"no trespassing" ??
 

I'm finding it difficult to understand what this means...Googling thus far has not given me enough information.

My quandary is "who" would be defined as a "trespassor" and who has the right to define that person as such. (Scenario: two people own a tract of land that cannot be subdivided with one of those two owning what, in legal terms, is identified as the "controlling interest".)

Would appreciate any information ............

I suspect that neither owner can be defined as a trespasser, irregardless of controlling interest, unless there is a signed contract forbidding entry to one of them. Past that, I think that if both owners agree, than they can define a trespasser. But if one owner gives permission, the permisee is not a trespasser, regardless of the other owner's determination. A potentially unpleasant situation, especially if the minority owner chooses to be trouble.

The above is speculation based on my vast (yea right.) experience, but if you want a definitive answer, you will not find it here. Talk to a lawyer and get an official legal opinion before something regrettable happens.

Loki

What does the original contract/deed say? - or is this property inherited - what's the will say? Co-owners equal rights? May have to have one buy the other out to resolve this issue.

A chat with the local sheriff may help. May be needed anyway.

You will need to be more specific and the law will vary by state. For example, does the deed state

Joint tenancy
Tenancy in common or
Tenancy by the entirety

Here is a very basic article on it; your state will have guidelines - search "Virginia joint ownership of land" for example.

This article tells you the essentials--ignore their pitch to call the lawyer listed. If you need a lawyer, call your state bar for references.

http://www.legalmatch.com/law-librar...-property.html

Thanks everyone. The information does help.

I've discovered the local county laws prevent any and all "land owners" from living on the land without approval from the local building dept as well as the local health dept. Since the majority land owner in this case holds title to the only structure approved by these departments, i.e. a trailer house, that party has the right to say who lives in said trailer. This does "legally" prevent the minority land owner from living on the land. It does not prevent the minority owner from entering the land. However, since the minority land owner has a "record" proving in a District Court that he has destroyed property of (and physically abused) the majority land owner, this may actually be what allows a "no trespass" by said minority land owner.

Thanks again for helping; and that URL was, also, helpful.

When it comes to Trespass Law only a lawyer or LEO can tell you for sure but the LEO will give you the information for free.

Shrek, what is an LEO and how do I find one?

LEO is a Law Enforcement Officer, or where I am from Sheriff's Department, town cops have no jurisdiction out in the sticks.

Are you ok, your post is somewhat worrysome as in someone is bothering you, if they are call your local Sheriff's department.

Depends on your own state laws.

There are varying "degrees" or types of tresspass.

A person with written permission to hunt your ground is technically still tresspassing.

But the type of tresspass is what determines how liable you are to this person if they get hurt on your place, or to what extent you can run them off.

If a person has written permission to hunt, but is not paying you to hunt, you are still responsible to alert them to obvious dangers, (mean bulls, open wells, etc) and if you dont, and they fall in the well, you can be held liable.

If however the person is paying you to hunt, then you are less responsible for him.

If they sneak in, cut the lock on the fence, and get hurt, you can still be sued, but probably wont be held liable.

Now as far as running them off. If someone gets lost hunting, you are probably not supposed to shoot them. But if someone cuts the locks, and you find them on your place stealing the copper wire out of your barn, you can probably have them locked up and charged. (still shouldn't shoot them, even if you feel like it)

All kinds of tresspass circumstances and laws.

Oh, another thing I have noticed.

A farmer with 800 or 1,000 acres, and a dozen farms will generally not have his property posted, or gates locked.

A guy moves in from the city, buys 4 acres, puts up signs, gates, barracades and locks the place up like fort knox and gets mad at you if you even look across his property line.

On the other side, I have had city people come out to my farm and basically you find them wandering around like they own the place. Their attitude is "you got lots of ground, you need to share it" I feel like asking them their address in town, then they can look out some morning and I will have a campfire built in their front yard and be roasting hot dogs.

It sure makes you wonder sometimes.

Never, never, NEVER ask a law enforcement officer for legal advice. Many of them do not know the law at all much less good enough to give advice.

If you have a legal question ask someone with a legal degree.

Sounds a bit like what is needed is a "protection order" or "apprehended violence order" or "court order" or whatever the legal term is wherever the situation is.

Virginia:

§ 18.2-119. Trespass after having been forbidden to do so; penalties.

If any person without authority of law goes upon or remains upon the lands, buildings or premises of another, or any portion or area thereof, after having been forbidden to do so, either orally or in writing, by the owner, lessee, custodian, or the agent of any such person, or other person lawfully in charge thereof, or after having been forbidden to do so by a sign or signs posted by or at the direction of such persons or the agent of any such person or by the holder of any easement or other right-of-way authorized by the instrument creating such interest to post such signs on such lands, structures, premises or portion or area thereof at a place or places where it or they may be reasonably seen, or if any person, whether he is the owner, tenant or otherwise entitled to the use of such land, building or premises, goes upon, or remains upon such land, building or premises after having been prohibited from doing so by a court of competent jurisdiction by an order issued pursuant to §§ 16.1-253, 16.1-253.1, 16.1-253.4, 16.1-278.2 through 16.1-278.6, 16.1-278.8, 16.1-278.14, 16.1-278.15, 16.1-279.1, 19.2-152.8, 19.2-152.9 or § 19.2-152.10 or an ex parte order issued pursuant to § 20-103, and after having been served with such order, he shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor. This section shall not be construed to affect in any way the provisions of §§ 18.2-132 through 18.2-136.

