Angus vs Jersey for beginner?

[jlgoinggreen]

We are just starting our Homestead and do not want to over do it. Our plan is to try to provide for our family and maybe make a little money in the process. We have decided to buy two Jersey steers that are now about 350 lbs each and should be ready for the butcher by Fall. We are also considering buying a cow to provide us with milk and a baby calf.

I am hoping someone more experienced (we have no experience in this) might be able to give us advice. My husband wants to eventually get into meat cows. Right now we are being offered to buy a 4 to 5 month pregnant Angus for $650 or an open Jersey for $450 which the seller will have AI'd for $30 before we take her off his farm. Which will be a better deal (We live in PA near MD and purchasing in MD)? Which breed would it be best for a beginner to start with? Which breed are known to be better mothers?

[springvalley]

Well, depends on what you want to do here. Do you want to raise calves for sale or get milk and maybe a calf to raise and eat. Is the angus tame? She could be milked and sell the calf. The jersey could be breed to an angus to get a better selling calf. I think if it were me I would breed the jersey to an angus and milk the cow and eat the calf. Thanks Marc.

[Callieslamb]

If you want milk - get the jersery. She can have 1/2 beef calves and you are good to go.

[gone-a-milkin]

Do not buy the Jersey until you know more about her and until she is CONFIRMED to be bred.

A dairy cow is a big commitment both time and money. Dont just buy the first one that comes along and hope for the best. $450 is really cheap. Why? What is wrong with her? Very important to know before you bring a large animal into your scene.

[jlgoinggreen]

OK, weird...... I just tried to reply and it just all disapeared. I hope my reply doesn't come up twice, but with kids and animals my replies take like a half hour to type up. The system then asks for my password again.

Anyways, Thanks everyone. Your replies are appreciated. What we plan to do is have a cow for our personal use (milk for us and our animals and use her baby calf for meat for our family). We are also purchasing two steers. One will be sold and the other one to butcher this fall to sell half the meat to a friend and keep half for our family. Depending on how this goes, my husband will like to start purchasing bottle fed calves to raise for this purpose. This of course will be in the future after we see what it is like to have these three cows in our place.

I have spoken to both gentleman trying to sell us cows. The one selling the Angus told us he has never milked any of his cows and not sure how they will handle it. He buys them at the salesbarn and has them foster the babes. We met the cows and they seem very friendly, but have never been milked. He keeps them for three years to produce calves to sell for meat and replenish his farm. He stated he also has an Angus Holstein cross that might work for what we want, but again she has never been milked before. For some reason, although he would love to, his wife will not drink raw milk or eat fresh farm eggs. She prefers to buy her eggs and milk in the store.

The other gentleman on the other hand buys his calves from local dairy farms and bottle feeds them. We have not met them yet. We hope to go this weekend to see his farm and meet his cows. He stated he and his wife do hand milk their cows and they are all very friendly and tame. Of course the Jersey we are speaking about purchasing has never given birth and he doesn't know how she will react. He did have a pregnant Holstein for sale, but she gave birth a couple of days ago and he has decided to keep her and her calf.

I'm not sure why he is selling this Jersey heifer so cheap. He stated that he buys them when they are just days old bottle calves to raise and sell. He is stating he has too many and would like to bring his numbers down for the winter. Just in case.....besides making sure she is bred before buying, what else should I be looking for in a heifer?

[jlgoinggreen]

Another thing, being that she is still young, if we buy her and she is not able to get bred, we should still be able to sell her for meat?

[6e]

If you're wanting them for milk I would strongly suggest the Jersey and not the Angus. Generally speaking, people don't milk beef cows and they don't have the sheer quantity of milk that a dairy cow does. Sort of like buying meat goats for the purpose of milking. They're not bred for that and so don't work very well for that.

$450 for a young heifer doesn't seem to be too far fetched. I've seen a few. My question would be is she tame enough to milk? Not much fun dealing with an unruly cow that doesn't want to be milked! We paid $950 for our bred milk cow, but she is as sweet as she can be and is a dream to work with and you can eat the bull calves. They don't put on weight as fast as a beef calf would, but Jersey/beef cross might be a good mix and you're just keeping them on pasture to fatten up, it's not too bad.

For someone just starting out, I would suggest getting a cow that's already been milked and you know is tame and easy to handle. I can tell you even our sweet sweet cow can turn into a real handful when she had a cut on her teat and that kicking can get dangerous, so a sweet tame cow is worth the extra money if you ask me.

[Cat]

She would bring a lower slaughter price being a jersey.

