Ozarks

Alice In TX/MO · #21 08/16/05, 04:53 PM

Corgitails...how is the land acquisition going? I'll be back in a couple of weeks. Have to go to California to babysit the grandson first.

Around our part of the Ozarks, if you buy a piece of land and DON'T cut it up into five acre parcels, you are pretty popular. Most folks I have met are glad I bought the place and am fixing it up. I have owned it about three years now, and I go to the local auctions and stuff. It also helps to know folks who have lived there longer and can show you around and introduce you.

Maybe the area about BeesNBunnies has had a bad experience with newcomers and are hesitant to get to know anyone until they have 'set a spell.'

Corgitails · #22 08/16/05, 04:58 PM

Rose: Going well- got the contract back yesterday. Just waiting to close.

Am VERY excited.

Cait

moodcouple · #23 08/16/05, 05:05 PM

We are also new residents of the Mt. View area. We moved here because of the beauty of the mountains and the friendliness of the residents – and have not been disappointed by either.

Were fortunate to get property where the former resident had gardened many years. She got most of the rocks out of the garden area – I found that out the first time I mowed and discovered where she had piled them. Digging any kind of hole is an adventure – they don’t call this Stone County for nothing.

We live up a “dirt” road. A month after arriving my DW had to get new tires for her pickup. She was told that if she got 10 ply they should last a year or so, that Stone County thing again. Also was told that she shouldn’t hit more than one or two deer each year on the mountain road.

Ticks are no bigger problem than they were in Nebraska – but the chiggers are awful. Mean little buggers.

DW got a job right away - $6.00 an hour, 12 hours a week. I haven’t seriously looked yet, but that’s why we are going into this move debt free.

All in all, can’t think of more than one or two places in the world I’d rather live – and can’t afford them.

EasyDay · #24 08/16/05, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rose

Most folks I have met are glad I bought the place and am fixing it up.

I think you're right on with that, Rose. Our closest neighbor, William, (God rest his soul) didn't even realize that his brother, Bob, had sold his 1/2 of the "family farm" until he saw me at the house one day and ask what I was doing there. (I'd already owned it for 2 yrs by then, but hadn't started work on it yet.) I sure didn't want to get in the middle of some family feud.

But, all turned out well when we told William that we were fixin up the old house that he'd built for his Ma. Then, each time we were there working on it, he'd walk around inside and say, "Yep, ya'll are givin' her just what she needed." (meaning the house). He was very proud of his workmanship in building it, and happy that we were fixin it up instead of tearing it down. And.... word spreads QUICK in them hills about what kind a folk ya are. So make sure that what they're spreadin' doesn't smell bad, you know?

EasyDay · #25 08/16/05, 06:08 PM

Hey, Moodcouple... we missed you 4th of July!

Ozark-Dew · #26 08/16/05, 06:50 PM

bees
actually I would have been glad to have the heads up you are giving. I am in the MO Ozarks and while I stated the folks are friendly I guess it is a kind of distant friendliness. We've been here nearing 5 years and really do not have anyone we can call our friends. (then again, we like our privacy) We have a lot of aquaintances and those we come across are quite pleasant. However, we do not belong to any social clubs and we go to Church 130 miles away. (our choice) It has also taken DH these 5 years to get employment in the town we reside, up till a short while ago he was having to travel 65 miles (sometimes further) for work. (not big bucks work either, mind you)

We also have to travel for our child's doctor appts and hospital stays due to complications from snake bite...the least we travel one way is 50 miles, next is springfield at 95 miles, then Saint Louis 130 miles and Columbia the longest trip I think it is 170 miles. But again, it was our choice to move so far in the boonies.

Most people are willing to help out, no one is stuck on the side of the highway very long without 3 or 4 asking what they can do to lend a hand.

The curtesy of drivers is good for letting you in a line of traffic...the best I've ever seen! however, tailgaters are abundant and there are more traffic accidents here than I could have ever imagined. Granted a lot of that is semi truck involved and possibly are out of staters.

We moved here because it looked a lot like home (upstate NY) but the taxes seemed to be a lot less. It is all relative, back home you made more money and could afford more taxes. Back home we were not taxed on necessities, nor were we taxed on owning vehicles or livestock. After the military sent us to the sw corner of oklahoma for 5 years, I longed for trees and bumps in the road and a curve now and again! I got it! dh is from the berkshires and I from the adirondacks....some relatives from the catskills. Yep, we sure did long for it.

