Heartworm in dog

Hi, I got my pup in 1992 at 3 wks old. 2 weeks late had to take to vet, had parvo. Spent 3 wks in hosp. then came home and they forgot to do heartworm check! Went BACK and he had heartworms! He spent 2 to 3 weeks in they treated him with 2 shots in his back? Cost almost $200 back then! (When they would let you pay it out!) After that he took heartguard for about a year it started making him sick so my old fella has not had any wormer except a
bi-yearly general wormer since 93 and he is still going strong! (Now the pup does get him out breath every now & then but...) Just wanted to let you know they can live with it sometimes if neccesary. Good luck! Kim in OK

There's no point in doing a heartworm check in a pup under 5-6 months old-the test shouldn't be positive (false positives excluded!) until the dog was at least that old (it takes that long for the worms to mature). A dog can not get it from it's mother in utero or through the milk. Pups should be started on preventive at 6-8 weeks old.

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Sarah,

If there are no dogs Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went.
-Will Rogers

Do whatever your VET says. He/She went to School for this Knowledge. Amatuer Vet Pundits don't really amuse me.If you had as much knowledge about the subject as you THINK you have, then YOU would be VETs.Anyone that Really cares about their animals will take them to a Real Vet!

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Freedom isn't Free

not everyone believes in better living through chemistry.

Not all vets know what they are doing!!

They mostly know more than non-vets. Thats why they've been to 8yrs of school.

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Freedom isn't Free

so why did I end up paying an $80 vet bill that didn't even begin to tell me what was wrong with my sheep? And read the book and treated him myself....not, unfortunately, without causing him to seriously lose condition while I waited for the vet's meds to work?

Give me a break, already.

I know very well what it's like to balance animal needs and reality, and I also know that "oh, we can't afford that" is a cop-out 99% of the time.
****

lol my favorite is ppl complaining they can't afford the kids they have or the animals they have but they somehow find a way to pay for the beer and smokes. So yes..the I can't afford it is a cop out..it's a matter of what's more important..my beer or my kid or dog.

edited to say..yes there are ppl that really can't afford the bill and my question is..why get a dog in the first place..they do cost money.

GoldenMom, this is not meant for you, or to offend you.

Y'know, vets., like everyone else are fallible. There are good ones and bad ones. I had a very close call 2 years ago with an equine vet who dispensed to me a syringe filled with Equipoise (a muscle building steroid) to help build up our aged pony. Luckily, it was Halloween and we did not use it that day. at nine o'clock the next morning, the vet called me, panicked, because she realized (THE NIGHT BEFORE!) that she had given us the wrong syringe. We were about to inject our old welsh pony with a dose of prostaglandins prescribed to induce abortion in a draft mare! Then when we returned the syringe and declined to take our chances further, she dinged us with a 20.00 restocking fee! Whether you are consulting with a physician or a veterinarian, you should question and research things yourself. They aren't Gods. You know what they call the person who graduates last in his/her class at vet or med school? Doctor!

All I can say is that you folks make it so that a lot of other folks are afraid to post about their problems, and to admit their mistakes when it comes to dealing with livestock and pets. We all learn from our mistakes, we don't need someone harping after us. Tiffann4k came here seeking advice for what to do now that the event has already occurred other then invest the huge amounts of cash required to treat a dog for heartworms. IMHO if you can't offer any constructive advice, don't respond. She admitted she made a mistake in not giving the dog heartworm preventative. I imagined she has learned from that mistake and won't be repeating it, but I think she learned that from the actual event, not from so many of you harping at her about it. All you learn from this kind of critisizm is to keep your mouth shut in the future.

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Thanks for the exclusion, Lisa! Sometimes it's hard to realize that a vet, or doctor, or anybody you must trust is still human. I do know what it feels like to put your beloved pet into someone else's hands and hope they know what they are doing. And yes, I have had bad experiences because a vet I worked for didn't realize how bad a situation was. I easily could have lost my boy to bloat (I still don't know how I didn't) and he has a crippled leg that may not have been so crippled had I been referred to the experts sooner. Am I bitter? No, not really. Sometimes I regret the outcome, but I try to see it as a way for me to become a better vet. Because of these experiences I am much more likely to offer a referral to someone when I feel that their pet could benefit from visiting a specialist. I never put an owner down if they say "the referral is just too expensive please just do your best, I trust you." Sometimes it works out wonderfully, sometimes it was not meant to be.

