old pastures made new?

[mommahen2four]

Our farm hasn't been used in decades. The fields look like native prairies with a mix of wild flowers and scrub. How do I make it into a good pasture/hay field? I'd prefer to not till. Is there a way to mow or burn and then broadcast seed? or something like that? And, what to plant in N. WI? Thanks!

[KSALguy]

native grass and wild flowers are actually a fairly healthy good pasture and hay feild, what exactly are you wanting? if you cut or burn the old growth off the new grass will be some of the best you can have if its truely a prairie grass,

the native grass land is in such decline anyway if you have some KEEP IT, alot of Kansas is still trying to re establish the native grass land,

[francismilker]

Here's a link you might find interesting:
Grass Fed Beef Pasture and Harvest Time

If you have the equipment and financial means, you may want to use conventional sprays and fertilizers. Otherwise, you can go to your local ag extension agent and set up a time with him to tour you place to get advice on good pasture management. Cattle will graze on quite a few different varieties of native grasses and wildflowers depending upon there maturity level.
Being a novice on the subject, my advice would be to do a controlled burn on it if possible. This does a pretty good job of clearing out some of the undergrowth from longterm idle ground.

[genebo]

Cattle will thrive on native grasses, usually. Get a good list of toxic plants with pictures and do a walkover of the pasture. If none are found, you're ready to start.

Get soil tests and correct any imbalances. Overseed if you'd like, but no introduced pasture grass is going to flourish like the plants that competed for their place in the pasture.

Cattle will gladly graze on just about everything you have growing there. Anything that is left standing after they've fed on it can be bush hogged or treated with a tall grass wick type applicator for weed killer.





Genebo
Paradise Farm

[haypoint]

Good pastures without tilling the soil? Too late to use a herbacide on it this fall in N.WI. I'd try burning it now. Just make sure there is a fire-break around it. You won't be thought of as a good neighbor if your pasture fire runs thru the community.
Get a soil test. But remember, it is harder to get fertilizer into the soil without tilling. Soil PH is a major factor, too. Broadcasting lime will fix that, but you need to know how much to spread. Fert. over lime, not lime over fert.
In the spring, once the weeds and grasses have come to life, give it all a shot of Roundup. Wait a few weeks for the new weeds to germinate, then hit it again. If you drill oats, clover, timothy by mid-June, you should still get the oats harvested and the pasture should be full of clover and timothy. If your soil Ph is too acid and you can't afford lime, Birdsfoot trefoil will grow and spread. Cattle thrive on that.
Soil type is as much a factor as your location. Is it nearly swampy or well drained?

[agmantoo]

Never till! The best soil on the place is on top. That is where the new seed need to establish. I never plan on plowing or breaking the ground again unless it is to level or smooth the ground. Plowing will also bring the dormant weed seed to the top to where they will germinate. We want to keep the undesirable plants suppressed.

[ksfarmer]

Originally Posted by mommahen2four

Our farm hasn't been used in decades. The fields look like native prairies with a mix of wild flowers and scrub. How do I make it into a good pasture/hay field? I'd prefer to not till. Is there a way to mow or burn and then broadcast seed? or something like that? And, what to plant in N. WI? Thanks!

If it is indeed native prairie, please don't burn now! This will leave the grasses open to winter kill from freezing, and can cause severe erosion. Burning should be done in the spring at the time the grasses are ready to start growing and quickly protect the soil. I'm not real familiar with N.Wisc. but its real hard to beat native grasses anywhere for grazing purposes.
You could also do some spraying to control the scrub, but that will also take out a lot of the wild flowers. Genebo's post gives some real good advice.

[unioncreek]

If it is native grasses and there is plenty of it, and you have plenty of ground I would buy a couple of calves and put them on there over the winter.

Bob

[mommahen2four]

Yeah, I'm with you all on wanting to go with the native and not against it, but the fields are pretty sparse and I need to improve them somehow. Also, I'd like to be able to put up something for the winter months instead of always buying it and this sparse stuff definately won't cut it. I guess maybe I need to run some cattle on in to improve it first...?!?!

[Karin L]

YES! Put some cattle on there, native grasses are historically and ecologically meant to thrive on grazing, historically, by the bison that once populated the landscape you live on. You might consider doing some rotational grazing, as this will help different parts of the pasture to rest while others are being grazed. Just keep an eye out for poisonous plants, and if there are any, spot-spray them if it's a smallish area and keep the livestock out of the area you sprayed for the dictated period of time.

Good luck.

[genebo]

To fill in sparse grasses, you might consider no-till drilling the pasture with a cool season grass (like fescue), a warm season grass (like orchard grass) and some wheat.

The wheat will grow to about 4" tall by cold weather and then stay that height during the winter, growong roots. The roots of wheat can go as deep as 3 feet, looking for water.

