How to finance becoming a farmer?

I want to live on a farm VERY badly .. the only way i would live on a huge farm was if i won the lotto and since i do not play that will never happen *LOL* ... so definately a small farm .. maybe 10 acres at the most.

Of course i have been contemplating more and more the diversity issue and am just researching everything on maxumizing a small farm through management.

It would not make any since to try and farm rabbits here since there is no market for them except as pets.We would have to move and rent somewhere, where they allow animals. Then apprentice or maybe volunteer at a rabbit farm. Maybe soon there will be legislation making rabbit lifestock and under their juristiction so that we could get a rabbit farm.

Right now we are renting a small place/w a storage building out back and 2 acres of land, mostly grown over for $300 a month. Which around here is really good. Our land lord on the other hand we still do not have a feel for he has been running warm and cold, so we are really confused by him.

Hi,

When I bought my place I financed it through a bank, bare land, and a business plan for a boarding barn/lessons/training business. My business plan was around 50 pages long and laid out very clearly what I could and could not do, costs, etc. The bank perused that document for a couple of weeks then called me and I had to make a few modifications and then I closed the loan and built my first stable. I worked many hours putting in sweat equity into the place and had financed it for 20 years. Every year the bank and I had an accounting to see where I was going and if I met goals...some years I did, some I didn't and when I didn't, I had to explain why. When I closed my barn I had performed up and above the stated income goals for seven years out of ten. But I put a lot of my money into this, and paid the bank off for the land by refinancing and now I am 1 year away from paying off the place in full.

It can be done, but helps if you have substantial down payment and a business plan to show the bank how you intend to pay the loan back and it also helps to have several years experience doing whatever it is you want to do.

Also a business plan will show you if your idea is feasible or not on paper, and it helps to be less than optimistic as there are going to be years when the mares didn't take, the berries dried up and the rabbit market went south, so you might as well prepare for that as well as the good times. Shoot I had an easier time borrowing the money for the business than I have had borrowing money to build a house on the land...seems the land would be worth more than the house, so the banks want me to divide the place up, which I can't do because we are in a conservation program that prohibits subdividing the farm...oh well...I'll keep working on the barn/house and see what happens once the place is paid for.

Sidepasser

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Be yourself - no one can tell you that you're doing it wrong!

Qtkitty, I would recommend flat out asking the landlord if you can raise rabbits, perhaps a dozen breeding does. See if you can get him to say either yes, or no.

*IF* he says yes, then start with 2 does. You can, of course, quietly expand after you make your first sales. You already have permission.

In most states, rabbits are not considered to be livestock so zoning will PROBABLY not be a problem. You can find out for certain at the zoning office.

When dealing with the government, give no more information than you have to give. Do NOT talk about selling rabbits, just ask if KEEPING rabbits is allowed. Ask the zoning office before you ask your landlord.

You see, zoning offices routinely turn a blind eye to grey areas like yard sales. But, don't shove it in their faces, OK?

Of course, if you sell meat rabbits you must be prepared to slaughter. Another potential market is to sell newborn bunnies for snake food. The moderator of the rabbit board can tell you more about this.

Now, if he says NO, then you might get started selling worms in compost. The moderator of the singles forum raises worms, and in the past he has posted some good websites and advice. A search can be time-consuming, but profitable.

My wife and I tried going through FSA last year to upgrade our existing homestead, withthe addition of a 1/4 acre greenhouse..... ran smack into government red tape... although I grew up on a farm, have more years with actual farming experience than most people care to admit for a 40 year old, the requirements for Idaho are 3 years experience of managing a farm within the past 10 years in the feild of what you are going to be farming. so even stretching the fact of growing indoors with market gardening, or even farming a wheatfield, growing cattle has nothing to do with growing veggies, and even so it was all over 10 years ago.... and that 3 years is also suposed to be a profitable three years, with your income comig from farm activities, not off farm.....

Even trying to play the minority card of my wife getting the approval we run up against the same thing, no experience in farming, let alone with a hydroponic greenhouse, never mind that the whole thing could be payed off on paper in 3 years, and with real time adjustments more than likely within 7 years....

So like anyone else, if we want such an operation we would have to fund it a little at a time, and maybe one day we will..... so until then we stick with off farmstead income, cause what we could afford to build, wont support the whole year long....

And like bare sez the government is into paying the farmers here to not FARM, and if a prson buys a place under a program like that, they either have to pay the government back any payments made in order to farm or just sit it out... and most farmers who sell under such a program jack u the price so a person had to be independently wealthy just to sit for a few myears anyway so they could make up the difference [we looked into 3500 acres under governemt program in montana a couple years ago].

William

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Upon the plains of hesitation bleach the bones of countless millions, who when on the dawn of victory paused to rest, and there resting died.
- John Dretschmer

I've only got a little advice for you...