I haven't always been a vet, and even now there are times when my dogs need care that is above and beyond what I can do myself. The only thing we can do to guard ourselves is to have a good relationship with our vet and other health professionals. If we really know them, we have a much better idea of their strengths and weaknesses (hard to admit, but we all have them). And feel free to question. There is rarely only one way to approach a problem.

PS if anybody took my posts as bashing/flaming-I sincerely apologize! I try not to pass judgement, I just try to put all the facts out there so that people can make an informed decisions (maybe too many facts sometimes!). It makes me sad when a thread gets so mean spirited!

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Sarah,

If there are no dogs Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went.
-Will Rogers

Hi,

well now, let's see - Tiffany has a dog that has heartworms - she got said dog from the pound or humane society, and has taken care of the dog the best that she can.

If she hadn't taken the dog from the pound, the likely event would have been gassing or lethal injection and dog dies. Well she did get the dog, she's cared for the dog, and for goodness sakes, I for one, don't fault her for not going into debt to pay a vet bill that she can't afford. In that event, she can do nothing - the dog is either going to live or die. If it lives, well it's lived longer than it would have if left at the pound and if it dies, well it died at a later date than it would have at the pound.



Why don't some of you kind folks out there that's got a ton of money and access to large lines of credit at the bank let Tiffany give you her vet's name and address and you can mail a check to the vet for the dog's care. Or better yet, maybe you can take the dog and care for it since Tiffany obviously can't "afford" it. I'm sure that we could arrange transport from her place to yours. Ohh I know, IT's not YOUR DOG, right??? Well, then if it is not your dog and you can't give some constructive advice without bashing the tar out of someone, and can't send money to help, and won't take the dog, uhm what are you doing here? Oh I know - it's called bashing the poster so that she will "know" better next time to ask a question...bet that gives you the warm cuddlies at night knowing how much you "helped" out. :no:

Thanks Golden for the information about heartworms, I put my dogs on preventive as soon as possible, the alternative is 600 to 800 bucks for vet care as it is very prevalent down here in GA. I use Heartguard to protect my dogs.

I love my vet - I call him first and I ask him "what would you do if this was your ...fill in the blank> He has surprised me at times by saying to put the whatever it is down, or do nothing and wait and see, or like the time I had a filly that couldn't stand - she was born with contracted tendons and I called him out and he said the price for surgery and I about died...and then he said, I guarantee she'll stand and walk and so I just blindly trusted and the filly is now one of the top hunter ponies in her division. She can jump the moon. Cost me a bundle and took three hours of surgery but she did stand and walk. Other times, like my Rottie, who was almost 10 and had tumours which were cancerous, he said to just leave her be. Or I could spend thousands on cancer treatment, put her through surgery, and she was still going to die. So I left her alone, she lived another year and a half and quietly died right after her morning breakfast. Sometimes people appreciate a vet who is honest enough to care more for the animal and it's owner than the money (and yes, I know vets need to make money, I've supported my vet for over 20 years, seen his kids grow up, and probably helped pay for their college too :haha: ) involved in the treatment. A good vet, in my opinion, will be brutally frank about costs, odds of recovery/death, and whether or not they will accept payments, or whether the bill must be paid in full at time of service. I always pay in full and sometimes it empties the kittie right down to the last penny, but my vet isn't rich and meds cost him money and he will come out and do things in the middle of the night, in the pouring rain, when it's 20 degrees out and not charge me one cent more than if it were bright and sunny Friday at 2:00 in the afternoon. He knows what I can afford and what I can't and that is important too.

I think my vet is wonderful. I had another vet that was just horrible to me and was only concerned with the dollar. So it is equally important to find a vet that you "click" with and that cares. I'm off my

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Sidepasser

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I did not read all of the replies so I hope this is not redundant.

I have a dog who just tested positive for heartworm and the vets are giving me the speal that I have to have him treated with the imidadole or the arsenic compound with the 2 shots and then a 3rd shot in a month, etc.etc.

I cannot afford the whole payment (600-800.00) for my dog. So...I opted to check this site out and I advise you try it until you can get the dog treated conventionally. www.naturalrearing.com.