shawnee · #27 08/16/05, 07:29 PM

My God you guys make Kansas sound good! Copperheads, ticks big enough to ride, fire ants, and chiggers to boot! Cheap land here but not a lot of trees in west/central parts. Good land, though. Been through Ozarks a couple times; unfortunately in the summer. Got car sick (I'm prone) and couldn't breathe (humid as all get out) but some of the most beautiful country I've ever seen. I guess there are drawbacks everywhere. Farmland in central Ks. where I am runs around 700-800 an acre. Uncle bought out my mothers land in north central for 350 an acre. Good farmland; gotta watch out for the native limestone and rock though. For jobs you have to be flexible and have something to offer. Lots of cheap little farmsteads in these small towns go for a song. More trees in the eastern part of the state and hills, too. I like hills; flat as the devil where we were. Just 25 minutes can make a big difference. Only saw l snake this year; lil pencil thin garter I nearly stepped on chasing the dog. Rattlers around here like rocky ground; none of that here. To each his own; but $5000 an acre makes me cringe. Don't want to discourage others - lots of room and cheaper ground in this country. Just gotta put your ear to the ground and do your homework!

gardentalk · #28 08/16/05, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rose

I keep threatening to bring fire ants with me from Texas to Missouri to wipe out the ticks.

At least fire ants don't carry diseases!

Ken's right about rocks. We garden above grade. Lasagna gardening in raised beds. You will have to buy some topsoil to get started.

Or, just make Mel's Mix and you're good to go (only adding compost created from your veggie waste to further improve the soil):

1/3 part Vermiculite (or Perlite)
1/3 part Humus
1/3 Cow Manure (or horse/chicken manure)

gardentalk · #29 08/16/05, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EasyDay

I think you're right on with that, Rose. Our closest neighbor, William, (God rest his soul) didn't even realize that his brother, Bob, had sold his 1/2 of the "family farm" until he saw me at the house one day and ask what I was doing there. (I'd already owned it for 2 yrs by then, but hadn't started work on it yet.) I sure didn't want to get in the middle of some family feud.

But, all turned out well when we told William that we were fixin up the old house that he'd built for his Ma. Then, each time we were there working on it, he'd walk around inside and say, "Yep, ya'll are givin' her just what she needed." (meaning the house). He was very proud of his workmanship in building it, and happy that we were fixin it up instead of tearing it down. And.... word spreads QUICK in them hills about what kind a folk ya are. So make sure that what they're spreadin' doesn't smell bad, you know?

Like your accent, but if you want a real accent head on over to eastern Kentucky.

copperhead51 · #30 08/16/05, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeesNBunnies

Land is cheap...if there are no jobs. If there are jobs you can't afford the land! When I first moved here I thought surely people were exagerating about the job situation. They were understating it! Finally sold out...at a huge loss...and moved up closer to Springfield. Found 'cheap' land at $5,000 per acre. Hubby still has almost an hour commute. Ticks and chiggers....there is no description to do this facet of ozark life justice. Friendly people.....distantly friendly yes. If you move into a small community they will not even begin to accept you until you have been there for 5 generations. If you aren't local you will be gouged....on everything....you've been warned. Crazy neighbors....OMG don't get me started! The other posters weren't kidding about the soil/gravel/boulders here. First spring I was here I fired up the tiller....engaged the tines and went flying into the air. Bounced all the way across....each time the tines came down they threw sparks off the rocks. I swear it looked like there was soil in that spot! After much sweat blood and tears I got a tiny patch tilled up...carefully raked out all rocks. Went out the next morning and there were more rocks there than before I raked it. When I was looking at places to buy this time I took a shovel with me when I was looking at land. I have a few rocks here but it is at least a managable amount....of course I'm at the very edge of the ozarks here is why I have soil(I'm technically in the ozarks plateu area). Another criteria when I was looking at land was no trees. If you buy wooded land with the idea that you can clear part of it for pasture....just don't. You can't keep ahead of the brush. You can almost hear the poison ivy and briars growing. Not exagerating about the meth labs either. This is the meth capital. I still like it here. I like the climate. Love the scenery and especially all the state parks. The land taxes are definately lower than in Texas. Lots of wildlife to look at(and fight off). Make sure you have good water if you decide to buy here. If there is any mention of a cistern.....don't walk away...RUN! A gravel road is charming in the summer. Picturesque even. In the winter you can end up snowed in for weeks(ask me how I know!). Gravel roads will eat up your tires. I figure the money I'm saving on tires now that I live on a paved road is offsetting the higher price I paid for land(I bought about 3 new sets of tires per vehicle per year). Yes I know I'm not very encouraging. Homesteaders seem to view the ozarks as some kind of earthly paradise for some reason. It's not. If you look at things from a practical perspective it is a pretty lousy place to try homesteading. No soil is a huge problem. I finally went to raised beds on my other place. For the 3 years I tried to grow a garden I never got so much as a single pea. The deer, chipmunks, coons, groundhogs, crows and God only knows what other creatures either dug up and ate the seed before it sprouted, shortly after it sprouted or just before it got ripe. One memorable spring I planted corn 5 times before I finally gave up.

