would otherwise be sold at the barn for vealers to industrial companies, who raise veal conventionally, also talked about in this thread. Our veal is a rose colour, more like pork, with the different cuts and colour. I understand that there is some stigma attached to vealing a calf, but done properly that calf has as happy a life, albeit shorter, as any other animal. Really when you think about it, if you eat and/or raise meat, a chicken is younger, a lamb and pig about the same age when they are slaughtered, so a veal calf is not so different. Just different perceptions. I'm not trying to convince anyone that they should raise the occasional calf for veal, but I am saying that some of the preconceptions about it are wrong. It is anything but bland and anything but cruel if done with the animal's welfare in mind. Same thing we think about with all of our animals here as I'm sure all of you do too. L ps glad to here that you are enjoying it Topside!
Thank you for this information. Very helpful.

One question: How much meat do you get from that 250 lb hanging weight? I haven't been able to find any info. Thanks.
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  #15  
Old 12/30/12, 07:44 AM
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I have always boycotted veal also. Veal is only fed milk; anything else is baby beef. I object to veal because of the way it is raised. Who wants to eat meat that is anemic, anyway?

I put a Jersey steer in the freezer last year that weighed 700 lb. He dressed out at 350 lbs, but I had been graining him.

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Old 12/30/12, 11:56 AM
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Good post by LizD.

We raised veal on our farm growing up in the same way as she describes except the calves were fed sour milk colostrum we held over from our fresh cows. Very tender and delicious. My Hungarian great grandparents considered it a luxury they couldn't afford in the old country and it became a very normal part of our freezer for us boys growing up. Sunday dinner with my grandparents wouldnt be the same without veal ragout once a month.

Every animal serves a purpose. Even little ones, IMO.

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  #17  
Old 12/30/12, 12:06 PM
 
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I've been doing them for years on goat milk...like the ones about 350-500 pounds as they are easy to handle while alive and not such a huge butchering project...our "stew" meat was fork tender when raw! it was pinkish...It makes good lean sausage too...we do 25# batches of hot italian and garlic/cheese...I loathe fatty sausage...so this is quite perfect.

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  #18  
Old 12/31/12, 07:25 AM
 
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Originally Posted by mpillow View Post
I've been doing them for years on goat milk...like the ones about 350-500 pounds as they are easy to handle while alive and not such a huge butchering project...our "stew" meat was fork tender when raw! it was pinkish...It makes good lean sausage too...we do 25# batches of hot italian and garlic/cheese...I loathe fatty sausage...so this is quite perfect.
How much actual meat do you get out of it?
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  #19  
Old 12/31/12, 04:18 PM
 
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a 200# live weight is 70-90# of meat (some calves have some jersey mix and will give lower yields)after the 200# mark they start to get bigger boned and yield ratio can go down slightly but at that age mine are on grass and extra milk so it doesnt bother me much...because depending on whether we harvest moose/deer we may winter over the beef....I'm flexible and freezer space is limited....

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  #20  
Old 01/02/13, 11:53 AM
 
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okay---I got my meat back from "Butch-ER the Moo" He was 375-400 pounds live wt...mostly holstein...we got 143 pounds of meat (no bones) so 37-38% meat yield....Had a nice big burger as soon as I got home from the butcher shop....YUMMY!

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  #21  
Old 01/02/13, 12:13 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mpillow View Post
okay---I got my meat back from "Butch-ER the Moo" He was 375-400 pounds live wt...mostly holstein...we got 143 pounds of meat (no bones) so 37-38% meat yield....Had a nice big burger as soon as I got home from the butcher shop....YUMMY!
Thanks so much!
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  #22  
Old 01/02/13, 01:53 PM
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Good grief you guys!!!!

i think i have ruined my puter with all this drool...

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  #23  
Old 01/04/13, 07:08 PM
 
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I have done the same as LizD for years.
The meats great and the animal is easy to butcher at that age and size.
Best of luck.

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