This lady, Marina has helped me through some odd problems with my dogs....she has a natural heartworm treatment. She uses nosodes, Black Hull Walnut Tincture, and a Anti-Parasite Support (a chinese/tibetan herb that kills internal parasites). I have done much research on the alternative methods to heartworm treatment because I do dread the toxicity of the drugs administered to the dog and it may still kill them. Anyway, with this treatment you do not have to confine the dog either. He can go on his normal schedule. Talk to Marina (her number is on the site), tell her the details about your animal and she can help you. And also the cost is under 100.00 for the stuff she sends you. Ask her for detailed instructions...because her instructions can be a little sparse on paper. She is in Oregon so I think she is pacific time.

I am using this currently until I can afford the conventional treatment. I just got the news that Poochy is HW+, so I started Marina's regiman right away and am saving until next month to take him to the vet. Actually according to Marina you can do her treatment for a couple of monthes, test the dog, and the dog should test negative or be on the way.....it can take up to six monthes. However, she has had good success rates. You may even ask her for names of people who she has helped so you can be sure. She is pretty good though, because I have had good results with things she has helped me with.

I hope you come back Tiff. I agree with you. The bible says that the dog shall eat from the crumbs of the table. The says to me that God places animals below man. We have dominion over the animals says God. Which says to me that man has the right to make decisions on an animal's behalf. We aren't here to abuse animals, but to do what is best for them within reason. God gave man and only man the ability to reason. When I got my animals, I was in a much better financial state than I am now. Should I get rid of the animal because I can't afford to pay thousands of dollars on them? SHould I pay thousands on them if I did have the money? I don't think so. Even if I won the lottery, I can't justify spending thousands on a dog when there are people in this world that need help. I would have to have the animal humanely euthanized, cry a while and move on. Do what is best for your dog without putting undo hardship on your family. I would not deplete my finances on an animal. WHo knows what tomorrow will hold. You may need that money to save your child, your home, etc.

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Sometimes the last minute is the best one.

wow! thats all i can think right now...

i have only been a member of this board a short time but feel i have gotten to know some of the members pretty well and tiff is one of them...

she is not the kind of person that would hurt any animal!!!
she has a family ,a young family , and does the best she can...not everybody can afford what vets charge ..and depending on everyones own financial picture sometimes there is no "stretching the money" when it is already stretched to the limit.

the fact that she was chased off these boards is ridiculous.
she has helped alot of people with answers to questions and is a genuine caring person and i only hope that she comes back.
i would not want to be in someone's shoes that has such a caring heart for animals and is in a situation that she feels hopeless...

tiff, i hope you come back and there are a few of you who should be ashamed of yourselves...

quad

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Not all who wander are lost.......

Quad

Okay, hold on. If a dog is infected with heart worms and you give the dog Ivormec it will KILL the dog. I worked with a vet for 2 years and had a Rottie show up at my house one Oct. I had a sneaky feeling he was positive for HW and sure enough on a scale of 1-5 he was a 5. It was a very very heavy infestation. To begin treatment first you do the test to make sure they have it. The best test out there is to take a blood draw put it on a slide under a micropscope and check for the larvae a.k.a. microfilaria swimming around in the blood smear. The dog will then be put on a tablet (depending on the size dog the dosage will be diff) for 1-2 weeks usually about 1, this stabilizes the liver for step 3. Step 3 is 2 shots over the kidney area of the dogs back, 1 shot one day, 1 shot the next day. This will make the dog very very sore for a few days. After the shots are given the vet will re test the blood in about a week or two depending on the infestation level, the blood will most likely be negative. My dog's treatment ran about $100.00(however the vet I worked for is cheaper compared to most in the country.) Again a big chunk of that was not doing the activator test(resembles a small preg. test that when pressed down is activated and the blood serum is absorbed indicating positive or neg result) those ran $25 at my vets office. The microscope test is easy, effective and was relied on years before the activated tests, in my opinion it's the only way I have my dogs tested.
After your dog is neg. for HW's then you can proceed with the Ivormec or a standard heartworm regimen such as Interceptor. Or there is a newer alternative (within the last 2 years or so) which is a shot that lasts 6 months called Proheart. It beats having the remember the pills every month.
I would keep your dog on preventetive all year round. I begin my dogs in mid March and continue through October, then I go off for 5 months because mosquitos are no longer a threat. Year round is your preventetive measure however, especially in a dog that has already been infected.

May I also say that the situation is diff. for collie dogs or collie dog mixes. They cannot go on standard heartworm preventetive, it will kill these dogs, veterinary consult. is required for these dogs, and should they have heartworms, a special regimen on medicines is required.

