First one's gonna be gone soon...

[Karin L]

Tomorrow is not gonna be a good day. We already have a calf down with symptoms of pneumonia, and he's been like that for more than a week now. There's about half a dozen others in the barn with him that have the similar lung virus, but they're getting better everyday, so I'm not worried about them.

Last week this calf (RWF) was always the first to lie down, often without chewing his cud, but he'd always get up immediately if I got too close to him. He drank a lot, but I didn't see him eat much.

This weekend, he's worse; yesterday it was kinda hard to get him up, and he was too weak to bunt or try to defend himself. Today, Dad got him in the squeeze to needle him (gave him some LA200 (Oxyvet) and Micotil), but couldn't stand and went down almost immediately, he was so weak (his breathing is laboured too, in grunts) And the calf's ears were frozen stiff, he was lacking in circulation. So he (dad) went and put a halogen light on him (500W) and a propane heater, to get his ears thawed out and try and get some circulation going.

We kept him in the squeeze for a bit, gave him a bucket of water and put some hay in front of him (didn't even touch it, though he did drink the water) then after me and mom and dad had finished putting the cabover on the 7240 tractor, we tried to get him up, couldn't (after a good five minutes of fruitless effort), so we doubled up some rope on one of the calf's front legs, and bodily pulled him out of the squeeze. He got up very breifly, but went down right away, probably 'cause his legs were frozen too.

We didn't want to pull that calf all the way over to the pile of straw where the other calves were, so me an dad went and scooped up a few forkfuls of straw, put it around him, then man-handled him to get some straw underneath, at least to keep him off the freezingly cold snow.

{sigh} Then we put a couple of halogen lights on him, and a tarp over him like a blanket to insulate him and keep the cold out and the warmth in.

We're keeping an eye on him as I speak, but there's no real hope that he'll make it through the night. And if he passes on, this'll count as the first calf we lost in this year's bunch.

[wr]

I'm sorry you're fighting pneumonia. I find with our cold that Nuflor gives better results than micotil or LA. It seems that the cold compounds the pneumonia and they erode so quickly that I don't get quick enough results with the other drugs to win and find the Nuflor to be a wonder drug. I hope things improve for you soon, I hate fighting weather, everything seems to go wrong.

[needstoknowmore]

I am so sorry! The weather has been something this year!! It has been very hard on the animals!

[Karin L]

Originally Posted by wr

I'm sorry you're fighting pneumonia. I find with our cold that Nuflor gives better results than micotil or LA. It seems that the cold compounds the pneumonia and they erode so quickly that I don't get quick enough results with the other drugs to win and find the Nuflor to be a wonder drug. I hope things improve for you soon, I hate fighting weather, everything seems to go wrong.

I didn't know that about Nuflor. Micotil's worked in the past, but we've never had any experience with Nuflor (don't think Dad's heard of it either). Well, if you say that Nuflor's more effective than Micotil, I might have to take your word for it and try it out.

Update: calf still lying in his little cocoon, dad put a loader-bucket full of fresh straw around him to keep him warm and cozy, and I think he's gonna turn the halogen lights off for the night (don't want to "waste" any light energy, nor let them run in risk of fire). We'll see what the morning'll bring, so I'll update everyone on that.

[JeffNY]

I would use nuflor, anything else doesn't seem to work as well. Our vet cost us a bit much once with treating 4 Jerseys with pneumonia. One of which became very ill. Actually she almost died. Well finally he gave them all a shot of nuflor, and they came around. The one that almost died has since calved, and exhibits no signs she had pneumonia that bad.


I would use nuflor over anything else. If he is still kicking, get some nuflor and give it a shot.


Jeff

[tinknal]

Once they get to this point they rarely recover, even if they survive.

[Karin L]

I posted this on another cattle forum, and got the same replies about using Nuflor.

Calf is still alive, but I think his life is hanging by a thread. He was sleeping when I got near him to check on him, and he's still nestled in his little bed of straw. Hasn't moved much since yesterday, but he's still drinking.

I think I'm gonna try to convince Dad to try the Nuflor over the Micotil. I hope it won't be too late.

[Karin L]

I think there's still hope yet, everyone.

I went out again to check up on him, and showed signs of wanting to get up, only breifly. His head's up, and he's drinking a little bit, but hasn't touched the hay much. Dad tells me that the Micotil's the stuff that's keeping him alive. Maybe. I said it could also be the fact that we're keeping him warm and sheltered as much as possible that's also helping him stay alive.

