7 weeks~ opinions?

[Cheryl aka JM]

Well~ for those that recall~ when I went to buy these calves I thought I was going to purchase calves that were "Close to weaning." When I got there I realized they were only a few days old and should have turned them down........but I bought them anyway. THEN I realized they were sick........scours and pneumonia.....lots of antibiotics......tube feeding........boluses......more antibiotics......more tube feeding......lots of worry and regret ..........more than one night spent believing this one or that one would be dead by morning...................

I've had them for seven weeks yesterday and they ARE getting bigger and stronger!
yesterday:


Better pic of the boys having dinner tonight (their banded testicles finally came off last week.......though one I had to help by cutting them per the vets instruction so they are both steers now). Boys names are "Burger King" in the green halter and Sofa King (cuz aint that pelt gonna look great on my sofa in a couple years?) the holstien.


And the girls at their dinner tonight~ Girls names are "Bessie" in the red halter and "Bossie" in the blue halter:


So~ finally to my questions. Since I brought them home and thought they would die every 5 minutes I've been keeping them in the turkey pen that is right up against the house so I could watch them more carefully. I'd like to move them to the pasture I had originally planned for them that is a bit further from the house (but not so far that I couldn't see them most of the time). The pro's and con's are:

In the Turkey Pen:
Pro:
I can see them all the time
They are literally right up against the house
They are used to it as they have been in it for the last 7 weeks
Con:
They are right up against the house and cow poop attracts a lot of flies
I'm pretty sure I've lost some turkey poults to flying hooves when playing
The turkey house was not built with cows in mind........the space is a problem
Bossy has begun eating turkey starter on a regular basis........Baby turkeys are eating calf starter on a regular basis
No shade to speak of for a large part of the day (turkeys get under the box hedges......but the cows don't really fit

In the pasture
Pro:
Shelter is bigger and more appropriate to cattle
NOT right up against the house!
No access to feed intended for another animal
LOTS of shade all day long
Cons:
I can't see them all the time anymore. They couldn't get that far away~ but there are a lot of tree's and scrub in that pasture and I won't be able to see them every single time I look unless they happen to be up close to the fence line.

what do y'all think?
Move them now before it gets any hotter?
Or wait until I wean them? In what~ about 5 more weeks? (Man who sold them to me told me they would need about a bag of MR before weaning........I've already gone through 9 bags of MR between the 4 of them and I only give them 2 quarts twice a day! Between purchase price, supplies, vet visits, meds, MR and calf starter........VERY EXPENSIVE cows there!)

[Callieslamb]

Move them. I have the same issue- I want to be able to look out the window and see them all the time!

They look great no matter what they cost. Wish I had put the halter on mine before. I can't catch and hold her to do it now!!!

[Cheryl aka JM]

thanks! Thats actually why Burger King is wearing a halter AND a collar. Only the girls were wearing halters and I had a rope halter for the boys~ but Burger King was turning into a problem to get a hold of when I wanted to bring him out to feed him. He wanted to come with me~ but he wanted me to chase him before he let put the rope halter on him. So I put a dog collar on him so I could snag him easier! Then I decided it would be easier just to buy some calf halters and have everyone wear one all the time so I could just snag a halter and clip the lead to it. Of course~ they were too small for the smallest calf halters I could find.......so I had to burn new holes in the halters and there is several inches of extra hanging off for them to grow into!

[Ronney]

I had to laugh when I read about the turkey poults eating the calf feed and vice versa. It seems to be an ongoing problem for me with lambs, calves, my one and only duck and the wild Pukekoes all thinking the food is put out specifically for them.

They are fine, sleek looking calves to be proud of but they do need to get out on to pasture and fill out a little. So yes, I would be moving them very shortly especially if it is getting hot.

As to weaning, I start weaning mine at about 8 weeks but don't cold turkey, it's done on a gradual basis. With your calves, I would give them a week on so on good pasture and then start cutting back on the morning feed, lowering it every couple of days and when that was down to one quart, start doing the same with the evening feed. Keep on feeding calf meal and do it straight after they've had their milk - and then one morning they just get calf meal and won't even notice there was no milk.