May I again stress that you DO NOT GIVE IVORMEC TO POSITIVE INFECTED DOGS WITH HEART WORMS IT WILL KILL THEM. VETERINARY TREATMENT IS REQUIRED.

If Ivermectin will kill a dog with heartworms, think you mean to say it kills the adults and can kill the dog when/if the dead worms get lodged in the lungs, then please tell me why vets are now giving Heartguard to HW positive dogs?

It IS safe to give Heartgard/Ivermectin and Interceptor to a heartworm positive dog. These meds don't give the massive fast microfilaria kill that the "old" medicine DEC/Filaribits gives. Too fast of a kill of microfilaria will cause a massive allergic reaction and possible death. Much of the "you will kill your dog if you give it preventive if it's positive" is left over from the old DEC days.

When giving straight Ivermectin I would just be quite cautious on the dose to make sure that you didn't get a massive quick kill. And no, Ivermectin will not kill adult heartworms, just microfilaria.

BTW Proheart is off the market and has been for a few months now. The FDA is looking into it's safety.

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Sarah,

If there are no dogs Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went.
-Will Rogers

Wow Sarah! Thanks for being here and sharing so much info! I think I'll print it all out and put it in my dog folder for future reference!

Mon

Yep. Even Revolution is now approved for HW positive dogs. And it gets fleas too. The dose in Heartguard is formulated lower to be safe for collies, that's the standard they went by. It's still strong enough to be a good HW preventive. The Proheart shot has been bad news for a long time. I'm glad they re-called it a while ago. Of course, any dog can have any kind of reaction with any meds, even shots, flea meds, etc...so it's all really chance anyway with any chemicals. And no one really knows the build up over the years, and what it will do.

First off, I want to apologize to Tiffany. It was not my intention to run her off, nor was it my intention to "flame" her. I would be more than happy to help with her dog's vet bill, but so far have found no way to get in touch with her.

Secondly, I want to say that I still stand by my original post in this thread:

Originally Posted by Ravenlost
You do realize that Goldenmom is a vet, right? So you are going to ignore a PROFESSIONAL'S advice and put your dog at continued risk?

I'm sorry, but this really upsets me. First you don't give the dog heartworm meds monthly and now you aren't going to give him proper treatment for the results of your negligence.

Why did you get the dog in the first place?

I don't mean to be rude or hateful, this just really bugs me. For the life of me I can't understand why people treat their dogs and cats like second class citizens. Every animal I have is a member of my family and treated likewise. Maybe that makes me a nut. Maybe that makes me a RESPONSIBLE pet owner. Probably both. The bottom line is that if you can't afford to give your animal proper care then you shouldn't have the animal in the first place.

We just spent $13,500 on a dog. A stray that we took in. Could we afford it? Barely. It's put us in a bind, but that's something we can live with. We could not live in peace knowing we did nothing to save this dog. He's a beloved member of our family and the love he gives us is priceless. We owed it to him to give him every chance at recovering from his accident. So we did it, even if it means no going to the movies, not shopping, no air conditioning to keep the power bill down, etc. etc.

Please do the responsible thing and give your dog the veterinary care he deserves.

I have read and reread all the posts on this thread and I just don't believe that I was wrong to have the opinion I have. If you have four young children and $400-$600 in unexpected expenses will cause you to lose your home, then you shouldn't be going to the SPCA and adopting anything. I don't believe they let you do that for free, do they?

Personally, I believe that there are ways Tiffany could find, or raise, the money for the dog's treatment. There is probably a vet in her area that would work out a payment plan. She could have a yard sale, sell stuff on Ebay, babysit since she's an SAHM. There are ways to raise some money.

When you have a pet you do have a responsibility to that pet. In my opinion Heartworm care is basic care for a dog, as is spaying/neutering and rabies shots. In my post I made a poor attempt to point out to Tiffany that she had the advice of her vet and a vet here online and I asked her to please do the responsible thing and give the dog the care he needed.

At no time did I call her names, be snide or hateful. I was beginning to think I had done something terribly wrong, but then the nasty PMs started, the names, curses and ugliness in others came out and I realized that it's not me that has a problem. Perhaps Tiffany left in a huff because she saw a kernel of truth in what I said and it hurt.

It's a growing trend in this country to refuse to take responsibility for one's actions. It is my personal opinion that a pet owner should be prepared to give their pet adequate and necessary medical treatment. If they can not do that then they should not own pets.

And that's all I've got to say. Y'all have at it.

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