When to start Milking?

[jlgoinggreen]

Hello Everyone,
Our cow just had her calf yesterday. She had milk fever and has been treated today. The baby stopped nursing once mom started showing symtoms. We had to milk her a little (half a gallon) and had to tube the baby to get colostrum in her. We were wondering when do we start milking? We know we can not drink the milk for at least a week, but do we still start milking twice a day right away or do we give her a few days?

[gone-a-milkin]

Start milking her twice a day.

[MARYDVM]

If you empty her udder out after being treated for milk fever, she could go down again. Depending on breed, age, nutrition, and how long she was dry, you might want to take only enough for the calf (or just let the calf nurse)for a few days.

[jlgoinggreen]

Originally Posted by MARYDVM

If you empty her udder out after being treated for milk fever, she could go down again. Depending on breed, age, nutrition, and how long she was dry, you might want to take only enough for the calf (or just let the calf nurse)for a few days.

We believe the calf is nursing, although we have not actually seen her nurse since the tubing. She is hopping around and playing so we are almost positive she is nursing when we are not around. Dh just milked a quart just in case the calf is nursing, so she is not milked out completely.

[gone-a-milkin]

In my experience a cow who is prone to milkfever will get it whether she is milked out or not.

[jlgoinggreen]

Originally Posted by gone-a-milkin

In my experience a cow who is prone to milkfever will get it whether she is milked out or not.

How likely is it she will relapse or go into ketosis? DH is out there now with her just making sure she is OK. I'm exhausted and will take a nap now while I put the two legged baby to sleep, then out I will go again.

[gone-a-milkin]

MOST of the time they just need one treatment. Seriously, I have known a few who would go down at the drop of a hat, but only like 3%.

w/o knowing her history, I wont hazard to guess if she will have further problems.

Try not to worry too much. Just do a check every 4 hours. That is only getting up once.

This is all going to be worth it when you start making all those yummy dairy products.

[springvalley]

I never milk a cow out completley after calving for a few days, and slowly milk more each day. By 5 to 7 days milk her all the way out. Just remember, cold ears and dry nose, means milk fever. keep an eye on her, make sure she gets plenty of water, warm would be best. alfalfa hay if you have it. Thanks Marc.

[gone-a-milkin]

Marc, has your method worked? or do you still have a few who just get milkfever no matter what? I have tried any and all of the 'tricks' I have read, but certain cows... You really dont milk them all the way out for 7 days? Not arguing, just curious.

My experience has been that it is better to get them into their milk. Keep the calcium coming (if they need it), especially for an older 'established milker' like this cow in the OP.

[springvalley]

When we bought our cows I was one nervous Nellie about milk fever, I have done everything the old timers have told me to do, and over the last two years with 16 cows I have had one cow with a slight case of milk fever. I always keep the tubes of calcium you can buy at the farm stores for milk fever on hand, and if I have one I think could be coming down with it I tube her. The cold ears, dry nose, is a good indication. The lady I got my cows from said three of my cows where prone to milk fever(after I had them home) so to watch them. And they have never given me a problem. Now granted, mine are due to start calving again next month so now I will have trouble. I never milk them all the way out for at least 5 days. If you think about it , if that calf was nursing it would not be taking that much from her. I also heard a new trick from an old timer last year, a cow with high somatic cell count can be helped by putting a few calves on her and letting them nurse her instead of milking her. The calves do something we can`t by nursing and before long you will be able to milk her and not the calves. I tell you what the old timers have taught me alot about all kinds of livestock, and like I have stated on other threads I call the vet. very little. Now granted my cows are organicly feed, and we do not push them. I don`t know if that is good or bad , but we get along o.k., anymore questions feel free to ask. Thanks Marc

[jlgoinggreen]

Originally Posted by springvalley

anymore questions feel free to ask. Thanks Marc

HA! Be careful what you ask for, but WELL.....since you're asking.....