Cheers,
Ronnie

[gone-a-milkin]

Yay! They look good. I agree with Ronney that you should move them. You can always go out there every hour and check on them.

Plenty of folks wean at 8 weeks. Ronney's advice there is pretty much what I do also.

Good job with these 4. You haven't lost ANY! (knock on wood).

[Jennifer L.]

They look great! And I agree with everyone else, they are good to go on pasture.

Jennifer

[mary,tx]

I'm impressed you pulled them through. Congratulations!

Where did you buy the calf halters?

[mary,tx]

As long as they are secure, and you have taught them to come when called, I'd put them in the pasture and get them away from the house. jmo.
My two are in a field out behind the barn. Twice a day is enough for me to see them. They come when I call them and I can check them over then.

[Cheryl aka JM]

I got the halters online at Jeffers. They are the smallest cow halters they had~ 250-450lbs and were too big. So I burned some extra holes in the neck strap and they fit now......and will fit when they grow into them too!

Thanks so much for the advice everyone. The last couple days I've had them out in that pasture during the heat of the day and been bringing them back up to the turkey pen for over night~ but I think tonight I'll leave them in the big pasture. I got up this morning and all four calves~ and the two goats I have quarantining in there (somewhere my regular goats will never be allowed to go~ thats why I'm using it for quarantining goats)~ anyway......all 6 of them were crammed in the turkey barn fighting over the little turkey starter pail! So I think the calves just don't need to be in that pen anymore........and the goats can quarantine in the old pig pen (the new goats can't go to the pasture where the calves are yet since my goats may be rotated into that pasture for brush control)

[topside1]

Cheryl sorry I'm late for the party. You have done an excellent job, plus learned goobs about the dos and don't of bottle calves...Just a fine outcome. What's with the halters, you can't tell them apart so now their color coded....Kidding of course, I buy pony halters for my calves, works great but only for a limited time....Congrats, Topside

[Cheryl aka JM]

Actually~ it did start as a way to tell them apart. I put sheep halters on the two girls and we called them "Blue" and "Red" until we thought up names for them. Now I can tell them apart by just looking at them~ but no one else here can (I do all the work with them) so when I bought them the calf halters I still made sure to get Bessie a red halter and Bossy a blue one!

Thanks for all the advice everyone! I've now moved them full time into the new pasture and they seem to still be doing well. It will be 8 weeks that I've had them tomorrow. They are really going through the calf starter now~ I put out 8 pounds in the morning and 8 pounds of it at night and it seems they are eating most of it before the chickens get in there and clean up whats left (so far the chickens are not too sure those are not dogs.......so they're not trying to eat the calf starter until the calves step away from the feeders!) I think I'm going to start lowering how much MR they get in the morning and start working towards weaning. I'm excited at the prospect of stopping that chore pretty soon!

[Cheryl aka JM]

Update~
We are working on weaning faster than I planned. I took new pics of them Monday~ and I’m sure they have gained quite a lot of weight in just the 10 days since the previous pics I posted. All was going great~ I took these pics~ then I gave them their vaccine booster shots. On the way back to the barn for some calf starter Sofa (the holstien) didn’t want to come with me so I was tugging pretty hard on his halter. Suddenly he shot forward~ knocked me down and stepped on my ankle. Hurt like crazy but luckily nothing seems to be broken. The next morning ~ Tuesday~ my ankle was swollen pretty good so I was limping and all four calves were limping and refusing to walk easy on the hip where the vaccines had been given. There was no way I could drag limping calves all the way across the pasture, across the yard to the bottle buckets. I had a hard enough time dragging them to the barn! So I mixed up the MR and put it in some dog food dishes in the barn with them. Sofa (the holstien) and Bessie (red halter) got the idea right away and sucked up their share of the MR and went for the rest. I didn’t want them to scour so I took them out of the barn and left Burger (green halter) and Bossie (Blue halter) with the dish of MR for about an hour. They never “Got it” and didn’t have any no matter how I tried to tempt them. Same thing at evening feeding and on Wednesday morning. By last night all of us were walking better and I could have taken them to the bottle buckets…..but I figured I was already half way there to weaning them and I was worried that Sofa (holstien) and Bessie (red halter) would get too much of the MR and scour themselves if I didn’t pay close enough attention. So I just didn’t offer any MR last night at all~ just the calf starter pellets. There was some bawling about this~ and this morning they were definitely bawling for me~ but again I just gave them calf starter pellets.