How much milk do you need? I'm a member of a few different cattle boards and there are several people who milk their beef cows. Personally, in my situation I have come to realize that an Angus or other beef breed would work better for me because I do not need a large amount of milk but do want a large amount of beef. I also get out of town occasionally so it would be beneficial that I could milk when/if I wanted it but let her go if I wasn't going to be in town. Because I wouldn't commit to a OAD milking, she wouldn't be stressed by my absence and I wouldn't have to try to find someone to milk for me (hard enough to do simply feeding birds & watering livestock, don't dare try to find someone to do something as unpleasant as milk!)

I'd be super excited if I could find a beef cow for $650.

[linn]

A Jersey/Angus cross should be ideal for a family cow. You can breed her to a Jersey and get a good milking heifer or breed her to a beef bull for good beef. My Jersey/Red Angus cross hit about 4 gallons per day at her peak production. Her milk had plenty of cream also. I have never tried to milk a straight Angus. We did have a Hereford cow that we could milk, we mostly used her for a nurse cow.

[Danaus29]

You can milk an Angus, you just don't get much milk. We raised Angus when I was a kid, but the only time any were milked was when they wouldn't feed their own babies. A neighbor did get one of the old cows coaxed over to his fence so he could milk her to get milk for his youngest child. We found out when one of the older kids saw Grandpa and spilled the beans.

And you can eat Jerseys. I don't know how much meat you could expect from one though.

As for being easy to milk and a good mother, depends a lot on that particular cow. One that has been handled more is easier to milk. But not having had cows before I don't know if you want to try raising a young one right off. Try the steers to see if you want cows. Since you have Nubian goats I'll asume you know what it's like to be tied down to a milking and feeding schedule. Cows can be very loud if they aren't fed on schedule.

[jlgoinggreen]

Depending on how it goes when we visit the farm and see the Jersey in person and how she acts around us and the kids, we are leaning more towards purchasing this Jersey. The gentleman selling her to us seems really nice and helpful. He seems to really care about his animals and where they will placed. It seems he is interviewing me as much as I'm interviewing him. I guess there is some sort of attachment and love for the animal when you have been bottle feeding them. I'm sure he wants to sell this cow, but doesn't seem like the type that will sell her into an uncomfortable situation. I have a list of questions to ask him (hopefully I won't freak him out) and one of these questions is to know how the Jersey was raised, mainly if she has been handled a lot since we are being told that would have a lot to do with her letting us hand milk her.

I am curious in case we do purchase her, how hard is it to train a cow to let you milk her? Especially if she is unruly? How would you do this?

My husband also wanted me to ask about bottle fed babies. This was our first plan. We were going to buy a bottle fed Holstein and buy the milk from our neighbor who raises Holsteins for $2 gallon. He was telling us it would be cheaper for us to buy Milk Replacer. We are curious, how much would the average cost be to raise a bottle fed calf with milk replacer? Our local Tractor Supply store sells a 25lb bag for $37. How much of this would they go through in 8-12 weeks?

[kscowboy]

Buy the angus for your beef needs and get the jersey for milking needs.

The two worlds don't mix very well.

The price for the bred heifer is very low , Why is the question , a bred heifer around here , in cattle country will sell for 800.

If you get angus or angus crosses you can always sell them at market if need be , if you have a dairy steer you'll only get 1/2 of what an angus will bring at market , plus you'll have to feed it twice as much to get weight on it.

[gone-a-milkin]

Okay, first off, no 'leaning towards' buying anything (sight unseen). Do NOT just go over there and fall in love with her pretty face and buy her right then-and-there. Be a little aloof and say you have some other animals you are looking at too.

The first thing you need to do though is get a cow that is either in milk or BRED. Not just AIed a few days before you take her home. Unless you have a plan for getting her bred? If she hasn't had a calf before, she is unproven. An unproven young heifer is not the same thing as a 'milk cow'.

Do you currently milk your goats by hand? Most cows are trainable to handmilking, though it helps if you are not ALSO new to handmilking at the same time.

I have to say that dairy/beef crosses CAN make lovely milk cows. Do not rule them out entirely. They tend to be easy calvers and easy keepers. Their production can surprise you too.

Go over to the farm and take some pics. Ask all your questions. Tell them you will need to sleep on that decision (at least!) and dont let those dairy farmers buffalo you. (LOL.)

Good luck! Getting new livestock is exciting. Dont get swept away.