If we have the calf on her, should we then stop milking? DH milked her last night and only milked about a quart. She had a lot more in there, but the vet also told us not to milk her out completely. We've been told to milk her just enough to ease her fullness. We are almost positive the calf is nursing off her mom because she is very vigorous and hasn't shown any of the signs I've been told to watch for to see if she's not eating (only laying down, lethargic, etc...) As much time as we try to spend with them (besides when she was first born) we have never seen her nursing. It seems she is very nosy and wants to see what we are doing while we are in the barn (although I've been told they can not see when they are newborns, she sure follows us around with her eyes).

Now, I know we can't drink the milk yet (although my son is very anxious to start), but we have been mixing it with our goat milk and giving it to our goat kids. So....when should it be OK for US to drink the milk? We bought a gallon from the store that we have really been nursing because no one really likes the taste of it anymore. I so regret not paying the $4 for "real" milk. It is a pretty long drive though and we figured we should have our "own" milk soon.

BTW.....I agree with you 100% that the old timers know best. That is why besides all the books I've been reading, I always will ask on these forums (I belong to this one and "Keeping a Family Cow"). 98% of the time, I end up doing what the majority here tells me to do....to a point of course because sometimes common sense has a lot to do with it. Especially if I don't get enough responses to my questions. Then I really have to pray and go with my gut. And let me tell you there has been that 1% that I end up listening to someone else (like the vet in this past situation) that it ended up biting me in the but. And not that the vet did not know what he was doing, he just figured as newbies we were exaggerating in describing to him what was going on over the phone and did not come out till the next morning.

[Farm 36]

Milk fever has to do with nutrition not the cow . I milk my cows out all the way to help prevent mastitis and to get them eating to prevent a DA. Your cow will have a bigger hurddle to get started properly with mastitis or a DA . A lost quarter will decrease the value of the cow and less milk plus the expense of the drugs. A cow that gets a DA will loss weight and have a tougher time getting bred back . On a 1000 cow dairy if we treat 10 cases of milk fever a year that is a lot .The dairy cow of today is made to make milk in our modern systems witch is different than the beef cow that is made to make beef.

[springvalley]

Jennifer: You will be able to drink the milk after 4 or 5 days, just keep milking the cow out more each day, as long as your not pouring the feed to your cow you should have no problem with mastitis. But you also need to be milking some out of each quarter each milking, and by day 5 if you have not had any trouble with the cow, milk her out all the way. You should be able to use the milk after day five. Then you will be able to , if you want to feed the cow more to get more milk. Now as far as the calf goes , if she is up running around she must feel good. Watch the calf for poop, she should have gone by now, it will be yellow to greenish goo. And yes calves can see when they are born.
And as Farm36 has stated, milk fever does have alot to do with nutrition, it still has some to do with some cows. Never but never feed your jersey cows alfalfa hay during there dry period, very good grass hay is most important. Then after they have had their calf, then feed alfalfa hay and warm water. And keep an eye on them. I also am on "keeping a family cow" same name, hope to see you there. Any more questions just ask. Thanks Marc

[triple divide]

In all my life, I have never heard of more tales of woe where it concerns milk fever, than this forum. I'm beginning to sincerely wonder whether or not some of these milk fever cases are actually cases of misdiagnosing on the farm.

Farm 36, I agree with you and your observations entirely. Milk fever has more to do with diet and age. If y'alls cows are constantly going down with milk fever, find a good nutritionist.

If a man (read also woman) has one cow and lives a life petrified she's gonna collapse from milk fever, sell her and get a hardier animal.

I understand Llamas don't "get the fever!"

[jlgoinggreen]

Wow triple divide. I guess I should have called you over instead of my vet when my cow toppled over. You sound like you are so knowledgeable when it comes to milk fever.

In all honesty my vet, who apologized so much I felt bad for him, had the same frame of mind you do and my cow almost died because of that. She DID have milk fever and I think it is so rude for you to come on here with this very rude post without being here yourself to look at my cow and "misdiagnose" her in person.