You forgot to tell people how racist we are!

donsgal · #31 08/16/05, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Scharabok

Much of the Ozarks is a pile of rock, varying in height, covered with a tad of topsoil. My father lived near Mountain View, AR. He said a hole was what was left after you dug out the rocks. When you look at property check the soil depth if you plan to do any extensive gardening.

My favorite quote is "Nobody ever told me that when you buy land in the Ozarks doesn't mean that you get any dirt with it". Living in STONE county I can certainly attest to this fact.

As for the OP's original question. There are good and bad things about everywhere. The absolute BEST thing that I have found in my 19 years of living in SW Missouri is that although the people here might not be the smartest, or the trendiest or the most beautiful people on earth, they certainly are amoung the most sincere and genuine. I have yet to meet someone that was rude, or foul or mean that didn't come from "someplace" else. And people will help you here and not expect a thing in return except a "thank you". Overall, the positives outweigh the negatives by a wide margin.

donsgal

Hip_Shot_Hanna · #32 08/17/05, 01:49 AM

Well, we are now looking in the Ouachitas area as well, since it's a bit closer to family in Texas.

However, am I correct in saying that although the sales tax in Arkansas is lower than it is in Texas ... you pay tax on groceries?? Because you don't in Texas.

And property taxes depend on the county you live in, so some counties we are also looking at are not bad at all, like Comanche County.

Does Arkansas tax livestock? (I think I saw that, and I'm shocked.. lol!)

You said they tax vehicles.. well, you do have to buy road tags (license plates) each year for your vehicles, boats, trailers, etc. Does Arkansas tax on top of that?

Also, Arkansas has a state income tax, whereas Texas does not. I've never lived in a state that has income tax, though I think I read somewhere that if you pay state income tax you can deduct it from federal, is that correct?

'Pears to me that bugs aren't the only blood suckers there - I read a comparison on small town Texas to small town Arkansas.

If you make $50,000 in Arkansas, you only need $44,000 to live in Texas. I'm starting to figure out why...

Not knocking Arkansas though - still much prettier country to live in, and it may all balance out somewhere down the road.

Lived on caliche roads, so gravel isn't too shocking either, and a lot less dusty.

Saw a post that said Arkansas is extremely humid - but central Texas is too.

Don't need a high paying job, just enough to cover the taxes! lol...

Love reading all the replies - it sure helps to get a bigger picture

Jared · #33 08/18/05, 10:16 AM

Don't buy into the people all being great and nice and helpful. I've travelled all over the country and what I tell people about anywhere is this: every place is the same. The people are the same. Sometimes just different colors. Arkansas has nice people and unbelievably rude people, gays and racists, geniuses and idiots, people who will help you at every turn and people who will steal from you first chance they get. Tons of people hate drugs, but we've got a huge meth problem. Be careful where you go. I've been in parts of Arkansas that made me afraid to get out of the car, literally. A black friend told me that I was white as sunshine but that even I was too dark to be down there and he's right. Right around St. Paul and Pettigrew, if you want to know what those parts are like, watch Deliverance and Next of Kin to get an idea of how they live. (Not the part where Warren Beatty gets raped. Just the way they live in buses and shacks and shanties)

Jc05 · #34 08/18/05, 11:01 AM

Hi,
I'm new here, but I've been lurking for awhile. I live in the Ozark foothills, and there are plenty of jobs within 30 miles in several directions if your willing to drive. I drive 45 minutes to work, but its worth it.

BeesNBunnies · #35 08/18/05, 11:28 AM

Here's your chance to meet some really nice ozark folks. Check out the thread about meeting in person that has a ton of pages on it. There is going to be a homesteader get together the middle of September in northern Arkansas. These are some really great people. Even my old cranky self is going to go

Mutti · #36 08/18/05, 01:17 PM

We must be living under a lucky star 'cause when we bought our 120 acres here in so. Mo we got wonderful new friends and neighbors. Welcomed us into the neighborhood...happy to see us fixing up the old place that had been vacant for 3 years. Lots of oldtimers here but if you are willing to be a good neighbor,mind your own business,keep your dogs and stock to home and lend a hand when needed you will be respected. The only problem in our neighborhood was an "outsider" who came in here letting his hounds run free and telling folks what they should be doing....hate to say his house mysteriously burned down one nite and he went back to New York...don't think the crime was ever solved and surely don't condone it but alot of people had warned him what happens when you get mountaineers dander up! As to the rock situation...raised beds are the only way to go! Try planting 30 fruit trees...now there's a chore! Chiggers,ticks,snakes can be dealt with. Occasional deer in the orchard come fall but usually see them eating the windfalls. Hawks and eagles will take your poultry but they die or learn fast what that shawdow overhead is ! Occasional sightings of bear and panther,lots of coyotes if sheep are your thing...we finally had to give that up as they thought our lambs were lunch even with guard animals.
We've been here 18 years and not moving--came from the tax state of MI and love our $300 yearly taxes. Have been iced in a time or two but no one expects you to get out--when two or more snowflakes fall they start cancelling everything on the radio. You just keep plenty of supplies on hand, a big woodpile and enjoy it. We had a generator but have only fired it up a couple of times...our electric co-op is right on the ball. DEE

