My advise to people under thirty.

No-the advice is that you do what you have agreed to do and if you do not feel that is congenial, then find work that is congenial. Not that you treat work as you treat a hobby to be done anyway you personally choose.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

[QUOTE=bolophonic;7396704]I have no doubt that he is hiring the laziest, most unskilled and unreliable workers he possibly can. Think about it: any boss who has to fire 15 people in two years is obviously unable to even conduct the basics in screening his own employees. Expecting gratitude for a minimum-wage, dead end job is unrealistic. Every town has a place with a reputation for tedious, low-pay jobs and a boss who knows the cost of everything and the value of nothing. Some guys would rather deal with hiring, training and firing 15 employees at $8.00 an hour than to offer $10/hr and attract a better pool of candidates.

I suspect that hiring the unemployable just gives some people the satisfaction of complaining later when their employees just stop
showing up instead of giving two weeks notice like they used to do.[/
QUOTE]
BRAVO!

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So in the morning, please don't say ya love me.
Cause you know I'll only kick you out the door.

And paying the bare minimum ensures you will have all of the issues the OP has eluded to. Tho paying more will not help unless he uses it to weed out the chaff. He is paying for floor sweepings and is surprised he is getting weed seed.

Why not? If he doesn't like the quality of work fire them. Why do you see it as other than a 2 way street? The worker has free will... Even as an employee.

[quote=bowdonkey;7396882]Gratitude? That is a the poster's idea of what this employer expects. His employer seems to expect he simply show up. If that is a demand for gratitude, then what must be the poster think he does for the employer? Grace him with his presence.
I have at times been grateful for my job but, if I was doing a reasonable job, I was no more grateful to the employer than he should be to me for working for him. We made a contract for mutual advantage. My gratitude is to the fates for allowing me to pay my bills, to my parents for the training they gave me, to the country that has, til recently, provided a place for me, etc.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

The worker has free will.

But we're talking rural America. In my part of the rural South, a man is quite proud of having a reputation as a "good hand". That assures the individual of future work and personal satisfaction.

Being a good hand doesn't have a lot to do with how much the job pays.

But you do enough jobs half-heartedly and you quit enough jobs you just "don't like, and you'll acquire the reputation of being lazy and shiftless.

If a man can't hold down an $8/hr temp job, what makes you think he can leave and do better?

[quote=where I want to;7396895]I will go straight out and purchase a set of kneepads.

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So in the morning, please don't say ya love me.
Cause you know I'll only kick you out the door.

OK we've reached the point of silliness. The employer will offer what keeps the employee who is producing enough for him to profit in his employ. That is the nature of the two way street. If the employee does not or can not or even that there is no chance to produce this profit, than the contract ends.
What the heck are you arguing against the OP? That if he paid more, that he could keep employees better? Possibly true- not a guarantee as I have seen people walk out on large salaries with good benefits due to hubris. And possibly would make his business fail.
But that does not change that the OP offered, the employee accepted then the employee failed his part of the contract.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

[quote=bowdonkey;7396902]Don't you read? I said Gratitude is not a contracted right of an employer. That idea comes from the internal psychology of the complaining employee- maybe from the arrogance of some employers on occasion. But it is a contract to exchange services for remuneration. So expecting the employee to provide the agreed upon services is not gratitude. Sheesh. The employer is not mommy.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

This has been one of the most enjoyable, fun threads in a long while. Just the title was a train wreck waiting to happen. Starting a post like this, is just a way of starting controversy. Good fun. But having said all that, I have a son that I want to go through working for employers that you can never work fast enough, good enough or cheap enough for. Just so he knows the difference between a good employer and good job to a dead end one.

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So in the morning, please don't say ya love me.
Cause you know I'll only kick you out the door.

[quote=where I want to;7396908]I no reedso wel, now where my $8.

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So in the morning, please don't say ya love me.
Cause you know I'll only kick you out the door.

[quote=bowdonkey;7396917]Troll power!

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

I think most of us would agree that a person should give what they agree to, even at $8.00/hr.

What I see in a number of the posts is the idea that an $8/hr employee should be going way above and beyond, showing their boss that they are worth more than they're being paid. In many instances, the boss doesn't control that and often isn't making that much more themselves. There are a lot of jobs out there that just don't go anywhere beyond as in there really is no room to grow. And pushing to dazzle the boss in a job like that may make life miserable for those around them because if you come in for $8/hr and show them that you can do the work of two people, you'll still only get $8/hr and they'll expect all of the other workers to double their output for $8/hr, too.

People can rise above when they think there's a reason to. When they know there is no reward for going above and beyond, most will not. I don't consider someone a slacker because they just do what they're expected to do and no more.

Yes they KNEW up front how much they were getting paid. It was not sprung on them at the time they showed up for work. They knew how much pay they knew what the job was hard work. But it sure beats staying home getting nothing. Well to some that is staying home and getting free handouts.

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Asking an employee to show up for work is quite different than asking said employee to "work like a dog". Speaking of which.... my dog mostly lays around in the shade.... kinda like many employees will do given the opportunity.

as to 8 bucks an hour being "peanuts"... that was the highest labor rate I ever charged any customer during my self employed years as a start to finish home builder.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

If you are not getting the employee's you want for $8.00 an hour, then pay more.
As a business manager and owner I paid what I had to to get the type of help I wanted.

If I needed to raise prices to cover the labor costs I did so. (rarely happened as higher priced people are generally more productive)

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Apocalyptic and Survival Fiction - Readers and writers welcome

The post really has nothing to do with welfare. A job position that pays little goes unfilled. It's the nature of things.

As to if the fellow hired was a dead beat. Could be. In fact probably is one. But the issue is the employer. What kind of worker applies for a dead end crappy hard labor jobs? Collage bound hard working kids with weekend time to spare? No your more likely to get a low skill dim witted louse who is lazy. That's why he doesn't have better prospects.

One would expect him to fail right? Or at least you should. Especially if it happened 14 times prior.

Actually the fellow didn't show up... Maybe it was because the remuneration was so poor.

Yes it is if it was't so easy to get a free handout the the unemployed would be Happy to get 8 bucks an hour. Better then going hungry now isn't it?
Take the freebies away and they would be plenty of workers t find and hold on to said job.

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