[jlgoinggreen]

Originally Posted by gone-a-milkin

Okay, first off, no 'leaning towards' buying anything (sight unseen). Do NOT just go over there and fall in love with her pretty face and buy her right then-and-there. Be a little aloof and say you have some other animals you are looking at too.

The first thing you need to do though is get a cow that is either in milk or BRED. Not just AIed a few days before you take her home. Unless you have a plan for getting her bred? If she hasn't had a calf before, she is unproven. An unproven young heifer is not the same thing as a 'milk cow'.

Do you currently milk your goats by hand? Most cows are trainable to handmilking, though it helps if you are not ALSO new to handmilking at the same time.

I have to say that dairy/beef crosses CAN make lovely milk cows. Do not rule them out entirely. They tend to be easy calvers and easy keepers. Their production can surprise you too.

Go over to the farm and take some pics. Ask all your questions. Tell them you will need to sleep on that decision (at least!) and dont let those dairy farmers buffalo you. (LOL.)

Good luck! Getting new livestock is exciting. Dont get swept away.

Thanks! This is great advice.

[6e]

I will say this.....when going from milking goats to milking a cow, be prepared for a real work out on those arm muscles!! LOL

[gone-a-milkin]

Originally Posted by 6e

I will say this.....when going from milking goats to milking a cow, be prepared for a real work out on those arm muscles!! LOL

LOL! That is the truth! especially with a jiggy little first freshener with teeny tiny titties.

[6e]

Originally Posted by jlgoinggreen

Depending on how it goes when we visit the farm and see the Jersey in person and how she acts around us and the kids, we are leaning more towards purchasing this Jersey. The gentleman selling her to us seems really nice and helpful. He seems to really care about his animals and where they will placed. It seems he is interviewing me as much as I'm interviewing him. I guess there is some sort of attachment and love for the animal when you have been bottle feeding them. I'm sure he wants to sell this cow, but doesn't seem like the type that will sell her into an uncomfortable situation. I have a list of questions to ask him (hopefully I won't freak him out) and one of these questions is to know how the Jersey was raised, mainly if she has been handled a lot since we are being told that would have a lot to do with her letting us hand milk her.

I am curious in case we do purchase her, how hard is it to train a cow to let you milk her? Especially if she is unruly? How would you do this?

My husband also wanted me to ask about bottle fed babies. This was our first plan. We were going to buy a bottle fed Holstein and buy the milk from our neighbor who raises Holsteins for $2 gallon. He was telling us it would be cheaper for us to buy Milk Replacer. We are curious, how much would the average cost be to raise a bottle fed calf with milk replacer? Our local Tractor Supply store sells a 25lb bag for $37. How much of this would they go through in 8-12 weeks?

That's part of the reason I said that buying a cow that's already being milked is so much easier for a beginner milker. I've read stories about people getting kicked right smartly by unruly cows. I did see a picture of how to build a "cow stall" where you could reach through the boards to milk, but the boards kept you relatively safe from flying feet. It was a really good idea. But at any rate, young cows you can get them used to it by handling them A LOT. Even brushing and handling their udder even when they're dry so that she gets used to being touched down there. And then when it comes time to milk.................you just have to be quick.

On the milk replacer.....that's a toss up for me. I'd almost rather go with the actual raw cow milk even if it costs more as I would think there's less chance of scours. On the milk replacer, at first a bag will last quite some time, but the bigger they get, the more milk they go through. I don't remember how many quarts that bag makes, but it's not as much as you'd think. Plus if the calf gets scours you have to add in all that cost too of all the stuff for them to keep from getting dehydrated. It can be really frustrating for newbies to raise bottle calves as they do get scours really really easy and go down fast. This year was our 3rd time raising bottle calves and the first time we didn't lose any. It's really important that whoever you buy them from gave them colostrum and then switching milks on them can be a real headache too.

[6e]

Originally Posted by gone-a-milkin

LOL! That is the truth! especially with a jiggy little first freshener with teeny tiny titties.

I have an older cow with tough teats and I was not prepared for what was set before me. LOL I was used to those soft little balloon like goat teats and going from that to a cow. Heaven have mercy my arms ached after that first day and I had to be fast as she ate quicker than the goats and I had 4 teats to go through instead of 2. LOL

[agmantoo]

Your plans on feeding sheltering the animal also enter into the decision making. Please elaborate on how you plan on meeting the food and shelter needs of the cow. Beef and dairy do have different needs.

[Cliff]

Jersey meat is among the best there is imo, rivalled only by Dexter meat. I'd even say the jersey is a little better if pressed.
Angus meat is fine, just nothing special.