Know what your market is for whatever 'crop' you plan on producing. Can you produce enough profit per unit to cover your expenses, the basic cost of production, marketing (you gotta get your stuff to someone who wants to buy it), property taxes, all the fuel used for production/marketing, property taxes, income (if your lucky), and enough to cover the interest on the loan???

If you can't inherit it, marry it. Seriously, if you have to buy land, it'll be hard to make a go of it unless you grow a seriously in demand specialty crop...like Christmas trees (neighbor paid off his 15 acres in two rotations)... Remember, when you add up all the hours you inputted from beginning to end, you'll be shocked at your hourly wage. I tried and failed several times (worst drought in 80 years on e year,,,hail and late frost the next.....) ...well, not really failed, but the 10cents an hour scenario isn't too ego building... SO, don't want to sound negative, and wish you the best of luck...but go into it with your eyes wide open.

My opinion...buy land if you can't inherit/marry it, and work your hiney's off to pay it off as fast as possible...eat rice and beans, sleep in a tent, never go out...pay for it, and THEN you can hobby farm to feed yourself and your family, and then try your hand at selling your excess...remember your specialty markets... Also, become a handyman, and your family'll never go hungry...somebody's always needing something done......

One last piece of advice.............Remember Farming is not a BUSINESS. In BUSINESS you buy wholesale and sell retail. In business, each little cog in the business wheel takes a profit, and the final consumer pays. In FARMING, in case no one has let you in on the secret, you buy RETAIL and sell WHOLESALE...and when you get ready to sell, you take what someone'll give you...if you lose money on the transaction, well, heck, that's farming. BACK$$$WORDS in other words. If you were approving loans would you approve of a business model that was 180 degrees different than what you normally approved??? There are farmers banks, and federal lenders...when they wanted my land as collateral...well, I figured I didn't need their loans that much...and insurance is a joke...my fulltime farming uncle (inherited + married land = success ) took out crop insurance, armyworms took out his crop, no payout as there wasn't a declared emergency...doesn't do crop insurance anymore....

You can make a lot of money in farming, though, if a natural disaster befalls your friends/neighbors/other folks and not you...but it's hard on the conscience wishing others to fail so that you can succeed...

Good luck, friend, my best wishes
Phil

sidepasser ~~ I can believe that a business plan can be 50 pages ... they are so detail orriented.

Not being able to get a loan to build a house would be very frustrating, but it sounds like you have done VERY well paying off your barn. Once it is done maybe the banks will be more willing to listen.

Terri~~ Actually when we moved here we asked specifically if we could have each of our animals, including our then 3 rabbits, which are now 7 rabbits. We have a Netherland that is rather fertile as you can tell. I told the landlord about the bunnies and told him if he knew anyone that was looking for a pet bunny i would have some for sale in a few weeks. He did not even blink an eye at that.

I think that as long as we are improving the land over all so that the next people who move in will be proud to call this home he doesn't mind. It is just some times he acts .. i don't know how to explain it.. it is more like an undercurrent.

I had anatomy in college and did cat and fetal pig disection, but i think slaughtering a rabbit is Slightly different. And if i am slaughering i definately would need to learn how to tan rabbit hides, because that would be something good going to waste. Then there are the feet. The organs i know i could give to Kevin's brother who has dogs, they would love that treat!!

* grins * Actually i know something about herp feedings so i already knew the snake and baby bunnies go together well. I used to have a mealworm farm, it was about to the point where i could have started selling from it and it would have not made the numbers go down so bad that i would run out. When we moved we had to leave it behind because the back building out here needed cleaned out and an old hole for a wood stove pipe closed up before it can be used( i also noticed bubble bees guarding a small hole in the side of the building so they might have a nest in there). I will restart a meal worm farm once the building is cleaned out, around here 1000 sell for $15. I have also researched earthworm growing. We had a female Eastern Box Turtle which was very picky about her food and a cat which loves to eat mealworms .

Blu3duk ~ It seems like all prices are sky high not just farm lands .. i was looking at http://www.unitedcountry.com/index.html and the closest property that i found was an 8 acre farm with a horse pasture, a 3 stall barn, a small gardening storage building, and a 5 bedroom 3 bath house for $169K. My fiance said that the house does not look like it could anyway possibly have 5 bedrooms in it.

texican~ *coughs* Well since i have a fiance i better not go marrying a farmer.. unless he becomes one *lol*

That is part of what i am trying to figure out.. how much it will make ... and how much i will need to pay up .. then my end results.. as i am trying to put my ideas together i am trying to make sure i can produce things not only to sell but that i can also put down on the table. Also that i can have one type of animal with more then one purpose and more then one type of animal. Basically i do not want to get a HUGE place, but i want to be able to farm it to its full potential.