Siryet · #37 08/18/05, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jared

Don't buy into the people all being great and nice and helpful. I've travelled all over the country and what I tell people about anywhere is this: every place is the same. The people are the same. Sometimes just different colors. Arkansas has nice people and unbelievably rude people, gays and racists, geniuses and idiots, people who will help you at every turn and people who will steal from you first chance they get. Tons of people hate drugs, but we've got a huge meth problem. Be careful where you go. I've been in parts of Arkansas that made me afraid to get out of the car, literally. A black friend told me that I was white as sunshine but that even I was too dark to be down there and he's right. Right around St. Paul and Pettigrew, if you want to know what those parts are like, watch Deliverance and Next of Kin to get an idea of how they live. (Not the part where Warren Beatty gets raped. Just the way they live in buses and shacks and shanties)

I have always found that If MY attitude is right I can get along with just about anyone. The situations you describe are not the norm where I live but I am sure they do exist here. When I run into a bigot I just don't buy into that crap, I don't invite strangers to my place and I follow local customs without wanting to change them.
I follow the local customs and do not criticize out loud and we have been accepted quite well thank you.
I knew we we accepted when a local cattle farmer borrowed my 3pt tractor run post hole digger when I wasn't home and told me about it two weeks later.
I love it here in the river valley and I thank God every day.

Jc05 · #38 08/18/05, 01:54 PM

I've lived in the Ozarks all my life, and I know some people who have never seen anyone that wasn't white and at least where I live, and they are quick to put you in your place if you make an off comment about race. I'm 35 and at least most of the people my age and up tend to judge people on their character more than anything else....
As for bad neighbors, I lived at a place one time where the closest neighbors spent alot of time out in the front yard drinking and shooting guns and who knows what else. Its not what I like to do, & I didn't know them too well and so for Christmas I took them a bottle of whisky and told them someone had given it to me and since I didn't drink, I thought they might like to have it for Christmas. They knew where I stood on drinking and it sent the message that I didn't care what they did as long as it didn't bother me. I think I was the only one in town that never had a bit of a problem out of them and they turned out to be some of the best neighbors I've ever had.

dheat · #39 08/19/05, 09:49 AM

Just have to share a recent, relevent experience.

My father is from the Russellville area (Pottsville to be precise). He has 3 siblings that still live there.

My mother was born in the Mt. View area (Big Flat to be precise), but she was a preacher's kid so lived several places in the north western quadrant of AR. Her remaining siblings are scattered all over the country.

We had a reunion on Mt. Nebo last week with both families. I travelled from NE FL with my family.

When we entered AR from Memphis on I-55, both I-55 and I-40 were backed up. We had to be in R'ville at 6:00 PM for dinner. Since we didn't have time to spare, I decided to back road it. I had an atlas and was confident we could do it.

A local must have noticed our FL tag and me with my nose in the atlas (wife was driving

) as they passed us and figured out what we were doing. So, whenever we came to an intersection he would point which way we should go. This went on for several miles, then he pulled over, motioned us on and turned around and went on with his day. My point is, he went out of his way to help complete strangers.

There were other, lesser incidents during our week that impressed my wife and I with the warmth of complete strangers in AR. And this comes from a couple that lived in Charleston, SC--"the politest city in the U.S." I suppose, however, there's a difference with politeness and warmth.

Doug

donsgal · #40 08/22/05, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jared

Don't buy into the people all being great and nice and helpful.

I have lived in A LOT of places, and to some extent you are correct. There are good and bad everywhere. However, I think your environment has a lot to do with it. If you live in a fast-paced city where everybody is rude then you tend to adopt those qualities, even if it isn't your true nature. If you live in a city where there is a lot of racial hostility, you become over-sensitive to it. I believe that in the Ozarks, people try harder to be kind and caring. It is the way they are brought up. If they had been brought up in Detroit or Chicago, maybe they wouldn't be so kind and caring.

There are a lot of people around where I live who are really scary looking red-neck types and once you get to know them they are the sweetest people on earth and would do anything in the world for you. People are people but environement plays a big part.

By the way, my last post WAS intended as a compliment - I guess it didn't quite come out that way.

donsgal