In the spring, the wheat will suddenly start to grow. You can hay it or graze it. It's an annual and either haying or grazing is the end of it. Once it dies, the roots rot, leaving little tubes in the soil for water to flow through.

Next July, the fields that had wheat on them during the winter will stay greener during a drought because of the water tubes in the ground.

Genebo
Paradise Farm

[KSALguy]

if you truely have prairie grass, put a few head of cattle on it this fall and then burn it off real good in the spring, this will free up alot of nutrients locked up in the old growth that is preventing the grasses from doing well, especially sence the land has been untended for so long with not even a decent grazing, Prairie grass thrive off good grazeing and burning practices, it keeps things going,

if you DO have prairie grass please dont plant something that will out compeat them that is the major problem all over the Prairie lands, once they get back up to par you wont have need of anything else, you can graze it and cut it, it makes great hay, and if you get enough rain you can get a couple cuttings if your not also grazing

[Up North]

Having farmed most of my life in Northern Wisconsin (Bayfield County) I can see where advice and strategies for other areas of the country may not fit your needs at your location. If your land is located north of Highway 8, for example, you most likely do not have what most folks would call native grasses or prairie grasses.
The soils in that region, in almost all cases, would benefit from the addition of lime. Unless you are willing to soil test and adjust by adding lime on a regular basis, it would be unwise to attempt the growing of alfalfa.

Red clover, white clover, and Birdsfoot Trefoil would do well on those soils.
The clovers can be frost seeded in the spring. Birdsfoot Trefoil would do better if seeded when soils are warmer, for example between may 20th and August 20th. Timothy and brome are grass species which would do well and improve hay/feed quality in that area.

IMO the most dramatic and optimum results would be achieved by doing complete tillage of the land and planting a mix of the above species along with a cover crop of cereal grains. The cover crop would discourage competition from weeds and allow the new seedlings to get established that first year.

If you choose not to do tillage, then start by removing any brush or tree saplings by cutting them. Mow field to cut down any weeds. Then frost seed clovers in the spring.

[Up North]

Is your soil Red Clay or Sand?

[mommahen2four]

Clay! Yeah, I should've mentioned that right off, huh?!? Does that change opinions here?

[agmantoo]

Clay is fine with me as that is what I am accustomed to working. In areas subject to drought and not having irrigation I actually prefer the red clay. Worked properly, red clay can be productive but may require higher inputs thus more expense.

[Up North]

For red clay my advice stands as given. Don't you love how your boots can weigh about 50 pounds each when you walk through that pure red clay in the spring ?, LOL.
Many early pioneer families that tried to establish farms on the sand just plain starved to death. There's a reason The Chequamagon National Forest was never broke out for farm ground.
It's good for growing Pine Trees and Wild Blueberries though.

[agmantoo]

Up North,
You have farmed closer to where the posters lives so you know the area. The breaking up the clay to plant is an area we differ and I want to share my experience and to promote a different view. I live where brick making thrives so we have lots of clay. The worlds largest manufacturer of brick making machinery is nearby. We also differ in climate and terrain. You probably have more topsoil than us. With our long growing season our clays soils are somewhat depleted and with our terrain we can have tremendous erosion. Your yields with less inputs are greater than what we have as a result. We also seem to get hit with more droughts. Working the soil here is an invitation for lower yields as moisture is lost and what topsoil when have is eroded. Nearly all crops are planted mintill or notill with notill used on the bulk of the acreage. My largest field that is leased for silage production has not been turned in over 10 years, it is notill planted twice per year as we double crop. The productivity has continued to increase in those years with no increase in added amendments. As time changes and new terms surface I continue to read regarding the carbon layer I become more convinced not to turn the soil. For years as I cleared land for production I could not understand why it took me so long to get the new ground into production regardless of what I applied. I have come to believe it is from the destruction of the carbon layer and the time required for it to rebuild. The last land that was converted from trees to pasture has rebounded faster than any land I converted even though we have been in an extended drought. I did a minimal amount of preparation after removing the stumps in an attempt to reduce the destruction of the carbon layer. The newly planted seed did manage to sprout and to hold on for 2 years of severe drought. Yes I did have some bare spots and I did have some erosion. However, now that we have had some rain the new pasture grasses are going strong. I was there at the converted land yesterday and I could hardly believe the recovery. In another place where I installed a grass waterway I worked the soil in order to get the waterway contoured and I hardly have a stand of grass and what grass is there appears to have stagnated. The weeds that have grown in the waterway also look stunted. These differences between your place and mine could be a result in the differences in climate and the nutrient level of the soils. For the southeast, we need to switch to the no disturbance methods as we tried the turning methods years ago and we nearly perished. My concentrations henceforth will be on building the carbon layer and leaving it alone.

[mommahen2four]

Thanks, everybody! I love hearing the many different perspectives and ideas from this diverse group of folk!!! You guys are awesome...