Gave Dad the info on the Nuflor, and he phoned up one of the vet clinics (there's two in town), and found that the Nuflor might be a sight better than using Mic., but they vets there wouldn't fill out a perscription for him because he was getting his drugs from the other vet (these two vets have had hard feelings towards each other in the past over some difficulties, mostly political-related, so to speak. ) So Dad ordered some dexomethozon (can't remember the other name of this) to try on the sick one. He's gonna call Illia (the other vet that we frequently see more often than the other ones in town) to see if he carries Nuflor.

If yall say that the Nuflor'll do the trick, then I'm gonna have to take your word for it.

[wr]

Nuflor came to be recognized a couple of years ago (in Alberta) and I happened on it when we had such bad drought conditions and many were fighting dust pneumonia. Being a bit of a skeptic, I refused to invest in a bottle but took two syringe doses home to try. I used them on a calf that was nearly dead with the intent on using the second dose as required and by the time of the second dose (I think it's recomended 48 hours later) I couldn't catch up with the little critter to administer.

[JeffNY]

Generally it is 96 hours after the first shot. Ya know its funny with vets, they love a ----ing contest. We have a vet that gets very jelous because we use someone else. He isn't the only vet, and doesn't seem to understand that. But what I would say to a vet office that wouldn't give me a dose of something, because of dealt with another. I would say "So your going to be responsible for not saving this calfs life, because you wont sign me a prescription, because I deal with another vet clinic?". Guarentee you would get a good response then .


Jeff

[wr]

I'd take Jeff's word on the second dose because I'm at work and can't confirm my facts.

[Karin L]

Well, he didn't make it, mom said he must've died sometime in the night, cause when she checked first thing in the morning, he was already a gonner, so there was no need to give him that dexamethasone. (Dad had taken me to the city at the time because I had to write my last final exam, so he couldn't do the nursing.)

He was thin from not eating, and of course I learned in school that the rumen shuts down after four days of no food, which obviously means that it would've been too late even if we tried to tube-feed him. He wasn't that big either, probably only 400 lbs or less.

Thanks for your help everyone, it's much appretiated--I learned alot, and so did Dad...still, it's painful to loose one, though we were expecting him to be gone yesterday.

Oh well, it's all part of being in the cattle business I guess...

Thanks again folks.

[wr]

I'm sorry it didn't work well for you. If I'm understanding you correctly, these are weanlings that you're having problems with? I recall that they were purchased recently. I hope you have no further problems but would recomend grabbing a small bottle of nuflor & perhaps some vitamins or a protein supplement. My reason is that we had a funny hay year - some got more water than it needed and others not so much so your calves might have come from a region that is deficient and might need a bit of a boost. Have you had your hay tested?

[Karin L]

No, I don't think so. But there is a mineral salt block out for them which they're eager to lick up.

It's just a few that have the snotty noses, the rest are all pretty healthy.

[Goat Freak]

My goodness, I'm SO sorry, I hope that the rest of your little ones will be just fine. Good luck. Bye.

[wr]

Karin, a couple of things to consider is that your part of the province is low selenium or selenium deficient, which does not cause pneumonia but could cause some problems at some point in time. They may need a bit of a boost via protein and you could likely use a red block (selenium) & possibly a parasite treatment. Right now, you are somewhat at the mercy of how they were looked after prior to them coming to your place and that bites.

[Karin L]

It's probably the selenium deficiency that's the most to worry about. The parasites aren't much of a problem, as we do look for that too. The whole herd has to be run through to get their booster shots soon.

I dunno why Dad doesn't get the red blocks. I'm gonna have to ask him...the alfalfa hay has protein enough to give them good protein, though unless you're taking about another type of protein. We give them the blue blocks with Cobalt (and I'm sure there's selenium in there too), and the calves sure like the stuff....I doubt if the previous owners even gave them mineral salt.
Well, I think they were looked after pretty well prior to coming to the farm, and they are now, 'cause we keep keeping an eye out for runny noses, coughs, and any other abnormal behaviour that says they're sick. We will be at the mercy of that yes, but not after they've been sent through again and put on some silage and good second-cutting hay.
I'm gonna bug Dad agin about getting the Nuflor for the other calves, because I know that'll help them heal up quicker.

[wr]

If your hay has good protein, you should be fine. It's funny, your part of the province uses a lot more silage than we see down here (it's most common in feedlots). I've purchased cattle from the more northern part of the province and when they go from silage to hay, they tend take a full year before they don't look like crap. It seems to take the full feed cycle for them to readjust.

[Karin L]

Yeah, feedlots do have they're silage, but it's more "specalized" to fatten the cattle up quicker than the stuff that we have, probably because they add protein and fat supplements to the grain and hay-silage mix.

We feed the same type of barley silage as they do though, and I've seen a lot of farms around here that have their own silage pits to feed...I don't recall not seeing one farm without silage pit in their yard. Guess it's got something to do with the climate that you don't really need your own silage where you are.