That is part of what i am trying to figure out.. how much it will make ... and how much i will need to pay up .. then my end results.. as i am trying to put my ideas together i am trying to make sure i can produce things not only to sell but that i can also put down on the table. Also that i can have one type of animal with more then one purpose and more then one type of animal. Basically i do not want to get a HUGE place, but i want to be able to farm it to its full potential.[/QUOTE]

Hi,

I talked with other boarding barn owners/trainers/and lesson instructors and visited barns over a two year period to see what they did/did not like about their barns and facilities before I built my stable. I also researched insurance requirements, costs of feed, hay, vet care, farrier, etc. and wrote it all down. Then I had to figure in the cost of the land/buildings/etc. and depreciation. Once I had numbers to work from, I could then figure out what I had to charge to make a profit. I also allowed for disasters (hay that went up and feed costs that increased and looked for ways to cut that by contracting with hay farmers to purchase so much yearly at a set price).

It took me two full years of researching and planning before the first bulldozer hit the farm - the one thing I could not overcome was the lack of good barn help (note- not cheap, but reliable, qualified and willing to work). So closed the stables after dealing with that persistant problem since I also worked full time and needed someone here to manage during the day. You may want to think about that if you reach the point where expansion would be needed - could you find someone to care for the bunnies if you had an emergency and had to leave town or someone reliable to do whatever it is that mealworms need doing??

I have found that many in my area want a check, they just want to go to the mailbox to get it.

Sidepasser

__________________
Be yourself - no one can tell you that you're doing it wrong!

We bought a small house in an over grown field. We have 45 acres. We tore the old privy off the back of the shed (hadn't been used for 15-20 years) and turned it into a hen house for six hens. DH built a three sided shelter for the horses and goats. At the end of the first year we moved that closer to the house and added onto it to make it a barn. He built up and out to make it large enough for three horses, two cows and 16 goats.

When the Gloucestershire Old Spots came we kept them in a pallet pen for a couple of days while DH built a lean to for the summer. In the fall we were given a cabin which DH and Dad jacked up, put on skids and moved a mile up the road. Eventually DH added a small addition for the pigs and the cabin is now home to 60 laying hens.

Meat birds are raised in tractors. The Garage was turned into a rabbitry when I raised meat rabbits commercially.

Starting small means you aren't going to make a living off your farm quickly, but you're probably not going to anyway. We added as we could afford to without going into debt other than the small mortgage.

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Robin

i still think there is more money in beef cows we want some chickens for meat and eggs but i think we will make the most money from the cows we will raise

There's plenty of ways to finance farming, just not for free. Government programs are a joke in my opinion, so just forget those and get on with traditional financing.

My local bank is the best place for me to get a loan. The owners, board of directors, etc are all local people who live and work here. They know who I am and what I do. There's no corporate guidleines and all that as barriers to getting a loan. I walk in, tell them what I want, answer their questions and it's done. I don't even think they run a credit check.

Jena

I found the approach in 'Contrary Farmer' to be helpful-do a little of almost EVERYTHING to make it on the farm...

$1000 here and $3000 there adds up in the end.

Also taking advantage of the niche market is the only way to go in my opinion...the little guy has no hope of competing against the big guys but the big guys are NOT interested in the small niche markets available.

If you are close to an urban area,catering to the specialty market is the way to go-'gourmet' this or 'exotic' that....

Find out for sure what you can do there where you are. Won't find a place cheaper, if you can get started there and save your money to buy later. Focus on learning and growing a garden. Anything you can grow to eat, saves money. Keep working, this is a sideline. You will figure out what works and what doesn't. What grows good there. A rabbit farm is usually a sideline, takes a lot of rabbits to make a living....James

Wow, was looking at all the folks posting, and then I realized it was a nearly 10 year old thread! Made me realize how many folks that used to post regularly, but have moved on.

Making a living with rabbits is very, very difficult. BTDT.

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My posts and words remain my exclusive property and may not be used without my express written permission and proper credit given for authorship.

OK. Not to be a thread jumper, but this is a 10 year old thread.
Someone mentioned a USDA grant for perimeter fencing?
We have about 100 acres of land in S.W. Kansas and it is mostly unfenced. We would love to be able to run some cattle on it, but can't afford to fence it.
anyone know more about this grant?

Easiest and best way, is to find a single person, from a long line of farmers/ranchers.... their land is already paid for.

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Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity. Seneca
Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival. W. Edwards Deming

The best way to make a small fortune in farming is to start with a large fortune.

HAHA

In one of the few states that has more farms every year, the most popular method is to start by share-cropping vegetables. While working somewhere else to support yourself.

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http://www.mofga.org/

http://www.mofga.org/Programs/FarmAp...2/Default.aspx

http://www.fsa.usda.gov/FSA/webapp?a...fmlp&topic=bfl

I found some info at the USDA.gov website.
Looks like there are a lot of new programs

http://www.nrcs.usda.gov/wps/portal/...telprdb1193811