(Code 1950, § 18.1-173; 1960, c. 358; 1975, cc. 14, 15; 1982, c. 169; 1987, cc. 625, 705; 1991, c. 534; 1998, cc. 569, 684; 2011, c. 195.)


https://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/leg...0+cod+18.2-119

Short hand: If you are a owner (co-owner whatever) you have the right to access it unless the court has said you don't.

I'm no lawyer though my wife says I should have become one. :)

I do so appreciate all the information. You have all been so kind to give it.

My situation has nothing to do with hunting. People around here all respect each other's property.

There is no need to be concerned about me. At the moment I am safe. I am looking ahead so as to make sure I remain safe. The owner of the 1/3 percent of this tract of land has already been given a judgment against him, i.e. I received a 2-year protection order from the "circuit" court last year because it was proven this person had destroyed my property and had physically attacked me. (Seems the more vulnerable I became, the less respectful he was until it got to the point I could not permit the abuse anymore. I figured I should value myself as much as I loved my grown son.) There was a written "no trespassing" document given to him that was accepted into the court's file stating it was in play as long as the protective order was. Herein likes my concern. I am actually afraid he will return, enter the property and destroy whatever he wants because I won't let him live in my trailer house anymore. I am afraid he might hurt me as well. I do know if he does, I can call 911 and have him arrested by filing "criminal" charges. Doing this may be my only option; but it will cause me such deep pain to have to do so. I would prefer to find a way to keep him off the premises so it won't come to this.

I know I've put out some very personal information here; however, many of you already know my situation. And I've always been an open book anyway. I am what I am...as stated below...and shall always be so.

Sounds like your only option is to buy him out and get a permanent protective order or renew each time a current one expires. I understand your dilemma. I have a persona non grata relative who has been told if he shows up here he will be arrested.

Buy him out, kin or not, buy him and out and wash your hands of him, as hard as that may be.

I assume you know that you cannot contact him if there is a protective order in place or you yourself would be violating it even if it was entered for your protection.

It is not cheap, but you may have to file a partition suit in circuit court and buy back the property at the auction. If your trailer is not attached, you could also just move it. I assume since you said the property cannot be subdivided then it is a fairly small parcel. I suppose theoretically if you had a civil judgment against him you could execute the judgment against his interest, but that would be rather convoluted compared to just the partition suit, since liens on his interest would have to be paid to clear the title out of his share of the proceeds anyway.

am1too, I would love to buy him out and he even stated at one time that he would sell; however, I'm barely surviving financially and, even if I could get a lean on my home, I could not make monthly payments; so I'm stuck. As for as the protection order, I've been told it cannot be "extended" and to get another, he would have to destroy/attack again...a very poor option for me.

RichNC, as mentioned above, I would really like to buy him out. Just cannot do so. The land is appraised only around 19K and his 1/3rd would be between 6 & 7K; but that is 6-7 months income for me; and though I can do without what I need in the way of personal items, I cannot not feed the animals nor pay the utility bills for that length of time. :(

Declan, Oh yes I do know I cannot contact him (or even make attempts to do so) without violating the protective order. I cannot even find out if he is ok. :( I will google "partition suit" to see if that is an option for me. Move my trailer? Since it is a 1972 trailer, I'm not even sure it wouldn't fall apart if moved. Also, that would require another parcel of land on which to set it, the moving fees, set up fees...OMG...starting over? Just the thought of that is overwhelming. Yes the tract of land consists of only 6 acres. Declan, I've read the last part of your second paragraph several times and still have no idea what you said. Sorry, my mode of communication is more visual than auditory. :(

I am going to close this thread. I don't want this to turn into a pity party; and I don't want to "yes, but" suggestions. Please know I appreciate the information/suggestions you have all given me. I truly do still feel blessed. I know it doesn't sound it; but I do. My Heavenly Father has blessed me in so many ways, even daily as I walk around making repairs to the fencing. I can actually look back on my existence and know I've done the best I could with all I've been responsible for, i.e. my son and my mother. It was actually myself I've been discounting...until last year when I said "Enough is enough" and started this present situation in motion. I pray my Heavenly Father will step in again and show me the appropriate way of dealing with my son without putting myself in harms way.

Again, please know I am grateful for all the information & suggestions you have each given. Thank you.

Do you want this thread closed to prevent further discussion?

Law Enforcement Officer. Here our Sheriff advised posting no trespass signs issued and registered through their office to better protect the landowner.

An order of protection is a piece of paper, be prepared to protect yourself. Do not count on law enforcement being there in time.

wr, I see that your "officially" closing this thread will work best; so yes please. Thank you.

What you have, as you know, is a mess.... undivided interests make a property virtually worthless.... I had a 1/15 interest in a tract, and couldn't do anything without contacting 7 other people... I convinced everyone it was a boat anchor, because they couldn't do anything, if I couldn't, and we sold it.

You can get a partition deed... amicably is the best, almost zero cost, outside of the cost of surveyor. Agree that your percent will be in one location, there's in another, type it up, have a title agent do title insurance (verify you actually own it...) Once the deed is finalized, signed, notarized, and in the courthouse, you're golden. Other party not agree? You'll pay a fortune, or wait for them to die.... If they don't agree, I'd see if they'd buy me out, and buy something better... FREE AND CLEAR title...

You got something going on a lot more serious than trespassing. Normal tresspass laws and situations dont address what you have going on.

You have more like a stalking issue. Or an ownership issue.

A restraining order is not worth the paper it is written on if someone wants to do you ill.

You need a German Shephard dog and a big handgun or a 12 gague shotgun.

Also security cameras (in plain view) and a few hidden game cameras.

locked entry gates. Etc.

Gene

Closing this thread at the request of the OP (original poster).