So what do y’all think? I’ve had them for 9 weeks today and I do still have a bit over ½ a bag of MR I could be offering to them (but the calf starter pellets are SO much easier!) Should I Stick to just offering the calf starter pellets and call them weaned~ or go back to offering MR in dishes for a few days then cut them off completely~ or the calves are too small yet start taking them back down to the bottle buckets for another few weeks?

Bessie last Monday


Bossie last Monday


Burger last Monday


Sofa last Monday

[Callieslamb]

They are looking great! Sorry about your ankle.

[Curtis B]

Hey, looking at you pictures got me thinking since I have the same feeding buckets. I picked up my two calfs last Sat, and they were 15 and 12 days old. They were already drinking out of the bucket, not the nippple. Is that bad, or good for me time wise.

[Cheryl aka JM]

I don't know if it's good or bad.......but I bet it's a lot easier! I thought they needed the sucking action so they made more saliva and helped them digest prior to the development of the rumen........so my GUESS would be if they are that young that you may want to put them on the buckets with nipples for a while. Thats really a pain in the neck though~ they really head butt those buckets~ tear up the buckets~ spill the MR~ make a mess! So maybe you should start a new thread with a title that lets people know your question and see what people who actually KNOW what they are doing think.

[Cliff]

I would worry about them being out in the pasture with halters on. But then I always tend to think the worst thing that could happen will
Maybe now that you're feeding them pellets you can teach them to follow you in by shaking the pellets in a can or something. They won't forget how to lead, and you could put the halters on in the barnyard to practice.
They do look great btw. They'll probably lose a little weight if you go ahead and wean them so abruptly, but at this point I'd probably do the same thing.
Congrats on keeping them all alive. Bottle babies are such a pia, trying to die all the time. So frustrating, but so rewarding if you can get them through alive.

[dbarjacres]

Great looking calves, especially w/ the troubles you had!

Most dairy raisers I know of wean at 6-7 weeks on dairy calves.

Definately get them out in the big pasture!

[gone-a-milkin]

Call them weaned and do a happy dance!
I doubt they will lose too much weight.

Curtis, a lot of people put their calves on buckets at a week old, or even less. I know it is not 'natural' according to some folks, but I have seen plenty of successes with this method. Maybe their rate of gain isn't quite as good, but the difference is negligible...in my opinion only.

I think that if they are already bucket babies, then going back to nipples would be...well, I wouldn't bother.

Good luck with them.

[Cheryl aka JM]

I can't tell you all how much I appreciate your holding my hand through this! I've always wanted to do this~ and y'all have been MUCH more help than my vet (who is a great guy and is willing to help.....but he's so busy and I feel like I'm wasting his time when I ask the "could be a dumb question questions" When they came down with the pneumonia I wasn't even sure they were sick~ I posted here and y'all made sure I was watching extra careful for specific symptoms to follow the "droopy calf" post~ y'all are the reason they got medicated so fast and got better so fast. You are ALL great.....And helping me with the weaning~ and to understand what a healthy calf looks like and acts like.........

THANK YOU SO MUCH!!
I may have been here doing the work~ but y'all are the reason all 4 are still alive!

[topside1]

Cheryl don't be surprised, soon I'll be calling on you for advice. If anyone thinks that raising bottle babies is easy, well enough said because it isn't.......Great job...Topside