[MARYDVM]

I just gave a talk to the local 4 H about the differences and similarities between the family cow and the commercial dairy animal.
For the family cow, milk fever is more of an issue because dry periods may be extended (cow would be culled in commercial unit), ration is not computer balanced, and cows last a long time. A commercial dairy might boast of having an 8 year old still producing, a family cow still has a long productive life ahead of her at that point. Displaced abomasums and ketosis are worries for the commercial dairyman, the family cow fed a forage based diet and not pushed for production very rarely has those problems.

In the OP's case, I believe this cow had severe watery diarrhea at freshening? That in itself will put a cow on the ground with hypocalcemia. Even cows that have been fresh awhile can go down from a severe indigestion.

[triple divide]

Originally Posted by jlgoinggreen

Wow triple divide. I guess I should have called you over instead of my vet when my cow toppled over. You sound like you are so knowledgeable when it comes to milk fever.

Knowldgeable enough to tell you that in 39 years in agriculture (17 years milking cows) I've thrown more 500cc bottles of Calcium and Dextrose away than we ever used.

Secondly, I don't know why you think my post was rude. You now have an animal that will have milk fever every time she freshens (more likely than not) without strict attention paid to certain things, ie. nutrition. A fact that others posting noted as well as the Doc pretty much confirming why family cows have more problems with this than dairy farmers do. A fact I was not aware of, yet makes sense.

IMO she is now a liability. I'd get rid of her and raise the heifer after a couple months of milking.

Years of selective breeding by farmers have built your dairy cow for one purpose, to make milk. A lot of it. More than your family could probably consume. They were bred into what they are to create a surplus of milk on the farm. By virtue of the nature of your op, I'm going to assume you may not realize this fact either.

If you are having problems now, I predict there will be more problems that will compound upon your current issues.

I nevertheless wish you the very best.

[mahafakir]

I'm surprised that the calf stopped nursing when the cow got milk fever. The calf itself might have been sick if it was refusing to suckle the teats. The calves will never refuse to suckle the teats. The cow should be milked atleast twice a milk. People ask can ewe milk once a day? If you do not think that milking is fun you do not have to milk. But the milk shpuld not be allow to stay in the udder. If the udders are big they would get filled soon after the cow is millked.

There are several uses for the milk even if you do not drink it. The first thing you can do iis to save the milk for feeding the calves. The milk may not be fit for human consumption. But it is good for the calves. It may get rotten and become spoiled the calf will drink it. This is especially important if you want to sell the milk so that you can use the money to buy feed for the cow.

No matter what you do the calf should be weaned off the mother and fed by bottle or the bucket. Do not worry about the cow. It would not matter much to the cow whether it is milked by humans or its clf. It will get used to being milked by you. If you use the Colustrum for feeding the calf you'd not have to use good milk for feeding the calf.

By the way you can make desert out of the Colustrum by boiling it for a few minutes and adding sugar. Try it. You'll love it. They do it all the time in India and akistan and Bangla Desh and Nepal and Tibet and so on.

[springvalley]

You know Triple, it is people that have no compasion to help others that gives all dairy men a bad name. I have miked cows most of my life, and I have been farming 30 years, I just love helping young people, and old, that want to move to the country and try and live the good life. What is wrong with some one that wants to milk a cow, yes they may not know how to feed and care for cows like those of us that have grown up on a farm and have farmed all our lives. I think it is our duty to help those people and their cows if we can. I also plan on finding someone to take over my farming operation when I retire, rather than sell the cows and crop farm, then when I couldn`t climb up and down out of the tractor rent the farm to the big crop farmers, and then have my kids sell the farm when I die and have no more use for it. It is our job to take these people under our wing and teach them how to care for their cows and calves and make things more productive than just critisize their falts. You know it would have made you look much nicer if you would have offered help rather than grumble about things. I know dairy farming is not the best as of late, so I may give you some lee way you may just be in a bad mood. Sorry I have been so windy, I will get off my soap box, but I just love the idea that there are so many people that want the country life again. THANKS Marc.

[gone-a-milkin]

Milkfever is a much more common ailment for Jerseys than for Holsteins, regardless of the size of the dairy herd.


Jennifer, how is Blossom doing now? Have you caught that calf nursing yet?
We need an update.