major weaning snafu - help!

[Hexe]

ANY and ALL suggestions and thoughts on this will be greatly appreciated:

I have two cows (one bred and due sometime in April, the other one is open) and a first time heifer, due on 4/8/09. In with these three are two steers, born 6/09. In an attempt to wean the steers I seperated and kept them in a box stall for 10 days and then had to let them back in with their mothers (Had to use the box stall for an injured critter). One steer never went back to nursing, the other one did almost immidiately, with a vengance. The steer that is still nursing belongs to the cow that's open. Since she does not have to conserve her milk for a new baby - no sweat. This was 3-4 weeks ago. About an hour ago I happened to see that same steer attempt to nurse on the first time heifer. And she let him! I didn't know that was possible, since she's barely bagged up. Now I'm rotating, because he's going to be nursing out all her colostrum. What do I do? I can keep her in a stall, until she's calved and hope he won't try it again, I can keep him in a stall and hope for the same result, but I won't be able to keep them seperated permanently and I can't process him yet either.
I checked out weaning rings online, but they seem to be just a "aid" to help with weaning before you permanently seperate cow and calve and that can't happen here due to practicality issues. Meaning it's not practical/possible to seperate the steers permanently.
I was thinking of making him a "weaning" halter, something with spikes across the noseband to make both his mother and the heifer kick the snot right out of him. My dh is a welder/fabricator and can make me anything that I can describe. Any ideas?

[gone-a-milkin]

Why is it not possible to separate the steers?

I am guessing he will keep nursing on any cow that will let him as long as he is with them. Those different contraptions may help, but none are really foolproof, IMO.

[genebo]

I had a cow that self-weaned her heifer calf about halfway through her next pregnancy. Then, just before giving birth, the cow sought out the heifer to nurse. It ended with the birth, and neither the cow nor her new bull calf suffered.

My guess is the rapidly swelling udder wasn't comfortable and she wanted some relief.

Genebo
Paradise Farm

[randiliana]

My suggestion is to find some way to separate them. Stall him, build another pen or sell him. Heifers are stupid, most will let anything suck them.

Genebo, you got lucky, that your bull calf didn't suffer for his momma having been sucked prior to calving. She would have lost most of her colostrum. A heifers colostrum isn't the greatest (compared to a cow's), to begin with so Hexe is right to be concened.

Usually once a weaned calf goes back to sucking, nothing will stop them. If another animal will let them, they will continue to suck for as long as you keep them around.

10 days really isn't enough time to expect them to be weaned. Most suggest 6-8 weeks before putting calves back in with their mamas, and a lot of us don't put them back until either breeding season, or around the time the heifers are expected to calve.

[Hexe]

"Heifers are stupid, most will let anything suck them."

Unless of course you want them to accept a drop-calf or actually milk them. That's a whole other story from what I understand.

Thank you for your response. I think I will put the heifer in the stall tonight and put her on "bed rest" for the rest of her pregnancy. I'm hoping she'll get more gumption once she has her calf and starts bumping off the steer.

[wwubben]

If you can not permanently separate them you are not set up for cattle raising.The heifer he has been sucking will probably have mastitis and life long bag problems.You have to keep the weaned calves separate.

[randiliana]

Heifers are the easiest to get to accept another calf. Some will take one without a fight, some might need hobbles for a couple days. But it is the rare heifer that puts up a big fight. Try a cow, and see what I mean. As for milking, well, unless she is used to being handled she will kick and fight when you put your hands on her.

I wouldn't bank on the idea that once she calves she will start to kick him off. They just don't know any better. We calve heifers out this year, and it is just a bunch of confusion when you have a bunch of them together. You have calves sucking everything. Some will have 3 on them at any given time, and none may even be her own.

I wouldn't go as far as wwubben and say that she WILL get mastitis and have life long bag problems. It could happen, but is no more likely to happen because she was sucked before calving than it would happen after she calves.

But wwuben is right, you have to find a way to keep your weaned calves separated for at least a couple months. You are lucky that they didn't BOTH go back to sucking.

[Jackie]

You need to build another pen. Get some panels, some hotwire, or something. How can you raise cattle with only one pen?

[copperhead46]

Is it possible to put the calve back up?? 10 days isn't long enough to wean a calf, it takes at least 30 days and usually more. I have that problem all the time with my Dexters, they will let any calf suck. I have seen my oldest cow standing there with 3 calves sucking, she just doesn't care!! I wouldn't want the heifer to be letting the calf suck for now, and for a few days after she calves. After that he might sneak some milk, but only when the other calf is nursing, too. She should just produce more milk, if they are both nursing, so it shouldn't be a real problem. I know in a perfect world we would all have lots of pens and corrals and lots of good ways of seperating cattle, but....thats just not the way it is, here in the real world. good luck with them....
As for the mastitis thing, don't worry about that. The calf nursing her won't cause it, I have an old cow with mastitis, gets it every year right before she calves and we have to milk her down, or her bag is so sore she won't let her new calf nurse.
P.J.

[gone-a-milkin]

A calf that nurses on multiple cows can spread the mastitis from one to the other though.